In this episode, we talk about one exercise Jordan absolutely hates, one exercise Mike absolutely hates, some great exercise alternatives, the truth about collagen protein, and more.


We hope you enjoy this episode and if you’d like to join us in The Online Fitness Business Mentorship you can grab your seat at


Thank you!

-J & M


Check out our new book ‘Eat It!’ at

If you have any questions you’d like to have answered on the show, shoot us an email at

If you enjoyed the episode, we would sincerely appreciate it if you left a five-star review.

Join our email list & get our FREE ’30 Ways To Build A Successful Online Coaching Business’ manual:


You can download a PDF version of the transcript here


Or you can expand to find the full episode transcription below:


0:00:11.5 Mike Vacanti: Hello, Jordan.


0:00:13.3 Jordan Syatt: Man, that’s an exasperated Michael right there. [laughter]


0:00:17.9 Mike Vacanti: If only we had video.


0:00:21.4 Jordan Syatt: Hey video pods. Video pods could be coming soon.


0:00:27.2 Mike Vacanti: How are you doing?


0:00:30.5 Jordan Syatt: You are not in the mood to joke. Oh man, you are not in the mood to joke right now. 21 minutes late. My fault.


0:00:43.5 Mike Vacanti: That’s funny that that’s where your head went because that’s 0% on my mind. I don’t actually care at all. I’m 100% okay. I have nothing on the back end of this. I’m at a turning point in my life with this podcast. [laughter]


0:01:00.5 Jordan Syatt: What’s the turning point?


0:01:05.3 Mike Vacanti: I could go in one of two directions. I’m in the depths of despair. I might be at the low point in my life. Joking. Not really though, but you know, joking. And I’m either going to continue on this trajectory, to hell, or, or and I’ve said this to you once before, I’m about to hockey stick.


0:01:29.8 Jordan Syatt: So what’s driving this low point.


0:01:38.2 Mike Vacanti: Well, as you can see I’m wearing sunglasses right now.


0:01:42.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Ray-Bans, they look good.


0:01:44.8 Mike Vacanti: The reason for which… I don’t know what they are, they were a gift. They’re just something to protect my overly soft, sensitive eyes that three times in the past four days I’ve lost my vision, which we think we have attributed to like visual migraine driven by fragrances.


0:02:02.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:02:03.0 Mike Vacanti: We being you and I. Not like me and a doctor, or like some smart way to go about this, but you and I have attributed it to that.


0:02:10.1 Jordan Syatt: We’re basically doctors, if you think about it.


0:02:13.4 Mike Vacanti: And so here I am avoiding the car freshener that… The air freshener that was my wife put in the car over the weekend that we now had to get rid of and we’ll see what happens.


0:02:30.5 Jordan Syatt: Well, that’s good. And that’s led you to believe you’re either gonna go down, down, down, or you’re gonna hockey stick.


0:02:38.0 Mike Vacanti: Oh, I guess there are other things. I got my blood work back.


0:02:39.4 Jordan Syatt: Okay. How’d that? Look? Wait you got your testosterone back.


0:02:42.8 Mike Vacanti: No, so I had to that one, you need to do fasted. So I actually got blood drawn this morning for that, but I got all of my other… So I will… By next week we’ll know. But I got all my other blood work back.


0:02:53.4 Jordan Syatt: How’s does it look.


0:02:54.6 Mike Vacanti: It’s bad, Jordan.


0:03:00.0 Jordan Syatt: No, it’s not.


0:03:00.3 Mike Vacanti: It’s bad.


0:03:00.5 Jordan Syatt: What’s bad about it.


0:03:02.4 Mike Vacanti: It’s all worse than five years ago. Everything I care about is worse than five years ago.


0:03:08.5 Jordan Syatt: Like what? What’s worse?


0:03:09.5 Mike Vacanti: Triglycerides, glucose, LDL cholesterol.


0:03:14.0 Jordan Syatt: You have high cholesterol?


0:03:15.7 Mike Vacanti: Heart. Blood pressure.


0:03:17.8 Jordan Syatt: What’s your blood pressure?


0:03:20.5 Mike Vacanti: Worse than it was five years ago. I don’t like using these absolute numbers because then people, “Oh, it’s not that bad. Oh, you’re fine.” No directional, you’re either growing or you’re dying, and I am dying because shit’s getting worse over here.


0:03:35.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:03:35.6 Mike Vacanti: And I can’t…


0:03:37.4 Jordan Syatt: But is it dramatically worse?


0:03:37.5 Mike Vacanti: It depends on your definition of worse…


0:03:39.6 Jordan Syatt: ‘Cause these are two data points.


0:03:40.7 Mike Vacanti: I would say, yes.


0:03:41.5 Jordan Syatt: These are only two data point in five years. So.


0:03:44.0 Mike Vacanti: No, I have more blood pressure data points than this. And I’ll spend another 40 seconds here on the vision thing. I was literally on a phone call trying to help someone with something and I needed to be on my phone. I was looking for a parking garage in Maps and I literally couldn’t read my phone.


0:04:04.3 Jordan Syatt: That sucks. That’s awful.


0:04:08.2 Mike Vacanti: So this is a low point where we either hockey stick up or we don’t. And when I say we, I mean, you and me.


0:04:15.8 Jordan Syatt: Was your blood pressure still in the healthier range though?


0:04:17.0 Mike Vacanti: Jordan, I don’t use these current day medical, big pharma, establishment, bureaucracy, artificial ranges that are given out that have changed and morphed over time to meet the needs and expectations of an unfit society. I use different standards, and it was bad, systolic, bad, diastolic, bad, cholesterol, bad. It’s all going the wrong way, Jordan. And so this is a real turning point.


0:04:53.0 Jordan Syatt: I really wish we had video pods so everyone could see just sit white T-shirt, black Ray-Bans, AirPods in, Mike just looking 1990s right now. Bad, bad.


0:05:11.7 Mike Vacanti: It’s bad. There’s no other way. There’s no other way to go about this. So I’m gonna do some…


0:05:16.5 Jordan Syatt: What did your doctor say?


0:05:18.3 Mike Vacanti: Big, big changes. It just got uploaded to an app and what’s a general family physician going to say like…


0:05:26.1 Jordan Syatt: Bad.


0:05:26.2 Mike Vacanti: “You’re fine.” No, he’s not gonna say, bad. He’s gonna be like, “You’re better than most of the people who I see,” but that doesn’t mean good. You think this is funny?


0:05:36.0 Jordan Syatt: I think it’s hilarious. And I just wanna know what the numbers were. You’re a numbers guy.


0:05:42.9 Mike Vacanti: And you’re not. So you don’t need to know these, but they’re bad, they’re going the wrong way. Here’s what I really don’t like people, people… I just hate the, “Oh, you’re fine.” It’s like, no, wrong direction, but okay, here, let me give you an analogy.


0:06:00.6 Jordan Syatt: What was your systolic?


0:06:01.5 Mike Vacanti: Let me give a sticky one.


0:06:01.6 Jordan Syatt: Just one of those numbers.


0:06:02.5 Mike Vacanti: Let me give you a sticky one, here. What would be a… What is the bottom end of a range of systolic? Give me a number where you’d be like, “Oh, that is bad for you.”


0:06:11.2 Jordan Syatt: I would say if your systole was over 125, I’d be like, “Yeah, it’s not good.”


0:06:17.0 Mike Vacanti: Okay. Not even close. I can’t even sniff 125 from where I’m at right now. Let me give you an example.


0:06:23.0 Jordan Syatt: You are over 125.


0:06:23.1 Mike Vacanti: Jordan’s training for…


0:06:26.5 Jordan Syatt: Wait, were you over 125?


0:06:26.6 Mike Vacanti: Jordan’s training for a powerlifting meet. Okay. In the three months leading up to his meet, his deadlift gets progressively weaker, weaker, and weaker, and weaker. Is that good? Well, what’s his deadlift, it’s 480. Is it good? No, it’s getting weaker and weaker and week over week. All right. And we’ll leave it at that. We’ll see. Part two. We’ll find out the conclusion of this.


0:06:54.4 Jordan Syatt: What’s the conclusion?


0:06:56.1 Mike Vacanti: The conclusion is what… There’s a binary outcome here. It’s either going to be a more negative progress towards the X-axis and potentially below, if we’re looking at a chart, a graph. Or it’s gonna be a little something known as a hockey stick, which means bingo, which means turn it around, which means…


0:07:21.9 Jordan Syatt: Which means bingo.


0:07:24.2 Mike Vacanti: Up. Up. It’s directional progress, Jordan.


0:07:30.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, man. We need video pods, they could see which means, and then Mike points up and goes, “Bingo.” [laughter]


0:07:39.3 Mike Vacanti: Correct. Speaking of which, big shoutout to the one person who left a review mentioning the video podcast and his Instagram handle, let me…


0:07:51.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, there’s only one?


0:07:54.0 Mike Vacanti: There’s only one. My man, Aaron.


0:07:57.0 Jordan Syatt: Wait, was that in our last podcast, the one that was on Tuesday?


0:08:00.1 Mike Vacanti: Man, we said we’d mention their Instagram handle, and now I completely forgot what his Instagram handle was. It was either last week or two weeks ago. So maybe there will be more.


0:08:07.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, maybe they’re still uploading.


0:08:10.6 Mike Vacanti: But Aaron also deserves an extra shoutout because he…


0:08:13.2 Jordan Syatt: He did it early.


0:08:16.3 Mike Vacanti: He did it early and he hit two plates on his bench.


0:08:19.1 Jordan Syatt: Wow.


0:08:19.7 Mike Vacanti: For the first time in his life…


0:08:21.0 Jordan Syatt: That’s huge.


0:08:21.9 Mike Vacanti: A couple of weeks back. Yeah.


0:08:23.2 Jordan Syatt: I remember the first time hitting two plates, that was the best feeling ever.


0:08:26.7 Mike Vacanti: It is.


0:08:27.5 Jordan Syatt: Just feel like the strongest person in the world.


0:08:29.2 Mike Vacanti: It’s a real milestone. @aaronbabcock.


0:08:33.0 Jordan Syatt: Aaron Babcock.


0:08:35.0 Mike Vacanti: Shoutout to Aaron. My man.


0:08:35.1 Jordan Syatt: Congrats on the two plates. Thank you for the shout. What else, Michael? What else do we got for today?


0:08:44.6 Mike Vacanti: How are you? And how’s dad life? Give us a dad life update, real quick.


0:08:48.5 Jordan Syatt: Dad life update? Man, dad life is great. It’s funny. I swore I wasn’t gonna do the thing where I was like, “Oh, my kid is so great, dah, dah, dah.” Like before I had a kid ’cause it’s always so annoying when people do that. Especially when it’s about a baby, it’s just like, it’s a blob. But I will say… It is. She’s a little blob, like… And it’s funny, you gotta pick her up and when you pick her up, you really gotta support her head, ’cause if you don’t support her head, I wish we had video pods. Just like all over the place. There’s no strength. There’s no core. But I’m trying to get her to really… She actually just today… Before if we laid her on her back in her crib, she would lift her legs up a little bit. But she couldn’t rotate her head. And my wife was always nervous about her rotating her head. ‘Cause, let’s say she spits up while her head is straight up and down, that could be dangerous. Which, I mean, we have a screen and monitor on her, so we’d be able to hear and get it, no problem. But today for the first time she completely rotated her head on her own. Just so like it was straight up and down. My wife was like, “What the hell is that?” And she was like, “I’m gonna go in there and put her head to the side again.” So just in case, she spits up. [laughter] But…


0:10:06.9 Mike Vacanti: She’s got her dad’s neck strength…


0:10:08.5 Jordan Syatt: Oh yeah.


0:10:09.1 Mike Vacanti: Epigenetics. That you worked your whole life for to pass along to her.


0:10:11.4 Jordan Syatt: I keep making her hold her head up and I put my fingers around her neck so they can’t just fall to the side. But I’ll just hold her up and like… And my wife is like, “Be careful, be careful, be careful.” But everything’s good. And everyone that comes over… I don’t know, I haven’t been around that many babies, but I always… I thought babies would cry more, and I feel like I’m jinxing myself for the next baby or the baby after that. But she really only cries when she’s really hungry or she’s got a diaper full of poop. And as soon as that’s fixed, she doesn’t cry anymore.


0:10:44.8 Mike Vacanti: Nice.


0:10:45.9 Jordan Syatt: So it’s like, it’s maybe a couple minutes a day of crying and it’s fixed immediately. So yeah, it’s been honestly pretty easy and I’m a pro with diaper changes. I’m a pro with swaddling. I’m a pro with burping. I can get these huge burbs out of her. My wife doesn’t know how. And she’s like, my wife is like watching my burping technique ’cause I can really get these burps out of her, which is super important. Otherwise, she’ll spit up all over you mid-feeding. But yeah, everything’s good man.


0:11:15.2 Mike Vacanti: And she’s gotta keep that nutrition down.


0:11:17.9 Jordan Syatt: Oh yeah, yeah. She’s up to…


0:11:19.6 Mike Vacanti: For the gains.


0:11:20.5 Jordan Syatt: Three and a half ounces of milk, several times a day.


0:11:24.4 Mike Vacanti: Let’s go.


0:11:24.5 Jordan Syatt: Every three hours or so she’s having three and a half ounces.


0:11:26.9 Mike Vacanti: Nice. What are the macros on that?


0:11:30.7 Jordan Syatt: Man, who knows? I don’t know. Do you know the macros of breast milk?


0:11:33.0 Mike Vacanti: If you have to guess.


0:11:34.0 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know.


0:11:34.1 Mike Vacanti: No. I have no idea. But throw out a guess.


0:11:38.0 Jordan Syatt: You’re the macros guy. You have breast milk on your Mike’s Macros app?


0:11:42.7 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think we have that in the food database.


0:11:45.7 Jordan Syatt: People keep asking me if I’ve tried the breast milk. I’m like, “Why would I try the breast milk? It’s for babies?”


0:11:48.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I mean, it could be some kind of golden elixir.


0:11:51.7 Jordan Syatt: That’s what people said about the placenta and I’m not going to eat the fucking placenta. How gross… The people were like… I remember the doctors, after the placenta came out, they’re like, “Do you wanna keep the placenta?” I was like, “Absolutely not.” And they laughed. They were like, “Yeah, some people want it, but we don’t recommend it.”


0:12:05.7 Mike Vacanti: For what?


0:12:07.3 Jordan Syatt: They eat the placenta… There are people who eat their placenta. I had a client who…


0:12:12.0 Mike Vacanti: They feed it to the infant or like the mother and father eat the placenta?


0:12:15.6 Jordan Syatt: No, the mother and father. I’ll never forget this. I had a client, when I was in Boston. She froze her placenta from all of her pregnancies. And every day would take a little piece of it and she was like, “Yeah, it’s super nutritious for… ” I was like, “You’re out of your fucking mind.” [laughter]


0:12:36.8 Mike Vacanti: I mean, I would have to do a little research before…


0:12:41.2 Jordan Syatt: No.


0:12:42.8 Mike Vacanti: Like there has to be a reason…


0:12:43.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Well, and placenta is what helps feed the baby inside of the mother. So there’s a lot of like these ideas. “Oh yeah. It’s the most nutritious thing you can eat, dah, dah, dah, dah.” And so, it’s a myth. It’s a myth. I did some research on it.


0:12:58.9 Mike Vacanti: There’s still something about eating your own though that like… For example, we eat the muscle of animals and use that protein and it is beneficial to us, but we would never eat our own muscle.


0:13:13.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Especially after watching it come out of your wife.


0:13:17.4 Mike Vacanti: Right.


0:13:17.4 Jordan Syatt: I watched them take it out and I was like, no, no, I don’t know. Absolutely not and they laughed. All the nurses were like, “Yeah, some people want it, but we don’t recommend it.” I was like, “Yeah, I think you shouldn’t even make it an option. Just take it.”


0:13:30.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, the fact that… That’s what had me confused is that they offered it.


0:13:34.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:13:35.0 Mike Vacanti: It seems like a somewhat standard practice.


0:13:37.7 Jordan Syatt: They offered for me to cut the umbilical cord, which I gladly did. That was cool. Cut the umbilical, very symbolic, but I’m not eating the placenta. That’s… Yeah, you don’t wanna see that come out of your wife and then eat it. No, no.


0:13:52.2 Mike Vacanti: All right, so I’m gonna guess in an ounce of breast milk, something like 3 to 4 grams of protein and 12 to 15 fat, I would imagine somehow like that.


0:14:04.5 Jordan Syatt: Wow. Okay, do you want me to Google it?


0:14:07.5 Mike Vacanti: With minimal carbs. Sure.


0:14:11.4 Jordan Syatt: Macros of… I feel like Jamie on Rogan. All right so.


0:14:14.1 Mike Vacanti: I trust myself more than whatever you’re looking at on Google, by the way.


0:14:22.1 Jordan Syatt: Okay, 65 calories, 6.7 grams carbs, primarily lactose, 3.8 grams fat, 1.3 grams protein. You disagree. Mike’s Macros…


0:14:35.8 Mike Vacanti: That might be from a vegan mother. Let’s… We’ll run some studies, that high-carb, low-protein breast milk. Interesting.


0:14:48.3 Jordan Syatt: Wow. One of the… Oh, my God. I’m looking at the common Google searches in relation to this, macros of breast milk in one ounce, and one of the common Google searches is, why do bodybuilders drink breast milk? I swear.


0:15:10.7 Mike Vacanti: And when I was in high school and everyone was drinking Muscle Milk, we had someone who was drinking… Or was talking about a protein powder called Mother’s Milk. It was like some spinoff of Muscle Milk, and it was supposed to mimic the beneficial aspects of breast milk.


0:15:29.2 Jordan Syatt: People are crazy, man. Mother’s…


0:15:32.7 Mike Vacanti: People are crazy.


0:15:39.5 Jordan Syatt: What else, Michael?


0:15:41.3 Mike Vacanti: Do you drink the tap water from your apartment?


0:15:44.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, I do. We just got a Brita that we’ve been using, but, yeah, I’ve had no issues with tap water. I’m not as big of a conspiracy theorist as many out there, and I don’t know. I think it’s probably okay. I can taste a big difference though. The tap water here tastes completely different than the tap water in New York.


0:16:10.8 Mike Vacanti: Better or worse?


0:16:11.0 Jordan Syatt: Way better here. The tap water in New York tasted awful, whereas the tap water here is actually… It’s much more fresh and clean and doesn’t have a weird smell to it.


0:16:20.4 Mike Vacanti: Interesting.


0:16:22.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:16:24.6 Mike Vacanti: Cool.


0:16:24.9 Jordan Syatt: What about you? You have a filter, right?


0:16:28.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, the fridge just has a filter in it, although growing up, we always drank the tap water, but supposedly the… I don’t know if it was our city’s water was really good. I feel like a lot of cities say that. My mom would be like, “Yeah, our city has the best water.” It’s like, yeah, okay. Great.


0:16:43.6 Jordan Syatt: Does the Minnesota license plate have a deer on it?


0:16:49.0 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know.


0:16:51.9 Jordan Syatt: You don’t know? Don’t you have a Minnesota license plate?


0:16:54.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but I can’t… I don’t think so. There’s maybe a version of it that has some wildlife on it ’cause the standard plate is blue, but there’s a version of it that’s yellow, like tinted yellow, but that’s… I don’t know, one in 500 or like…


0:17:09.9 Jordan Syatt: Got it, okay.


0:17:10.8 Mike Vacanti: Not many of them, yeah.


0:17:12.1 Jordan Syatt: I could have swore I saw some Minnesota plate with a big old buck on it the other day, and I was like, “Oh man, that’s cool.”


0:17:17.8 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think so. “Minnesota license plate.”


0:17:24.2 Jordan Syatt: You’re googling that license plate?


0:17:24.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. No, it’s got a couple of trees in the upper right-hand corner and it says “10,000 lakes” on it, but there are… Yeah, there are versions of it that do.


0:17:40.7 Jordan Syatt: Man, there’s one with a moose. Here is it. I found it, I found it. I found the one I was looking at the other day, “critical habitat.”


0:17:50.6 Mike Vacanti: You wanna fire up some questions?


0:17:52.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I’ll fire them up. Someone said, “What is your opinion when people say sumo deadlifting is cheating?”


0:18:05.5 Mike Vacanti: I would love to hear your response to that.


0:18:08.6 Jordan Syatt: You wanna hear mine? Do you wanna give your opinion first or no?


0:18:11.5 Mike Vacanti: I would just say, who cares is my opinion.


0:18:13.3 Jordan Syatt: Okay.


0:18:15.1 Mike Vacanti: Like cheating at what? That’s like people who say… I’m trying to think of a good analogy. If something like performance-enhancing drugs are illegal for a… Or not illegal, but if they’re against the rules of a sport and you take them for the sport and play that sport, that’s cheating, but if you just take them in life, is that cheating? Well, no. What are you cheating at?


0:18:41.9 Jordan Syatt: Right, yeah, it’s like…


0:18:42.4 Mike Vacanti: Sumo vs conventional deadlift, it’s like, who cares? In like what “competition” to see who can lift the most weight off the floor?


0:18:52.7 Jordan Syatt: People ask, “Is it cheating?” And I think what they mean is, is it easier, right? The people say sumo deadlift is cheating. First and foremost, I know people who can conventional deadlift way more they can sumo deadlift, right? It’s really more about whichever one is easier for you and based on what you prefer in your anthropometry and all of that, but the… I’ll tell you the quickest and easiest way to shut anyone up who says sumo deadlift is cheating. So we have to look at why they say that. They say that because you have a wider stance and that wider stance allows for a shorter range of motion which theoretically, not realistically, but theoretically allows you to lift more. For some people it does, for some people it doesn’t. It’s more based on how your hips and torso are built as opposed to anything else. But these same people who says sumo deadlift is cheating will often get a wider grip on their bench press. So I’ll say, “Well, is a wide grip bench press cheating?” And they’ll say, “No” and I’ll say, “Why not?” Like, “Well, it lets me bench press more comfortably and so I can lift more.” It’s like, well, that’s what a sumo deadlift is. You have a wider stance, so it’s more comfortable so you can lift more.


0:20:05.0 Jordan Syatt: If sumo deadlift is cheating then bench pressing with a wider than shoulder width grip is cheating. Same exact, exact thing. So if you agree that you should take your… That if you take your grip out wider than shoulder width for a bench press, then it’s no problem to take your stance out wider in a sumo deadlift. It’s the exact same thing. So if you ever get in an argument with someone about that, just ask them about bench pressing, and if they’re bench pressing wider than shoulder grip width which basically everybody does, then it’s… Then they’re caught in a difficult to overcome debate with that one. But yeah, in terms of sumo deadlifting, I think people should do both, but there’s one that you’re probably gonna find more comfortable. For me, I’ve always found sumo more comfortable. It doesn’t hurt my back. It’s much easier on my back. I’ll do conventional Romanian deadlifts, but I almost never do conventional deadlifts from the floor just ’cause it always bothered my back. So why am I gonna keep doing that? There’s no reason to work through pain. You can work around pain. So I will get the benefits of conventional stance deadlifting from the Romanian deadlift which won’t hurt my back ’cause I’m not going all the way to the floor. But then I’ll do the sumo variation from the floor.


0:21:21.9 Mike Vacanti: Are the people who say that it’s cheating… Are there still people that say that and are serious and are upset about it?


0:21:29.2 Jordan Syatt: Oh, yeah.


0:21:30.8 Mike Vacanti: What is wrong with those individuals? ‘Cause I see people as a joke, like, “Oh, didn’t count, cheating sumo” in a comment.


0:21:40.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah.


0:21:40.6 Mike Vacanti: But people who actually think that and care, where’s that coming from?


0:21:45.3 Jordan Syatt: Dude, it’s so funny. That’s something that I used to really care about when I was younger and just getting in the fitness industry and I think it’s more about… ‘Cause I wonder the same thing now about… I’m gonna give you an example. I don’t really care that much when people say, “Fruit makes you fat.” I don’t really get that, I don’t care because I know the truth. It doesn’t bother me. It used to bother me, but I’m not really… I’m more just, “Ugh, whatever. Does… I don’t care anymore.” Right? And I think that’s just from years and years and years. I don’t care about Keto and Carnivore and all those people. I don’t care. I don’t care. I think it’s just… But when I was younger I did and I used to get into heated arguments and debates and stay up all night debating people about it, but now I just don’t care.


0:22:35.3 Jordan Syatt: I think it’s people who are newer and fresher to the industry and they think that their way is the right way, and it’s the only way and they wanna show everyone that they’re smart and they know what they’re talking about. But when I go on my social media and I’m like, “Motherfuckers talking about fruit making you fat.” That’s manufactured passion. It is. That’s not me sitting at home being like, “God, damn it, another person talking about… ” I don’t get anger. I’m more just like, “Yeah. All right, time to make content.” And I’ll manufacture that just because I know it’s gonna be more interesting and fun for the viewer and that’s how I used to be, but it’s not how I am anymore. I really think it’s just people who are new and really upset about it. Or like, I don’t know. Maybe Layne Norton is a good example of someone who would maybe just always be really fired up about this stuff. Or maybe he’s just trolling everybody and he really doesn’t give a shit and he’s just making great content, but I’m just not that angry of a… I used to have real anger. I used to be angry about it, but now I’m more just like, “Whatever.” It doesn’t bother me if you believe it or not. You know what I mean?


0:23:41.8 Mike Vacanti: There are other things that took its place in terms of what you care about enough to get… Yeah.


0:23:49.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:23:50.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s actually an interesting subtopic in and of itself is manufacturing anger for a better content.


0:23:56.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:23:57.6 Mike Vacanti: But even in that example, the statement, “Fruit makes you fat,” is a more important statement than, “Sumo is cheating.”


0:24:06.3 Jordan Syatt: Correct. Agree.


0:24:07.7 Mike Vacanti: Because if it’s true, if fruit does make you fat or if fruit doesn’t make you fat, the correct answer is very important for all of us. The fact that eating fruit in and of itself around maintenance on a deficit is not going to lead to fat gain because fructose liver, blah, blah, blah. The fact that, that isn’t true, affects our lives in the way we get to eat, in the way we enjoy fruit. Whereas sumo is cheating is almost… It’s like… I don’t know. It’s so silly, but I guess I never competitively power lift and sumo deadlifted and so maybe there was more… You have more skin in the game in that troll comment.


0:24:47.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Obviously ’cause I deadlifted four times of my body weight with a sumo deadlift. So people basically, “Oh, well you’re cheating, you’re cheating.” It’s like, “All right, well how about you try and do it sumo. Let’s see how it goes.”




0:25:04.6 Jordan Syatt: It doesn’t make sense. So it’s sort of saying… It’s like saying someone who’s wearing cleats to run faster is cheating. It’s like, “No, everyone’s wearing cleats. Cleats are allowed, if cleats weren’t allowed, then it would be cheating.” But it’s like, you’re wearing shoes with spikes on them to help dig in deeper to the ground to help you run faster, but that’s part of the sport.


0:25:26.1 Mike Vacanti: Or even like, “Oh, you’re taking too big of strides and it’s helping you run faster.”


0:25:31.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, that’s a better on.


0:25:31.8 Mike Vacanti: You need to take smaller strides, otherwise it’s cheating.




0:25:37.1 Jordan Syatt: Decrease your stride length. That stride length is way too long. Exactly. Yeah.


0:25:43.1 Mike Vacanti: Well, and aren’t all of the world record holders for heaviest deadlift, conventional?


0:25:49.1 Jordan Syatt: Not all of them, but…


0:25:52.2 Mike Vacanti: The heaviest deadlift ever is conventional.


0:25:53.6 Jordan Syatt: Conventional. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes.


0:25:55.1 Mike Vacanti: And I thought the top three pulls were. I could be wrong on that.


0:25:58.2 Jordan Syatt: They might be. They might be.


0:26:00.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:26:00.7 Jordan Syatt: I think actually if we look at absolute weight, it’s conventional, but if we look at relatives’ weight, it’s almost always sumo, which is interesting.


0:26:11.1 Mike Vacanti: Okay.


0:26:12.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. But I think absolute is conventional.


0:26:18.4 Mike Vacanti: That was a good one.


0:26:20.6 Jordan Syatt: All right, Michael, alternatives for barbell hip thrusts if the bar hurts your hips or lower belly.


0:26:28.1 Mike Vacanti: So if a client sent this to me, the first thing I would do is try to make sure they’re doing everything possible to be able to do the barbell hip thrust without pain. And oftentimes that just means more padding, right? So sometimes someone will do a barbell hip thrust with just the bar across their hips. And it’s like, “All right, well, let’s get an Airex pad under there. Let’s fold up a mat a few times and get that under there. That will often lead to less pain.” If someone is essentially doing everything to protect themselves and is still in pain, yeah, it kinda depends. It depends on the client for me. If I think someone’s just being soft and this is probably rare, this is like a one in 10, whereas the nine in 10 I’m gonna find them an alternative. But the one in 10, I’ll be like, “Hey, yeah, this is a little uncomfortable. Go get it. In fact, those look really good. I think you can add another 10 to each side and do the same sets and reps and send me another video. Let’s get after it. This is life, pal. Come on.” Whereas, with a lot of people, I’ll just give them any other hip hinging movement pattern.


0:27:54.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:27:56.3 Mike Vacanti: We could list a million like a single-leg hip thrust that body weight alone and if body weight is easy, increase the reps, give them one and a halfs, adjust the tempo down to make it difficult. If they can still do 15 per leg with a 90-second rest with one and a halfs with amazing technique and they have a lot left in the tank. I’ve actually found you can load a single-leg pretty easily because it doesn’t require as much weight. You can load it with a dumbbell rather than a barbell and you kind of center it above the working leg. So the dumbbell is kinda resting on the hip, on the working leg rather than being centered over your junk, it’s off to the side. And 15, 20, 25 pounds isn’t enough weight to cause pain in that region, but is enough to load the movement to get enough intensity for it to be a beneficial movement. But again, like I said, what’s a good alternative like any other hinging pattern.


0:29:00.6 Jordan Syatt: Any hinging pattern. It doesn’t even have to be on the ground. It could be an RDL. It could be a 45-degree back extension. Could be a back extension on a glute-ham raise. I’m gonna say something that I didn’t expect to say, but I’m gonna say it. I think barbell hip thrust are super fucking overrated. I really do. I really do. I think they’re super overrated. I think they’re unbelievably uncomfortable. They take a long time to set up. It’s like you could do… And listen, I’m not saying they’re bad exercise, but I think they’re really overrated. I think that they have a time and a place, but I only give them to people if they explicitly ask for it. I will not give it to someone if I do not know they want to do it because that move is so annoying to set up and it’s very uncomfortable. And I think for most people, you could find an equally good if not better exercise. The only times I’ve put it in the Inner Circle, in the Inner Circle workouts is when I’ve had a significant number of people ask me for it. And whenever I do put it in the Inner Circle, I always say, “You could do barbell hip thrust or something else.”


0:30:17.8 Jordan Syatt: And I give them an option to do something else because I know a lot of people are gonna see barbell hip thrust and try and set it up and then they’d be like, “This is fucking annoying.” If you have someone who has a lot of weight to lose and you try giving them a barbell hip thrust, say goodbye to that client. They’re not gonna be comfortable. They’re gonna be super embarrassed. They’re not gonna do it. It’s like…


0:30:38.4 Mike Vacanti: Well, they also have to be able to barbell hip thrust. So it’s not a complete beginner movement because if they’re not doing a 135 pounds and they don’t have you with them in the gym or they are done with the training partner, they can’t get the weight on them.


0:30:52.0 Jordan Syatt: Exactly.


0:30:52.8 Mike Vacanti: You need the higher bar from the 45s to roll over themselves to get in position. What if someone… What if an intermediate girl whose one of her main goals was to grow her glutes? You’re not gonna program?


0:31:02.8 Jordan Syatt: No. I will. If it’s an intermediate girl, who’s comfortable and confident in the gym, yes, I will absolutely have them do that. Yes, for sure. But that’s like if it’s intermediate to advanced person who feels comfortable, confident in the gym, they have a low enough body fat to where it’s not gonna be super uncomfortable or anything like that, I’ll have them do it. But also, it’s a much more… It’s a better exercise for aesthetics than it is for performance or for life in general. I’m not having my clients lie down on the floor for most of their workouts even if it’s a great exercise for glutes. I don’t want you lying on the floor for this long in the fucking workout. I want you moving. I want you to be doing something that’s gonna help with your balance. Doing something that’s gonna help with your core strength. This is just a purely glute exercise which I’m not the aesthetics guy, I get it. I’m not the bodybuilding guy, I get it. I’m more of a performance and a functional workout guy, whatever you wanna call it. But man, I just see people taking 24 minutes to set up and do their barbell hip thrust I’m like, “What the fuck is this part of your work?” Do something else other than just… What is going on?”


0:32:21.5 Mike Vacanti: I’m confused on the setup part. Why does the setup take longer or shorter than a deadlift?


0:32:25.9 Jordan Syatt: Well, number one is ’cause with the deadlift you just stand over the top of it and you pick it up. With the barbell hip thrust your glute bridge, you gotta get underneath it and make sure your shoulders are all lined up on the box or the bench or whatever. It’s less getting underneath it and making sure… Literally, this question was like it’s really uncomfortable in my hips and my whatever. Sometimes people are futzing around with it, trying to match up, trying to find the pad, the right pad to use with it. It’s like it’s a whole extra step. Whereas with the deadlift, you stand over, pick it up, put it down, done. Also, most people can barbell hip thrust more than they can deadlift. A lot of people I know who can deadlift 185, 225, they’re barbell hip thrusting 385, 405. So they have to put on way more weight which takes significantly more time and more energy. It’s like, man, I would just rather have you do RDLs. Even though I understand it’s a different force vector, it’s not anteroposterior I get it. I understand that. It’s a different force vector, fine. But still, same benefits. Some of the people who have built the best physiques in the world have not done barbell hip thrust. But let’s say you have someone who has knee issues. Someone who’s got real knee problems and they can’t do squats or maybe they got a back issue and they can’t do Romanian deadlifts. Yeah, hip thrust. Awesome idea.


0:33:40.9 Jordan Syatt: But I would… It’s funny, you were talking about loading up the single-leg dead… Single-leg hip thrust, I can count on two hands how many people that I know who can really do very good loaded single-leg hip thrust. The vast majority of people cannot do them very well, just body weight. It’s difficult enough for sets of eight to 15 per leg body weight. And maybe that was an under-exaggeration in terms of counting on two hands. I’m sure I know more people than that, but it’s most people, especially beginner to intermediates, you get plenty of loading with a single leg body weight. And if you want to add body weight, do a dumbbell like you said, you could put a sandbag on top of you, sandbag’s a very comfortable loading option.


0:34:22.2 Mike Vacanti: More comfortable.


0:34:24.8 Jordan Syatt: But yeah, I think the single-leg hip thrust… I use the single-leg hip thrust in almost every workout. I love the single-leg hip thrust and different variations of it, but the barbell hip trust, it’s just… I’m annoyed by it man, just pisses me off. Fucking angry. And that’s not manufactured either. That’s real. That’s real anger.


0:34:42.4 Mike Vacanti: What do you say to someone who… Let’s not say it’s the barbell hip thrust, let’s say it’s the single-leg RDL.


0:34:52.0 Jordan Syatt: Okay.


0:34:53.2 Mike Vacanti: And so read the question again.


0:34:57.3 Jordan Syatt: Alternatives for barbell hip thrusts if the bar hurts your hips or lower belly.


0:35:00.9 Mike Vacanti: Alternative for single-leg RDL. I feel like my balance is wobbly and it’s an awkward move and this client has… Let’s say they started a month and a half ago, and every week there’s been a different exercise that’s like, “I don’t really like this move. Could I have a substitute for this move?” What do you say?


0:35:22.7 Jordan Syatt: Split stance RDL. Both feet are on the ground.


0:35:25.6 Mike Vacanti: Okay. That one has like this…


0:35:30.6 Jordan Syatt: That one was easy. That one was too easy.


0:35:30.7 Mike Vacanti: Weird in my… No, no, no. And then they do it. And they’re like, “My low back feels a little weird with that. Is there anything else I can do?”


0:35:36.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Shut up.




0:35:38.3 Jordan Syatt: If they’re complaining about every movement, then it’s a problem, but barbell hip thrusts, that’s a real fucking movement. I get the complaint because I hate doing it. I hate setting up for it. I hate… It’s annoying to me.


0:35:52.0 Mike Vacanti: Do you think that might have something to do with it?


0:35:52.9 Jordan Syatt: Of course, I’m massively biased. Absolutely.


0:35:56.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.




0:35:57.3 Jordan Syatt: But absolutely, but it’s just annoying to me. And I can’t… If I’ve eaten before, no way. No way. It’s like it’s pressing against my stomach or my hips. No, it’s uncomfortable. It takes too long. I think I don’t like spending a super long time in the gym. And that exercise makes me spend a super long time in the gym. I just… It’s annoying to me.


0:36:19.6 Mike Vacanti: All right.


0:36:23.7 Jordan Syatt: But you know what? The… I don’t go to this gym anymore. There’s a gym called Cowboys Fit near my apartment. And they have a hip thrust machine which it’s all set up. It’s like you slide the plates on. And then, you strap yourself in and you’re good to go. There’s no uncomfortable-ness. There’s no having to get on the ground. It’s super fast and easy. I love the machine version of it.


0:36:45.0 Mike Vacanti: It’s a seatbelt?


0:36:46.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s a seat belt. That is awesome.


0:36:49.1 Mike Vacanti: Don’t you have the same load across your hips?


0:36:52.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, same load. It’s just the set-up is way easier, way easier.


0:36:53.4 Mike Vacanti: Easier. The convenience. I see.


0:36:56.2 Jordan Syatt: Way easier. And because it’s a seat belt, it’s not a localized barbell on… And it doesn’t roll. It doesn’t roll forward or backwards. It’s like just a strap that goes across your hips. Way more comfortable. That I could get behind. Literally, it was a fraction of the time that I spent on a barbell hip thrust. It was way better. Way more comfortable.


0:37:16.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. We all have moves we won’t do and won’t program.


0:37:19.9 Jordan Syatt: Are you a barbell hip thrust guy? I don’t think I’ve ever seen you barbell hip thrust.


0:37:26.9 Mike Vacanti: No, not for myself. I’m neutral on it though. I’m not like… I feel about the Turkish Get-Up the way you feel about the barbell hip thrust.


0:37:34.7 Jordan Syatt: Got it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that makes sense. Talk to me about the Turkish Get-Up.


0:37:39.1 Mike Vacanti: Well, I’m just never gonna program a movement that does absolutely nothing beneficial, except make you a better waiter. There’s nothing else going on. There’s… It’s pure isometric. You’re not going through any range. You’re just sitting like this. It’s awkward. It’s complicated. It’s convoluted. There’s no aesthetic component. It’s… I can think of few greater wastes of time in life than the Turkish Get-Up. And that includes things like internet porn. And like anything.


0:38:13.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. I like the Turkish Get-Up.


0:38:20.1 Mike Vacanti: Next question. Next question.


0:38:20.2 Jordan Syatt: But I wouldn’t… I never program… I’ve programmed the barbell hip thrust in the Inner Circle more than I’ve programed the Turkish Get-Up. And I like the Turkish Get-Up, for me personally, but I know like, yeah, I’m not programming that in an online program for people who don’t… Absolutely not. That’s stupid. No way, but if I was working in person with someone who… I’ll tell you this, if I was… All right, I’ll give you a scenario. You’ve got a 50…


0:38:46.2 Mike Vacanti: Sure. I’ll program it this one time.




0:38:49.7 Jordan Syatt: 57 year old man. All right. He’s got… He’s got a lot of issues with movement and mobility. And he can’t do much weight-bearing or load-bearing stuff. And you just wanna better prepare him to be able to get up if he’s fallen down, or if he’s on the ground with his grand kid, whatever it is, maybe not even the whole Turkish Get-Up, but the first half.


0:39:19.1 Mike Vacanti: But that’s… That’s something I don’t like about it. It’s how… It’s similar to the reason that I don’t like a squat curl and shoulder press in one movement. It’s like let’s break these up into their individual components and train them. We don’t need to train them all in one. And I’m probably biased because it was in a program that I was forced to do when I was working in person. I was forced to use it with clients. And I didn’t.


0:39:41.8 Jordan Syatt: Curls.




0:39:43.2 Mike Vacanti: I had them curling instead.


0:39:46.7 Jordan Syatt: Huh. All right. So, is a… All right. We’re just gonna do curls.




0:39:49.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Biceps? Cool.


0:39:52.1 Jordan Syatt: Cool.


0:39:54.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I understand it’s functional utility in a situation like that, but I would rather just break down the individual components and do something similar.


0:40:05.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I also like it for young athletes, for like middle school and high school athletes, probably not college level, but as a warm-up, using it as a warm-up in a middle school, high school setting is really good. ‘Cause have you ever worked with young kids, for…


0:40:26.9 Mike Vacanti: High schoolers. Yeah.


0:40:29.0 Jordan Syatt: Man, it’s… I know high schoolers, they’re a little bit better by the time… Freshman, sophomore year, is still pretty bad. But some of their coordination is just crazy bad, it’s just like they’re baby deer and they’re all over the place. And I found that that’s been a good warm-up exercise, just to get them a little bit more primed and ready to move better. I would not use this in a general population setting unless… Same as the barbell hip thrust someone said, “Hey, I want to do that.” ‘Cause I have had some people say, “Hey, I’ve seen this online. I wanna go to the Turkish Get-Up.” And I’m like, “Okay, so we’ll work on that.”


0:41:12.9 Mike Vacanti: Who said that?


0:41:14.1 Jordan Syatt: People who get caught up in the kettlebell world, they’re like, Oh yeah, all right. ‘Cause it is like a cool feat of strength to be able to lift 100 pounds over your head and be able to do that, it’s cool and it’s super strong, but yeah, I’m not gonna have a group of gen-pop people, that’s… I’ve literally never once programmed it in the inner circle, not once, out of since December 2015 when I started it, have not programmed it one time, and I won’t.


0:41:41.7 Mike Vacanti: I can compromise on your usage for the 10 to 15-year-old in their warm-up population. That makes sense to me.


0:41:50.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, that 57-year-old guy, the first half, the Turkish Get-Up. He doesn’t need to stand up with his arm over his head, but just the first half is good.


0:41:58.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I’m gonna have him curling and doing other things.


0:42:03.1 Jordan Syatt: But on on that note, I would like to have that guy doing curls, bilateral, same time, not even… Like a really good core strength there, good control. I would love having him doing curl… I think curls are underrated, not just for aesthetics, but for actually… I think curls can be an amazing, amazing exercise for overall stabilization, they can actually help with shoulder health as well, if you do them properly. There’s a lot that you could use curls for.


0:42:32.3 Mike Vacanti: Right, you’re preaching.


0:42:37.1 Jordan Syatt: All right, let’s see.


0:42:39.8 Mike Vacanti: You ever go camping? Or when was the last time you went camping?


0:42:44.5 Jordan Syatt: I have gone camping… Trying to think of the last time I went camping. Man, the last real camping out in the wilderness?


0:42:54.1 Mike Vacanti: Mm-hmm.


0:42:55.2 Jordan Syatt: The last time I went real camping out in the wilderness, I think I was probably like 22, and I was leading a… Is when I was in Israel, and I was a tour guide in Israel for a group of 16-year-olds, about 43 16-year-old kids, and I went camping with them several times, one time out in the desert, one time we went on a three-day hike and we would camp outside in there, so I would… That’s probably the last time I went legit camping. When’s the last time you went camping?


0:43:27.0 Mike Vacanti: I can’t even remember. I can’t even remember, but when I had lost my vision and I was trying to look at my phone and I couldn’t, I just thought to myself, I’m probably looking at screens way too much and could really use 48 hours in the wilderness with no technology.


0:43:43.7 Jordan Syatt: Dude it’s fun. I enjoyed it. One of my favorite parts of camping is like when you get out the bunsen burner, and you’ve got your food, and you make some food that if you had that food in your house, you’d probably be like, What is this? But out in the wilderness, it tastes so good and it’s just like, Oh, this is amazing, and you’re…


0:44:02.6 Mike Vacanti: Baked beans.


0:44:04.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, baked beans and oatmeal and all that, it’s just like… It’s good stuff and it’s fun to be out there. It sucks if it starts to rain, that’s not fun. As long as the weather is good, I love it, but as soon as the weather gets bad or… I think the worst part is when a mosquito is.




0:44:26.7 Jordan Syatt: In your ear, when you’re trying to sleep and you’re slapping it, and you keep slapping yourself, but… So I’m not the most wildernessy guy but I do like doing that occasionally, and I would like to do it again.


0:44:38.8 Mike Vacanti: I might start camping once a year.


0:44:41.2 Jordan Syatt: By yourself?


0:44:42.8 Mike Vacanti: No.


0:44:43.7 Jordan Syatt: Okay, good. Yeah, don’t do it by yourself.


0:44:46.2 Mike Vacanti: You’re invited.


0:44:47.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, cool. All right, let’s go. I would love that, I would love that.


0:44:51.3 Mike Vacanti: Could you go, no technology.


0:44:54.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, you kidding me? Absolutely.


0:44:56.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah?


0:44:56.4 Jordan Syatt: Dude, absolutely. I’ll just leave my phone. The issues… If my…


0:45:04.2 Mike Vacanti: That’s the point.


0:45:07.1 Jordan Syatt: The issue that I have is if my phone is in sight, if my phone’s in sight, then I’m like, Oh man, it’s hard for me not to. But if my phone’s not there, I’m good. I’m totally fine, yeah. It’s great, and it’s actually… That’s been one of the cool things about being a dad, I’ll just hold my daughter for hours and not look at my phone ’cause I’m holding my daughter. So it’s great, yeah. But due to of course, we go camping, leave our phones. Well, I mean you should have your phone in case of emergency, I would leave my phone though. We shouldn’t go phoneless.


0:45:41.3 Mike Vacanti: Why would I have my phone in case for emergency, but… So we have one phone you’re saying.


0:45:45.3 Jordan Syatt: Yes, so there’s one phone with us.


0:45:46.4 Mike Vacanti: I see, I see, I see. Because I could have the impulse control to have my phone and not use it, but you wouldn’t.


0:45:54.4 Jordan Syatt: Correct.


0:45:54.6 Mike Vacanti: I understand.


0:45:56.7 Jordan Syatt: Or yeah, I don’t even want the option, I don’t even wanna think about it, whereas if it’s not there, cool, no worries.


0:46:02.5 Mike Vacanti: Phone for emergency, that’s a good idea, okay.


0:46:05.2 Jordan Syatt: Where do you wanna go camping?


0:46:09.9 Mike Vacanti: Wyoming.


0:46:11.0 Jordan Syatt: Nice. I like that. Bears, the wildlife, wolves.


0:46:17.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Are we really camping if our lives aren’t in danger a little bit?


0:46:22.1 Jordan Syatt: Man, that’s what happened in Israel. We were in the North, we’re camping and I’ll never forget this. All of a sudden I heard… ‘Cause it was me, three other counselors, tour guides and like 43 16-year-olds and all of a sudden I hear these girls started screaming at like 2:00 in the morning. And I’m like, “Oh, goddamn it. The girls are just doing whatever again.” And I see a bunch of huge, gargantuan wild boars sniffing around these… And wild boars when they get angry, they’re dangerous. They go nuts. Huge dude. These were like fucking horses. They were massive. And they had told us before, they’re like, “Hey, just so you know we have some wild boars out here.” They prepped us for them. And I was like, “Okay, we’re probably not gonna see them.” Oh… And they were freaking out. And then all the Israelis where there like, “Relax, relax. Don’t say anything. Don’t scream. You’ll piss them off. Just sit there.” They’re just trying to tell them to just lay down, be very still. And I was like, “What do we do?” They’re like, “Don’t do anything.” If you try and get them away, they’re gonna start attacking so we just literally sat there and watch these boars were just sniffing all around these young kids’ tents and around their sleeping bags outside. Yeah, it gets scary.


0:47:41.1 Mike Vacanti: Wow… Maybe we’ll pick a safer location.


0:47:44.4 Jordan Syatt: And I think even if you got a 9mm, I don’t think that wouldn’t put a boar down. A 9mm handgun. No, you’d have to have a real powerful gun with you to put one of those things down. They’d probably just get angry by a 9mm. It’d be like, if they got a little scratch they’d be like, “What is this? All right, now you’re done.”


0:48:05.8 Mike Vacanti: We’ll set up some kinda wilderness excursion. We’ll do a little research first. Little planning.


0:48:09.0 Jordan Syatt: Okay. Cool.


0:48:11.8 Mike Vacanti: What do you got there for the next question?


0:48:14.6 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know if you’re gonna know this one, but I’m interested in your thoughts. Someone asked, “Do you count collagen towards your protein? If yes, why or why not?”


0:48:23.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I do. And I see people not counting it. It’s a super low quality amino acid essentially. So remember the big debate on complete proteins and BCAAs and the resolution of all this. And this 2006 to 2012 window was essentially if you’re getting enough total protein and you’re eating a reasonably balanced diet, then you’re getting enough essential amino acids, you’re getting enough of the “better amino acids”. I’m trying to think of an example of a food with a relatively poor amino acid profile. But when you eat that food, you still count the protein when you’re tracking because you’ll also have… You also had two eggs that day. You also had some whey protein that day. You also have better, higher quality protein as part of your total daily protein intake. If someone’s having collagen protein for the potential skin, nail, hair health benefits or I believe it’s undenatured type II collagen protein. There actually is some research showing that that’s gonna help with joints, basically tendons, ligaments, feeling better, potentially providing… I don’t know if it’s strength but leading to better joint health we’ll just leave it at that. If you’re taking 10 grams, 15 grams of collagen daily for that purpose and 10 out of your 150 are coming from that collagen, I don’t understand the logic of not counting that 10 because it’s a “poor quality protein”.


0:50:18.2 Mike Vacanti: I think the same thing about glycine. Glycine is shit as far as amino acids go. Glycine isn’t doing anything to help you build muscle. But if I’m having 5 grams of glycine a day and I’m hitting 170 grams of protein, I’m not gonna not count the glycine because it’s a lower quality protein.


0:50:37.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Makes total sense. That’s a great explanation. I love that.


0:50:42.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:50:42.1 Jordan Syatt: I love that. I get that question all the time so I think that’s gonna be super helpful for people.


0:50:47.0 Mike Vacanti: And I saw a couple, I don’t remember the names I just remember thinking like, this person is pretty smart and then saying, “Don’t count your collagen.” And I was like, but there wasn’t any reasoning behind it. It was like a short… I don’t remember if it was a story or what it was maybe three months ago. And I was like, “That doesn’t make any sense to me.”


0:51:04.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah. Honestly, I didn’t know. I wasn’t sure where to go with that, so I’m glad that you painted that picture.


0:51:12.6 Mike Vacanti: I think there may be people who… Because a lot of these collagen proteins go down easier. The mixability is super good and they’re marketed so hard in the health and beauty sections of stores. I can think of a handful or three maybe examples of women who were taking it to hit their protein target and had an 80 to 100 gram of protein target for the day and were getting 40 or 50 of that from collagen. Don’t do that. That’s not a good idea. But if it’s a fraction of your total intake, if it’s a small percentage, it’d be the same as not counting the protein in broccoli because it doesn’t have leucine in it. Like now, you still get…


0:51:58.5 Jordan Syatt: Or the protein in rice or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, got it.


0:52:01.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, exactly, exactly.


0:52:02.8 Jordan Syatt: That makes sense. Sick bro.


0:52:06.9 Mike Vacanti: Good one.


0:52:08.5 Jordan Syatt: How are your eyes doing now?


0:52:09.8 Mike Vacanti: They feel good. I haven’t been… I threw the air fresheners away. I haven’t been in the car in three, four hours and they’ve been getting better and better. Got the windows cracked airing it out. I really hope that’s what it is.


0:52:21.2 Jordan Syatt: I think that’s probably what it is. Based on my medical expertise.


0:52:28.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, we’ll see. We’ll have an update next week. We also may have my testosterone levels next week.


0:52:32.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, I cannot wait to see that.


0:52:35.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, me too.


0:52:36.5 Jordan Syatt: What was your blood pressure?


0:52:39.4 Mike Vacanti: Bad, Jord. I don’t know how hard I need to harp on this without giving exact numbers because maybe…


0:52:46.6 Jordan Syatt: Was it over 125, your systole?


0:52:49.3 Mike Vacanti: Here’s what I’m gonna say. When we look back on the story of my life someday and for the pod listeners who were privy to these moments last week and this week, this is the turning point. It’s gonna be very clear, the turning point. And it’s either gonna be like, wow, Mike really let his foot off the gas for five years and then really made something of himself. Or it’s gonna be like, wow, Mike really lost his way especially hard in September 2022 right around when Jordan had his first baby. And really fell off in a massive kind of way. And I have a sneaking suspicion I’m about to hockey stick.


0:53:29.8 Jordan Syatt: I love that.


0:53:31.5 Mike Vacanti: Camping trips, water filtration systems, less screen time, more nutritious foods, cardio. I got a few other ideas, but we gotta save something for next week.


0:53:43.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah. We got a big pod coming next week. Video pods potentially in the near future. Who knows?


0:53:49.7 Mike Vacanti: You know what? I haven’t been joking with that as much here, ’cause I think… I feel like people might be getting annoyed with us.


0:53:55.1 Jordan Syatt: No, they’ll love it. Well, ’cause it’s true it is coming soon, I hope… But we appreciate you. We appreciate you listening. Thank you very much. We hope you’re enjoying the podcast. If you are, please leave a five star review on iTunes. We’re gonna shout anyone out who leaves a comment early as they review with your Instagram handle on it. So thank you very much. Have a wonderful day and we’ll talk to you next week.


0:54:26.8 Mike Vacanti: See you next week.

Learn How To Become A Personal Trainer

Join our mailing list to receive the latest episodes and tools to become a personal trainer.

You have Successfully Subscribed!