Episode 102: Breastfeeding, Our Soft Society, Rapid Fat Loss, Client Communication, and More

0:00:12.4 Mike Vacanti: Weekly uploads. Hello, Jordan.

0:00:13.7 Jordan Syatt: What’s going on, Michael? Clips Nation. We’re back.

0:00:16.6 Mike Vacanti: How are you?

0:00:17.7 Jordan Syatt: Dude, I’m good. I’m tired. My daughter has been, she’s been a little bit sick, so she’s been up a lot at night. So a little bit tired but nothing I can’t handle. Everything is great. You know?

0:00:31.7 Mike Vacanti: Being a parent is probably just more tiring than not being a parent.

0:00:35.5 Jordan Syatt: Yes. That’s a fact that I am quickly realizing that I knew, but you know, it’s real.

0:00:46.3 Mike Vacanti: And this is actually interesting because I was thinking about this yesterday. You, over the last two years prior to having your daughter, you were sleeping 9 to 10 hours a night consistently.

0:01:00.6 Jordan Syatt: Easy, easy.

0:01:01.4 Mike Vacanti: Or maybe 8 to 9. Yeah. Right?

0:01:03.9 Jordan Syatt: Maybe more.

0:01:04.5 Mike Vacanti: Like you were on a solid 11:00 PM to 9:00 AM kind of. That was like your sleep schedule.

0:01:10.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah, that’s exactly right.

0:01:11.5 Mike Vacanti: And how has it been since, I guess?

0:01:15.4 Jordan Syatt: Not that, that’s for sure.

0:01:20.1 Mike Vacanti: And I don’t necessarily mean like how are you sleeping exactly, but I guess I mean how do you feel and how is life with less sleep?

0:01:28.1 Jordan Syatt: I mean, to be honest like it’s not as bad as I know other parents have it. Like our daughter, like she’s a very good sleeper. And part of it is I’m sure her. And another part of it is like we had the night nurse who helped a ton, like apparently it’s called like sleep training, who she helped to get her on a really incredible and also my wife bears the massive brunt of that load in terms of for the first few weeks, like she basically solely relied on her. Like I couldn’t do basically anything. And then even once we started bottle feeding and all of that, I would stay up late and do like the late night shift, but then my wife would get up early and all of that. But then even she would have to get up in the middle of the night to pump and all this stuff. So that like there’s all this stuff that like you don’t even think about or know or at least I didn’t. So it’s gotten way, like after week five, she was sleeping all the way through the night. So like it’s been great, but now that she’s been sick, she’s just been super uncomfortable.

0:02:37.9 Jordan Syatt: So there’s not only the like her waking up, it’s also the, you’re just always on edge. Like you can’t fully get to sleep ’cause you’re just like, is she okay? Is she breathing? Is her nose stuffy? Like all… Like ’cause they’re nose breathers. So like, she can’t have her pacifier in if her nose is really stuffy and oh my God, getting the gunk out of their nose is just like, it’s awful. It’s like she freaks out. And I get it ’cause we have to like spray the saline thing in her nose and she doesn’t know what’s going on. And then I have to like suck it out with this little like bulb thing. And she’s just like not happy like at all. And it’s like, you know, the cartoon image of the, like the person screaming and their tongue is like flailing in their mouth, like… It’s like that, like the baby is just like mouth wide open, screaming and the tongue is just like, it’s awful ’cause you know, she’s like just in so much pain and uncomfortable. So yeah, I mean it’s overall, it’s amazing and it’s great, but yeah, definitely less free time now than pre-baby.

0:03:48.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Well, free time for sure. And just, I mean you obviously working from home and wanting to spend time with her works nice, but I guess from a, yeah, that all makes sense. How long did you have the night nurse?

0:04:00.2 Jordan Syatt: We had the night nurse, I think it must’ve been probably six to eight weeks, probably six weeks, I think.

0:04:07.8 Mike Vacanti: Okay. And you can’t bottle feed right out the gate?

0:04:13.7 Jordan Syatt: You can, you absolutely can. But my wife wanted to do like as much breastfeeding as she could, but quickly realized like a combo of breastfeeding with, bottle feeding was going to be best because you have to pump anyway. Or I’m sure some people are gonna be like, no, you don’t have to, but like, like, dude, I saw my wife showed me the craziest picture and video last night.

0:04:37.8 Mike Vacanti: Sorry, Am I putting you in a bad spot by making you talk about this because you’re going to get all this like parenting feedback.

0:04:44.3 Jordan Syatt: Breastfeeding is like the most controversial topic in the world. Like forget politics, forget religion, forget the Middle East, forget what… Like breastfeeding is the most like savage discussion you’ll ever enter into. And there’s all these different opinions and all these different ideas and blah, blah. So I just for, you know, listen, I’m just saying what I’ve learned. And I think the most important, there’s a saying that fed is best just as long as your child is fed, that’s what really matters. Right? So I… My wife showed me a video last night or a picture. Apparently if you don’t, what a conversation for two, two dudes to enter into, but if you don’t, I don’t know the right terminology. If you don’t get the milk out, right? Then like it can create all these issues. Like it can clump up and it can like harden and it, you can get like issues with your breast and the milk in there. And not only that in some women, bro, and I know this is a video pod, like people, the milk can like travel to the fucking armpit. And my wife showed me this picture and video yesterday on Instagram of this woman who like the milk had traveled all the way into her armpit and she could squeeze the milk out of her armpit.

0:06:09.3 Jordan Syatt: And like, I was like, you’re nodding like you know this, was this knowledge? Do you know this?

0:06:14.1 Mike Vacanti: No, I had no idea.

0:06:15.9 Jordan Syatt: No, you didn’t… Okay.

0:06:16.1 Mike Vacanti: But it kind of makes sense.

0:06:17.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I mean it does.

0:06:18.5 Mike Vacanti: Is this if the child isn’t eating and then there’s an excess buildup of milk.

0:06:24.1 Jordan Syatt: It will… So yeah, either if it’s not just the child isn’t eating like the child sometimes just like their stomachs are tiny. So like they can’t eat as much as you might have. So that’s why many women, my wife included will pump as well so they can save breast milk for later. So it’s like maybe the child didn’t, the child ate as much as they needed, but they were full and they couldn’t eat anymore. So then they need to pump the rest of it. And that’s where bottle feeding, like where I could come in and I could take a bottle and feed the breast milk from there. So yeah, yeah. Crazy, crazy shit.

0:07:00.1 Mike Vacanti: Nice.

0:07:02.2 Jordan Syatt: Breastfeeding personal trainer podcast, Clips Nation.

0:07:05.3 Mike Vacanti: I mean, the first, the intro has always just been whatever the heck we want to talk about. And so that’s not going to change. By the way, did I tell you about this sweatshirt?

0:07:17.7 Jordan Syatt: No, but it looks super nice. Is that———?

0:07:20.3 Mike Vacanti: Nope. Blur that out, David. Blur that name out. No free brand deals around here. This is, I’ve been looking for years for a good sweatshirt that’s white or black that doesn’t have a ton of branding. That’s comfortable. That’s good high quality material that they sell in oversize. Like this is a XX. And unsuccessful for years. Couldn’t find anything. And then probably about three weeks ago I was sitting down and I thought to myself, I was like, I wonder if the company who makes the white t-shirts that I wear every day of my life might also make hoodies. A little Google found this ordered one fits perfect. Feels amazing. I was like, okay, so I ordered four more and yeah, I got a new like…

0:08:04.6 Jordan Syatt: Well that’s awesome.

0:08:05.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I’m pretty happy about it.

0:08:07.3 Jordan Syatt: Did you get any black ones too?

0:08:09.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. I got two black ones and four white, four or five white ones.

0:08:15.9 Jordan Syatt: Are you going to give the company a shout out or no? No, you want to keep it…

0:08:19.9 Mike Vacanti: It’s Hanes. Hanes. No, I’m fine with it. I’m fine.

0:08:21.4 Jordan Syatt: Okay.

0:08:21.9 Mike Vacanti: I don’t, we don’t need to be giving like influencer companies free shout outs on there. Like, you know, $120. And by the way, I love certain companies like that, but this was, I think this was $16 and the black one was $11.99.

0:08:37.5 Jordan Syatt: That was 16 bucks.

0:08:38.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. And the black one’s $11.99. Like my t-shirts are like four bucks a… Like this is, and this is quality fit, quality feel. And if, if something happens, you can replace it and not feel bad about it. We’re not talking like, you know, Balenci… whatever, any of these like crazy clothes. These are just like nice wholesome salt of the earth clothes.

0:08:55.9 Jordan Syatt: We’re not getting into Balenciaga right now.

0:08:57.6 Mike Vacanti: That’s what we talk about on this podcast is Satanism.

0:09:03.3 Jordan Syatt: Man, we don’t do sponsored posts, but if Hanes wants to sponsor us, I would definitely accept a Hanes sponsorship.

0:09:11.1 Mike Vacanti: Hanes, I think is the only company that I would feel like really, really good about taking money from to promote because it’s the most like already in my life.

0:09:23.4 Jordan Syatt: Dude, that’s like the company you support the most out of anybody. You’ve got all their shirts. Now you’ve got all their sweatshirts.

0:09:29.9 Mike Vacanti: All their shirts. Well, I have six of their sweatshirts, not all of them.

0:09:33.6 Jordan Syatt: Nobody has bought more of Hanes t-shirts than you.

0:09:36.8 Mike Vacanti: Someone probably has.

0:09:38.9 Jordan Syatt: I believe that.

0:09:39.1 Mike Vacanti: You think so?

0:09:39.2 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know. You’re up there. You support the brand and it’s comfortable. It’s easy.

0:09:44.8 Mike Vacanti: My family makes fun of me for having Hanes t-shirts on my Christmas list every year, but you just gotta…

0:09:50.3 Jordan Syatt: Do you… Are the V-neck ones also Hanes?

0:09:56.6 Mike Vacanti: No, those are, those are, those are undisclosed. Just the white crew necks.

0:10:03.4 Jordan Syatt: Got it. Got it. Okay.

0:10:05.8 Mike Vacanti: Should we fire up some, some Instagram?

0:10:07.0 Jordan Syatt: Dude, whatever you want to do.

0:10:08.8 Mike Vacanti: A little Q&A.

0:10:10.8 Jordan Syatt: Is gut health as big a deal as people make it out to be?

0:10:15.1 Mike Vacanti: I love that question. I don’t know. It could end up being a way bigger deal than any of us have made it out to be or not like the science isn’t anywhere remotely close to having any idea. What do you think?

0:10:34.0 Jordan Syatt: I guess it depends on like what specific topic, right? ‘Cause like when it comes to weight loss, no, I think it’s being made out to be like way too big of a deal specifically in regard to weight loss in regard to like bloating and general discomfort and digestion. I think it’s a huge deal and I think it will be like more and more and we’ll find out more and more research will come and probably lead to better medications and maybe even some helpful dietary protocols that could help with people who really struggle with severe bloating and severe digestive distress and constipation and all of that. But from a weight loss perspective, I don’t think we’re going to find out anything about gut health from the perspective of like nothing will take away from calorie deficit. We might find some people with certain gut issues might struggle more with certain aspects, whether it’s maybe hunger, again, constipation, digestive issues, absorption issues, we might find maybe something with like with maybe like a muscle growth as well. We’ll find some, gut health issues that could be potentially impacting that.

0:11:44.8 Jordan Syatt: But I think as of right now, it’s definitely very important, but, and we will continue to learn more about it, but I don’t think specifically in regard to weight loss, we’re going to find anything that’s groundbreaking and new and just like, this is just life changing for everybody. There will be a small percentage of people I think who will be impacted by what we find from a weight loss perspective, but the larger majority of people will probably be impacted by improving their everyday quality of life by reducing stress and reducing discomfort in their gut.

0:12:19.4 Mike Vacanti: So I, when you asked that question, I did not consider gut health for weight loss or gut health from the perspective of bloating and discomfort. I purely thought that the question was referring to the gut is the second brain. All of our neurotransmitters are created in our gut. Basically like, you know, people who have these theories that, most mental illnesses come from something wrong in your gut, gut straight to brain. Like that’s what’s causing all our issues is our gut. When I said, we don’t know anything, I have no idea could be over or underrated specifically related to that.

0:12:54.4 Jordan Syatt: You’re not on socials as much. I see like gut health for weight loss shit all the time and gut like, like there’s people are always talking about different things with gut health and some of them I think are warranted, like learning more about gut health to deal with bloating and distress in your stomach and constipation issues and all of that I think are super, super important.

0:13:12.9 Mike Vacanti: Of course.

0:13:15.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, but like there’s gut health for every topic imaginable now, like gut health for ADHD and gut health for this.

0:13:24.2 Mike Vacanti: And that’s more what I was anything gut brain related. Yeah. I think you’re absolutely right that, you know, having properly functioning GI tract and like feeling good after you eat and on the day to day and having regular bowel movements and like feeling good in general in that department is important for quality of life. And if you don’t have that, like that really sucks. It’s not my specialty, it’s not my area of expertise, but you know, just making some food changes, adding more fiber, like prebiotic, probiotic foods. There are definitely foods that I eat that make me feel better and make me feel worse. And I only know that on an N equals one, like testing on myself, individual level, paying attention and I would recommend everyone else do the same.

0:14:16.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m going to ask you a question that I get asked every time I do a Q&A, and it’s sort of like a two part question because like one of them is like almost like a, there’s two potential scenarios. People always ask, what do you do like if you’re going out to eat, right? Like how do you account for the calories? Maybe what foods do you choose? How do you figure this out? And so there’s two different scenarios here that I like to consider. There’s the scenario in which you’re just going out for a random bite and this isn’t like an everyday thing. And then there’s the other scenario where maybe because of your work or whatever it is, you eat out very regularly. You’re going out to restaurants on a consistent basis. So my question to you is how do… In those situations, how do you communicate to your clients what to do? Like what recommendations do you give? What do you have them look for? What do you say based on these two different scenarios?

0:15:17.2 Mike Vacanti: Man, you’re good. Jordan was like, these gut health clips are not it. These aren’t like where we’re taking this and I don’t see this question, but I get it all the time and Mike’s going to love this and this is going to make some good content. Just like softball down the middle. All right. Repeat the question. How do I communicate with the client about…

0:15:36.8 Jordan Syatt: Again, I just…

0:15:37.9 Mike Vacanti: No, no, just real quick. The two scenarios are like special occasion versus eats out all the time.

0:15:43.2 Jordan Syatt: It doesn’t even have to be a special occasion. Just like randomly going to go out to eat with the wife and kids, whatever it is, or like randomly, you know what, I’m just going to go stop at like, I don’t know, fucking Texas Roadhouse, whatever, you know, like I’m randomly going out to eat one night versus “Hey, for your work or because you travel or whatever it is, you eat out in restaurants all the time.”

0:16:02.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, it’s so it’s slightly hard because even within those scenarios, I’m going to communicate with different clients differently. Like even if it’s just Texas Roadhouse with the family and like more of a one off, but it’s someone who consistently is having a hard time staying on track, hasn’t made progress for a very long time, isn’t happy about their lack of progress, really wants to make progress. I’m going to encourage that person to make one of the better choices on the menu, track the food at the restaurant. Most restaurants have nutrition data publicly available, published on their website and treat it like a normal meal. You know, you can treat their kitchen like your own kitchen. You can make, even if it’s not on the menu, you can make a request. You can make a, you know, this isn’t in Texas Roadhouse, but like even if egg whites aren’t on the menu, you can request egg whites for example, rather than an omelet with four whole eggs or some easy swap like that. Yeah. And, similarly the client who is consistently traveling on the go, you know, eats, even just like eats out a lot, doesn’t have a lot of time in their day to day schedule, doesn’t enjoy cooking, whatever it is.

0:17:17.4 Mike Vacanti: Something that I’ve actually done historically is I’ve had that client when we start coaching, right when I read their assessment and I see that they’re eating out so often, I ask them to list their 10 to 12 favorite most highly frequented restaurants. And then after they do, I have them pick two to three menu options on each, for each restaurant and to look up the nutrition information for that and to include all of that for me to review basically. And then from there we can have a back and forth about like, usually there isn’t a lot of back and forth required because they’ve done all the legwork themselves, but then they have that 30 to 35 options of, okay, at Chick-fil-A, the grilled nuggets, and this is my favorite sauce, even though this sauce has some extra fat, the grill nuggets have no fat. So I’m getting 40 protein, you know, 10 fat and 12 carbon this, or it’s the grilled chicken sandwich and I can, you know, fit this with it. But having those options for all of these restaurants, is just like a, for so many people who I’ve worked with historically, they don’t even realize that you can make fat, like fat loss friendly options, or make good fat loss friendly options at fast food restaurants.

0:18:35.0 Mike Vacanti: And so making those small swaps, Oh, the grilled this instead of the double bacon cheeseburger, like, Oh wow, that saved me 500 calories. It has the same amount of protein or a little bit more protein and is going to help me continue to make progress without feeling like, Oh, had the double cheeseburger. I’m off track. Rest of the week is shot restart on Monday.

0:18:55.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I love that. I especially really liked the idea of like, Hey, pick your top, I don’t know, five to 10 restaurants you go to on a regular basis, pick like your favorite two to three meals and like, let’s go through and look at total calorie counts. I think that’s essentially your game planning, right? It’s like your game planning, how the meal is going to go. I think that’s super important. The other thing that I agree with you a hundred percent on is, you, there’s two different types of people in each of these situations. You have the person who’s being very, very consistent and like on point and the person who is not being consistent and rarely on point. So for the person, if you’re, it’s just like a random one-off meal and the person is being very, very consistent, they’ve been crushing it, like whatever, I’m like, go enjoy yourself, whatever. It’s not a big deal. Go have fun. And sometimes if the person is like relentlessly consistent, I have to really push them to enjoy it. I have to be like, Hey, send me a picture of like what you have.

0:19:49.3 Jordan Syatt: Like I want to see you have like, what, like I’ll say, Hey, go through the menu and tell me what sounds the best to you. Like what sounds like something that you would love to eat, like calories aside, fat aside, sugar aside. What do you want? Like, I would love to have the ice cream Sundae. Then you better have that. I want you to send me a picture of you eating that. Like I want you to have it. And like, that’s a good for that person, for the person in that situation who’s not consistent at all and is like rarely ever doing good, It’s like, do the exact same thing you said. Go in, Hey, let’s look at the menu, pick like what options do you think would be best and tell me why. So there’s sort of like an educational experience. And then if they pick the wrong options, then I’ll be like, all right, yeah. Like maybe the fried lasagna probably isn’t the best choice. Like what about like the grilled chicken breast with broccoli and something like that? Like, Oh yeah, I guess. Yeah, that probably is better. Okay, cool. But then from there, one of the best things I’ve been able to do is create something called bright lines.

0:20:45.6 Jordan Syatt: And I didn’t invent this idea of bright lines. It is this, they’re created by this guy named Albert Bandura, who is like really the major leading expert and researcher around self efficacy. When a bright line is something that you create, it’s like a rule or a law that you have to follow. And a lot of times people get anxious in these scenarios because there’s a lot of ambiguity. They don’t really have, they don’t know what they’re going to do. It’s like, I’ll just sort of play it by ear. And when they don’t really know what they’re going to do, there’s a lot of anxiety because they don’t know what’s going to happen. So a bright line is like, here is what you’re going to do. Number one, this is the meal you’re going to have. Boom. Like you don’t even need to open the fucking menu. You know what you’re going to get. Number two is another big thing that I’ll have people do is, especially if it’s a big meal, ’cause a lot of restaurant meals like are huge and they’re just like, like easily double the portion size of like what you should be eating.

0:21:36.7 Jordan Syatt: I’ll say as soon as you order, I want you to say, “Oh, by the way, can you bring me a to-go box with the meal?” And I want you to cut the meal in half and put the other half inside the to-go box at the beginning and close it. So immediately cut it, put it in, boom, done, close it, done. You don’t look at it. If it’s sitting on a plate, it’s so easy to pick at. It’s so easy. Just like to keep eating and convince yourself, whatever I’ll eat from the beginning, you set your portion size, you cut it in half, put it into to-go box, boom, you’re good to go. That’s another bright line. Get that out of the way. And then from there, it’s really hard to like really fuck it up as long as you’ve done that. But if it’s a restaurant where they have, maybe they have chips or they have like whatever it is like chips or something at the very beginning. Usually what I’ll say is you get one handful of as many chips as you can get in one handful.

0:22:25.2 Jordan Syatt: So you see the basket, you put your hand in, get as many as you fucking can put it on your plate. And that’s what you’ve got. Like the most I’ve seen people able to like able to get as a couple of hundred calories worth of chips with that. Like it’s pretty difficult to get over like 250, 300 calories unless you’ve got Shaquille O’Neal hands. So like it’s a… In which case if you’ve got Shaquille O’Neal hands, you’ve probably got a couple extra calories to spare anyway, so you’re probably fine. So like it gives you an option to like feel like, yeah, I’m getting a bunch and like you can actually get a fair amount, but it’s not overdoing it. You’re immediately limited in portion size. And I think those are super, super, super helpful, especially for like that, like just whether it’s the one off meal or if you’re the person who goes to the restaurants consistently, that’s a good, a good rule set to follow. The other thing here with the, especially the person who does it consistently, intermittent fasting is an underrated tool for this person. I mean, assuming you don’t struggle with binge eating or you if you don’t have an issue with food, saving most of your calories for that meal is just a very smart strategic play that’s going to help you.

0:23:31.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Intermittent fasting and even probably just as if not more beneficial, a protein modified fast where you’re having like two super high protein meals during the day, low carb, low fat. And then at dinner you have so many calories and you don’t have to hit like a hundred plus grams of protein in that meal. You can just have like a normal protein serving extra carbs and fats. It’s what, what percentage of clients that you’ve worked with historically, do you think fall under the category of like, I need to encourage you to enjoy yourself at dinner because you’re too strict versus, “Hey, like let’s try and make a good decision here at this meal.”

0:24:14.6 Jordan Syatt: The vast majority is the latter. The vast majority of people really need more. It’s you know, it’s interesting though. I think the people who need more consistency are oftentimes like easier clients from the perspective of like…

0:24:35.7 Mike Vacanti: Absolutely.

0:24:36.8 Jordan Syatt: They’re easier because like they’re not obsessing over it as much. Whereas the people who are like they’re super consistent, they’re wicked rigid. It’s like they really struggle and like they’re, I think some of the most difficult clients for sure. ‘Cause like you really got to say like, “Hey, fucking relax. Like enjoy yourself.” It’s a, those emails tend to be a little bit more difficult to get through.

0:25:00.0 Mike Vacanti: Longer, more stressful.

0:25:00.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:25:01.5 Mike Vacanti: I completely agree. One thing that I’ve found interestingly enough is I feel like I can be more blunt and it could just be like a recency bias and a couple of men who I’m thinking of that I’ve had these conversations with recently, but can just be more blunt, more straight to the point, more like, “Hey, you know, it’s not, you have 3000 calories a day to work with. We don’t need to have like limit dinner to 700 and have it only be like chicken breast and ceviche. Like have a couple of roles have like, you know, Oh, the asparagus has oil on it. Great. You have 3000 calories to play with.” [laughter] Like let’s go, let’s get it more like. More blunt and more to the point, less compliment sandwich, less sugar coating, less like, you know, and so that’s one of the benefits in those situations. And that’s what that person really needs from you as a coach is not only the permission, but like the encouragement and the hard push that you can indulge and enjoy yourself here. And that’s okay. And you’re still jacked out of your mind.

0:26:07.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that’s a good point.

0:26:10.0 Mike Vacanti: But you’re right that as a newer coach, you wouldn’t think that those end up being the harder clients, but they often are.

0:26:19.0 Jordan Syatt: I guess it also depends on what type of coach you are. Like if you’re a physique coach and you’re trying to prep someone for a bodybuilding show, you love those disordered clients. Like you love the like outrageously strict, like they’ve got like real body dysmorphia and they’re willing to do literally anything to like keep getting leaner. You’re like, I love it. You’re the easiest, you’ll do whatever I say. But like, if you’re a more healthy lifestyle coach, trying to get people to just be healthy and enjoy and like incorporate fitness in their life, not take it over their whole life those clients are far more difficult for sure.

0:26:54.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, absolutely.

0:26:56.6 Jordan Syatt: The bodybuilding world is disordered as fucked as fuck, dude, it is bad. It’s I’m just, and I know the bodybuilding people are going to get so mad at me saying this. It’s so funny. I’ve spoken about this a lot and I’ve pushed further and further and further away from the bodybuilding world over the years. But like, whenever I’ve spoken about how so many of them are really disordered, a lot of them get really upset with me and they get really mad.

0:27:18.6 Jordan Syatt: They’re like, “No, it’s not. It’s just, this is what I love to do. And I like to push myself.” I’m like, that’s fine. But what’s been really crazy about being in this industry for so long. And I get it’s a little over 10 years I’ve been online. 11 years I’ve been online now, which isn’t that long. But it’s been very interesting for me to notice how many of the people who used to get mad at me, and then left the bodybuilding world, then came to me and said, you were right. I was just like feeding into my insecurity. I was feeding into my body dysmorphia, I was feeding into all of this. And you saying that like it really just sort of like, showed it right in my face. And like, I didn’t want to accept it. So I say that because if there are any, you know, bodybuilders who are like, I’m not disordered, I’m not disorderly listen to this like, try and think like, maybe if you don’t think you’re disordered, and maybe you’re not, that’s fine. But the way I say to this, if you can’t enjoy a slice of pizza without having anxiety, like, that’s disordered.

0:28:19.2 Jordan Syatt: That’s not like in the same way, someone who like, someone who just like, uncontrollably binges and can’t seem to get a fucking piece of fruit in their mouth has like a bad relationship with food. It’s equally the opposite. If you can’t have one slice at your daughter’s birthday party or enjoy a slice of cake or whatever without anxiety, you’ve got a fucking problem. That’s not a healthy relationship with food.

0:28:46.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I agree. I think there is room for like, I just don’t want to eat that. Because I do know people who are very much like, and these aren’t, they’re not always unbelievably lean individuals, they’re not like bodybuilders, but just choose to eat. You know, we talked about clean eating a few episodes ago and how it’s underrated, just don’t want to eat that food. But yeah, if you want to, and you can’t for fear that one piece of pizza is gonna like, make you lose your abs, or is gonna add a bunch of body fat, or is gonna do something. Yeah, that’s not a good mental place to be in.

0:29:21.9 Jordan Syatt: Then when someone’s like, but I don’t want to, I’m like, well, let’s dig into that. Why like, why don’t you? Right? Like, if it’s truly?

0:29:31.4 Mike Vacanti: Here’s the thing, where I see it, where I see it as super, like, super health focused/want to feel incredible individuals.

0:29:43.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I get that. I just don’t know if I fully believe it. It’s just because like, I’m just so healthy. Because then a lot of these people, they still drink. And they still do other stuff. And I’m like, okay…

0:29:58.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah, but pick your vice, right?

0:30:00.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, for sure but I’m like, do you…

0:30:02.2 Mike Vacanti: I mean, food and ice cream is definitely one that I am proud to have be a vice relative to like, what could be other vices?

0:30:11.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, yeah, 100%. I just, being around disordered relationships of food for long enough. I really struggle to believe that someone will be like, yeah, I really like once in a while, like, I’m not… Or I don’t know, like, at your own birthday, or your spouse’s birthday, or your child’s birthday, whatever, like, I’m not gonna have the cake. No, I just don’t want it. It’s like, really? Like, never? Like, no part of you? It’s like, if you have lactose intolerance, and it’s gonna blow your stomach up, like, yeah, I get that fine. But it really does make me wonder, like, is there any part of you that’s anxious about eating this? And by the way, it doesn’t have to be anxious about getting fat. It could be anxious about will this hurt my health? Which is anorexia nervosa, like, that’s a real issue in terms of, God forbid, you have one chocolate chip cookie, and you think, oh my god, this is gonna, you know, take my cholesterol through the roof, this is gonna, whatever. It’s like, there’s, is there anxiety there? And if there is, and you can be objective about it, and be like, you know what, there is some anxiety there, worth exploring, worth talking to someone about, worth seeking out, hey, you know what, maybe I’m just gonna talk to a therapist, right?

0:31:35.9 Jordan Syatt: And by the way, this is not a conversation for, I’m not saying it’s not a conversation for nutritionists. But it’s important to understand this is not a nutritionist specialty. There are people who specialize in food disorders, where it’s like, you can get help from them. So…

0:31:52.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Psychologists, clinical psychologists.

0:31:53.5 Jordan Syatt: I’m not saying, yes. Yeah, I think it’s this is a conversation worth having. It’s like, if there’s any anxiety whatsoever around your food, worth exploring objectively.

0:32:05.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. To go. I can’t really relate, because I haven’t ever had that like, anxiety about eating certain foods before. But what I have had is a desire to maintain lower body fat percentage, because I thought that was impressive, mainly to girls, you know, I’m talking like 10 to 18 years ago range. But as soon as I realized that, and this is objectively like, you know, certain people have certain preferences, but basically across populations, like 12% and 6% are basically the same in terms of like, how attractive a male is to a female. Once you realize that, and once you realize that, like, oh, when I go from 12% to 6%, most of the positive feedback is coming from other dudes who also want the physique. It’s like, okay, I like, this isn’t really doing what I thought it was doing for me. And by the way, if you want to get super lean, cool, I’m all for it, especially if it’s for yourself, if it’s, if you’re challenging yourself, you’ve never done it before, if you’re pushing yourself, like, there are a lot of positives to doing it. I think you learn a lot about yourself.

0:33:19.4 Mike Vacanti: And there are a lot of qualities, characteristics in that journey, if you’re doing it once or twice, that can be applied to other areas of life. It’s not easy, like pushing through hunger, like it’s not fun. But for me, when I realize that, you know, 10, 11% and 7% are the same, it’s like, okay, I don’t care that much.

0:33:47.9 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know why I just started thinking about when I first started working with Gary, and he would make me lift my shirt up to see how lean I was [laughter] And you told me he did the same to you. Like hey let me see the way you look… [laughter]

0:34:04.4 Mike Vacanti: He liked to like, kind of compare and see what was going on.

0:34:07.7 Jordan Syatt: And he lifts his shirt up and he’d look, he’d be like, okay, okay.

0:34:10.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. Hey, Mike, Mike, lift up your shirt. Lift up your shirt. The worst is when he does it around like a group. He’ll be like, Oh, be like, you know, go meet him at, I don’t know, not like at a restaurant usually, but with other people, Mike, Mike, lift up your shirt. See, see, really funny. [laughter]

0:34:32.8 Jordan Syatt: I remember when I first started working with him, we were at his vacation house and we were talking about his packs and all of that and how he really wanted to get a bigger chest and all of that. And he’s like, let me, let me see your, let me see your packs. I was like, you want me to take my shirt? He was like, yeah, let me just see what your packs… I was like, okay.

0:34:54.0 Mike Vacanti: He’s very, one thing I was always impressed with was like social norms aren’t like, he doesn’t care as much about it.

0:35:07.3 Jordan Syatt: One of my favorite stories is the, when he was, he loves, he loves that he eats the bones of chicken wings. [chuckle] He loves to tell people that. And like, he loves the shock value of it of when people are like, did you? So one of my favorite stories is like at one of the holiday parties, he was speaking with a group of people and one of the women next to him had a couple of chicken wings and she had the bones left on her plate. And in this group of people, he looks at her and he says, are you going to finish that? And like, she looks at him like, I mean, it’s just bones. And he was like, are you going to eat them? And she was like, no. And he was like, do you mind? And he took his employee’s plate of bones and just started as though nothing was weird or out of the normal, just starts eating the bones. And the look of shock on these people’s faces.

0:36:04.1 Mike Vacanti: It’s hilarious.

0:36:05.0 Jordan Syatt: And he just, he loves it. Like he loves that. I remember he did that when he went on the hot wings show. What was that? The name of the show is called…

0:36:14.5 Mike Vacanti: Hot Ones.

0:36:18.6 Jordan Syatt: Hot Ones, Hot Ones. Yeah. And he’s, not only did he eat all of the hot, all of the hot ones, but he was eating the bones. The guy was like, that’s impressive. Okay. I don’t know if, I don’t know if you’re going to like this one. I just don’t know anymore. What do you tell yourself when life is getting hard and in the way of fitness goals to stay consistent and less stressed?

0:36:48.1 Mike Vacanti: Man, I, so I’m going to answer the question as it says, what do I tell myself? I don’t say anything. I really don’t beat myself up about like missing workouts, having bad days of nutrition. Like even if I’m kind of really into a specific fitness goal and something happens like recently, you know, not recently now, several weeks back with my elbow, like really hurting and me dropping volume down and like, you know, kind of putting the lean gains on hold for a little bit and trying to get back to a hundred percent. I don’t tell myself anything because I don’t feel bad about it. Like I just, what’s interesting is when you started asking that question, I thought it was just going to be the beginning, which is what do you tell yourself when life is hard? And my answer to that might actually be more beneficial for the person asking this. I actually, when I feel like life is getting hard, I literally realize that in this moment that I do it is I actually like actively think of one or two or three things that I’ve done well recently that I’m like happy about.

0:38:00.0 Mike Vacanti: And I like self-encourage on that. It’s like focus on those good things, which in my experience leads to more progress. There’s… Like negative self-talk just doesn’t get, doesn’t get me anywhere. And so hyper-focus on the positive and you make mistakes you learn from, you move on and you get more bats in life.

0:38:22.7 Jordan Syatt: What do you say to a client who historically has struggled with being consistent regardless of what’s going on in life, but then asks you something like this? Like someone who’s consistently inconsistent, how do you, what do you say to that client?

0:38:41.6 Mike Vacanti: Too hyper-individual, like…

0:38:43.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:38:45.5 Mike Vacanti: It entirely depends on that person’s situation. Like I have multiple clients popping into my head. Do they have three kids, two are very young. It’s the holiday season, they’re both sick right now. Actually in fairness, she’s not consistently inconsistent. She’s usually really consistent and it’s more of a temporary thing. Yeah, it’s too individual to what’s going on with that one client.

0:39:12.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I really think there’s… It’s so interesting, like ’cause it really is very individual and it so depends on the person. I keep, my mind keeps pulling me towards David Goggins.

0:39:34.9 Mike Vacanti: Okay. I wasn’t expecting that. I love it though.

0:39:40.3 Jordan Syatt: What’s been in… I like to look at research, but I also like to look at just, I like to look at population data and just culture and looking at people who’ve succeeded. When I’m looking at someone who’s consistently inconsistent, like consistently inconsistent, we know for a fact that someone who’s severely overweight, like very, very, very overweight, we know that starting with a rapid fat loss protocol can actually be a really good approach for that person. And often doing something sustainable at the beginning is actually very much unsustainable ’cause they don’t see the results, they don’t believe they can succeed. Oftentimes starting with something unsustainable that will show them they can succeed is one of the best things you can do for someone who’s just starting out and consistently struggles to be consistent. And there’s something about the David Goggins approach, specifically for this person, that I love. What… And there’s a couple of things.

0:40:45.6 Jordan Syatt: Number one is David Goggins never, never says like, “You’re a worthless piece of shit.” He never talks down to you. He speaks to you like you’re the strongest person in the world. Like, “You are stronger than you think, you can do this.” Just… ” And for someone who’s consistently struggled to be consistent, they don’t think they can do it. And so to have that type of talk, like what you were saying, like focus on the positive, it’s sort of like, you’re learning to become your own cheerleader, you’re learning to become your own like biggest supporter, it’s like, “No, I can do this. I can do this.” And I also think there’s something where, at least in the beginning, pushing yourself to do something super, super hard proves that like, “Oh, well, if I can do something this hard, then something more sustainable is like, that’s no problem.” You know what I mean?

0:41:42.5 Mike Vacanti: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

0:41:43.3 Jordan Syatt: And I don’t like the idea of going as extreme as him and potentially almost dying in certain scenarios and all that, but it makes me think there are certain situations, especially with someone who just consistently is inconsistent, you just need to do something fucking hard every day. Sort of like we’ll say to coaches like with content, like the coaches who struggle to be consistent with content, like what Gary did with me. He was like, “Post three times a day, every day.” I was like, and at first I was posting like a couple of times a week. And then I went, I went cold turkey three times a day every day. And I did that for almost a year and then shit changed forever. It’s, and I see that potential with people who just struggle to be consistent at all with health and fitness. Just… And I don’t even think something like 75 hard. I think 75 hard might be too much ’cause it’s two workouts a day.

0:42:39.7 Jordan Syatt: I think it’s a, it’s a little bit like, if you miss one day, then you have to start all over again. Like I’m not… I think that might even be too much, but there’s some middle ground here of just like, just fucking do it. Something hard that I’ve seen many people make positive changes in their life. My brother included. My brother just going cold turkey, losing 150 pounds out of fucking nowhere. Like this isn’t a… Like this is a taboo conversation to have in much of the science-based world, where they’re like, “No, it has to be slow. It has to be steady.” It’s like, “It doesn’t have to be.” There are many people who did not do it slow and steady, who are absolutely crushing it for the rest of their life. And this is a conversation that needs to be had.

0:43:24.9 Mike Vacanti: And the rapid fat loss analogy, if you do something really hard to start, then you can, you’ve already proved to yourself you can do something really hard. You can definitely do an easier version of that to continue to maintain, because something really, really hard by definition can’t last forever, but it can last for a pretty long time. And then once you’ve built your self-efficacy through that process and maybe let off the gas a little bit, which could even just mean, like in a simple example, eating more and losing less weight per week and being able to maintain that.

0:44:02.0 Jordan Syatt: Mm-hmm. Yeah, exactly.

0:44:04.4 Mike Vacanti: No, I like that a lot. Is that a taboo discussion?

0:44:07.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, among some people that if some people see this, they’ll be very upset. I’m sure there will be a lot of coaches nodding their heads in agreement. Like, “Okay, thank you for saying that.” But this is, this is a pretty taboo thing among some coaches to say, to suggest you should do it. There are people who can do a little bit more quickly and you should do some really hard shit.

0:44:31.1 Mike Vacanti: I mean, have those coaches worked with someone who’s 330 pounds and encouraged them to lose half a pound a week and listen to that person’s response or how many of them or have they successfully worked with that individual, who then went on to successfully be in a 250 calorie per day deficit for like four and a half years to get to their goal weight? I doubt it.

0:45:01.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. No, no.

0:45:04.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I mean, doing hard things, I’m a fan. And especially the way you’re directing it at someone who has tried the sustainable way many, many times and been unsuccessful.

0:45:17.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:45:18.9 Mike Vacanti: What do you got?

0:45:19.8 Jordan Syatt: You didn’t think I was gonna go that route, did you?

0:45:21.7 Mike Vacanti: Dude, you know what’s funny, is I think I’m, I think I’m so out of touch with the culture that I’m getting the vibe that you think that that was like, like a real heavy discussion. And I feel that was just like normal.

0:45:36.7 Jordan Syatt: Bro, that was heavy. That was a heavy discussion.

0:45:40.9 Mike Vacanti: I see more Goggins on my feeds over the last year or two years than…

0:45:45.9 Jordan Syatt: I love that guy.

0:45:47.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:45:47.8 Jordan Syatt: He’s out of his mind, but I love that guy. Yeah. This episode’s brought to you by Hanes.

[laughter]

0:45:53.8 Mike Vacanti: You think culture’s teetered too soft and so we could, a lot of people could use a little more of that mentality.

0:46:06.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. A 100%.

0:46:07.9 Mike Vacanti: Not that we should all be running daily marathons or like…

0:46:11.4 Jordan Syatt: No, no, but we’re so soft. We’re so soft, man. Everything, everyone’s offended by every… Dude, I can’t make a single fucking post without someone being like, “Well, actually for, for someone who’s going through this, that might not… ” Like, “Shut the fuck up.” Every…

0:46:35.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s partly a function of audience size too.

0:46:39.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. But I’m like, “Are you that soft? Come on.” So just doughy soft society right now. Like what is going on up here in people’s head? Things have gotten so…

0:46:57.6 Mike Vacanti: Say more.

0:47:00.5 Jordan Syatt: Do you want me to say more or should we go to Clips Nation?

0:47:01.9 Mike Vacanti: No, no, no, no. This is a clip. Let’s clip this. This is, I like Jordan sleep deprived. Let’s hear it.

0:47:07.6 Jordan Syatt: Things have gotten so good, things are so good for us, especially in the West, that we make up fucking problems.

0:47:18.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:47:20.6 Jordan Syatt: We make up things to get upset about. It’s like, God damn. Like things are so good for… Like imagine being in a war torn country or imagine being in Iran right now, like really fighting for human rights, like really fight… Or in Ukraine, right? Like really fighting for your life. Like they’re not worrying about any of the shit that we’re making up problems about. It’s just, man, things are too good. And they don’t even realize it. They don’t even fucking realize it.

0:47:57.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. You can compare the West to other parts of the world and you can also just compare this current time to basically all of human history, which was a lot more dangerous, a lot more physically laborious, a lot more day to day difficult. Yeah. It’s hard because we’ve all only lived our lives though. So it’s… You really… It takes either someone teaching you or it takes some concerted individual effort to, to generate that gratitude that we have it way easier than 50 years ago, a 100 years ago, 500 years ago, a 1000 years ago.

0:48:39.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:48:39.8 Mike Vacanti: With technology and productivity and all that that has brought to our lives.

0:48:46.5 Jordan Syatt: I am struggling if I should keep going in on this and say something that’s like, almost slightly divergent or if I should go Clips Nation.

0:48:52.6 Mike Vacanti: Probably Clips Nation if you’re gonna go real divergent.

0:48:55.5 Jordan Syatt: Okay. I was gonna diverge a little bit, but we’ll stay safe and we’ll go Clips Nation. I think we’ve spoken about this somewhat recently, but I feel like we could have a real conversation about it. Are hip thrusts overrated?

0:49:18.4 Mike Vacanti: Jordan thinks they are. I think they’re probably properly rated. I think, look, do you want to build your glutes? They’re, an excellent glute hypertrophy exercise. And there are other excellent glute hypertrophy exercises and I think they all work well together in different places in the workout, in different variations of the movement, in different rep ranges at different levels of absolute and relative intensity. Like, yes, I’m a huge fan of hip thrusts, specifically for strengthening and building glute muscles. I tend to program ’cause I think you called me out on this when I said it, you were like, you were saying you don’t program them, I don’t remember exactly, but I program barbell hip thrusts more often for women than for men. But I program single leg hip thrusts for men and women and find that to be an unbelievable exercise.

0:50:19.3 Jordan Syatt: So I don’t think all hip thrusts are overrated. I specifically think barbell hip thrusts are overrated.

0:50:25.6 Mike Vacanti: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Okay.

0:50:27.9 Jordan Syatt: Because it takes for fucking ever.

0:50:31.0 Mike Vacanti: Dude, I need to push back on this.

0:50:32.7 Jordan Syatt: Okay. Push back.

0:50:34.0 Mike Vacanti: How does it take longer than barbell deadlift?

0:50:37.6 Jordan Syatt: Bro, most people can hip thrust more than they deadlift.

0:50:39.9 Mike Vacanti: They need to get up their deadlift game.

0:50:42.0 Jordan Syatt: I agree. But dude, I mean, I see people deadlifting, sorry, I see people hip thrusting like 405 for eight, 10, 12 reps and they can’t deadlift 275.

0:50:54.9 Mike Vacanti: Is that a… Is that’s, that’s more of a female issue than a male issue.

0:51:00.9 Jordan Syatt: Definitely. Yeah. A 100%, yeah.

0:51:01.0 Mike Vacanti: Because of the difference in upper body strength and grip strength and et cetera.

0:51:05.3 Jordan Syatt: Upper body strength, grip strength, their overall anthropometry, all of that. Like generally, yeah, generally their, their hip hinging strength is gonna be way stronger. And when they don’t have to worry about grip strength, it’s like hip thrusts are much, much, much easier for them to progressively overload.

0:51:20.9 Mike Vacanti: Not to divert. What do you think the average ratio is for a male for deadlift to hip thrust?

0:51:27.1 Jordan Syatt: Bro, ratios, you know, come on. I’m not a math guy.

0:51:30.9 Mike Vacanti: No, you can do ratio. Fine.

0:51:34.9 Jordan Syatt: Don’t put that on me, Michael.

0:51:37.5 Mike Vacanti: Just spit on my computer. For a man who’s one rep max, for an intermediate lifter who can deadlift 405, what do you think he on average can barbell hip thrust?

0:51:51.7 Jordan Syatt: If he can deadlift one rep max 405, he could probably, like without ever barbell hip thrusting before, like first time he goes into it, what do I think he could probably do?

0:52:00.6 Mike Vacanti: No, say, no, say he trains deadlift, like five X more volume over his training career, but he’s barbell hip thrusted before.

0:52:08.6 Jordan Syatt: He could probably barbell hip thrust like one to one, right around there. Maybe slightly less than the barbell hip thrust.

0:52:13.9 Mike Vacanti: Perfect. That’s what I thought.

0:52:16.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Whereas like, I think with women, it’s significantly higher. It’s often like 1.5 to 2.5 X, somewhere in that range, which and not to mention, like if your gym doesn’t have enough plates, all this stuff, but here’s what I think. So barbell hip thrust, because it’s super fucking uncomfortable, it can take a long time. Dude, when you put four plates on each side, five plates on each side, like this shit takes a long fucking time and it’s uncomfortable. I’m like, they have machine hip thrust options that are great. I love machine hip thrust. They’re essentially the same thing except way more comfortable and super easy to load and unload. If you have a hip thrust machine, I would way rather that as opposed to a barbell hip thrust. Single leg hip thrust, I fucking love, split stance hip thrust, I love, like chain loaded, love all of that stuff. I don’t think…

0:53:10.9 Jordan Syatt: Here’s what I think. If you love barbell hip thrust and you enjoy it, then keep doing it. That’s fine. But for me, I’ve just worked with enough 35 to 75 year old women who just say, “This is so uncomfortable and I’m insecure in the gym doing it and it’s embarrassing. And I don’t like the people watching me,” and all that, where I’m like, “I’m just, I’m not gonna do it for the vast… ” That’s why if I program it in the Inner Circle, it’s either, it’s like this or a barbell hip thrust. Like you can choose, but I will never program that just, flat out, this is what everyone’s doing, especially in a group program, because I know a tremendous number of people are gonna be super uncomfortable with it and they’re gonna want a substitution.

0:53:52.7 Mike Vacanti: That’s fair. I especially relate to the hip pain point.

0:53:57.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:54:00.5 Mike Vacanti: Like, even if you get proper padding in there, it’s still very uncomfortable, “That’s okay. We can find an alternative movement.”

0:54:04.7 Jordan Syatt: That’s why I like the machine ’cause they just have this strap that goes over your hip. It’s really comfortable. It’s much better.

0:54:09.2 Mike Vacanti: I believe you. I’ve never used one before. I don’t love the like, “I’m embarrassed. I don’t like to do this. I feel like people are watching.” I like to push back decently hard against that.

0:54:21.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:54:21.9 Mike Vacanti: It could just also be a pet peeve with certain clients who are always wanting substitutions.

0:54:28.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. It depends. Like if the person never complains ever and they go to the gym and they do all the work and I give them that and they’re like, “Honestly, this one is just like outside of my comfort zone.” I’m not gonna push back that, “You have to fucking do it.”

0:54:41.6 Mike Vacanti: Correct.

0:54:41.8 Jordan Syatt: But if it’s someone who is like, “Well, I don’t like this exercise and I don’t like this one. I also don’t like this one, I don’t like this one.” “Shut the fuck up. Just fucking do this.” Like, “Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up. Just go do it.” It’s a, yeah, it does depend on the person for sure.

0:54:54.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:54:54.7 Jordan Syatt: And it also depends on the importance of the exercise. Like if it’s someone saying like, “Hey… ” I don’t know, a goblet squat. There are many variations I can do of it, but like, listen, you have to do some squat variation. I don’t care if it’s a goblet squat, pause squat, box goblet squat, I don’t care, but you’re doing some squat variation. If it’s a barbell hip thrust and they’re like, “Hey, I don’t feel comfortable.” Like, “Cool. I don’t, I don’t mind. There’re so many other exercises. We could do single leg hip thrust. What… I don’t care.” Like there are just so many other options as opposed to the barbell hip thrust. And I know it’s hugely hot right now and everyone loves it and I’ve used it and it’s great, but I’m like, I think it’s overrated.

0:55:37.4 Mike Vacanti: I like sleep deprived Jordan. Should we hit one more?

0:55:41.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah we’ll hit one more.

0:55:43.2 Mike Vacanti: This is fun. We’ve… I mean, back to back to back days of recording, getting our schedule dialed, keeping weekly uploads intact, not missing a week. Shout out, David, doing real work on the backend.

0:55:54.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Thank you, David. You’re the man.

0:55:56.8 Mike Vacanti: I mean, this is nothing to you because you just hammer multiple recordings a day, but I’m pretty happy with us.

0:56:04.9 Jordan Syatt: But I love recording with you. It’s just fun.

0:56:07.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I agree. You’re high yellow on the scale of green, yellow, red.

0:56:13.9 Jordan Syatt: I don’t even make green. Yeah. You’re pretty neutral for me, bro.

0:56:16.8 Mike Vacanti: I’m interacting. I’m… Your high… We’re live on the internet and it’s high yellow. I don’t think you understand what kind of compliment that is. You might even be low green.

0:56:25.7 Jordan Syatt: Wow. No, I’ll stay high yellow. I’ll take that.

0:56:28.7 Mike Vacanti: You’re right on the border. You’re right on the edge.

0:56:31.6 Jordan Syatt: Someone asked, what is your best motivational quote? Do you have one?

0:56:36.5 Mike Vacanti: Oh man. All right. So I like… No, no, no, no Google. Get out of there. What are you doing? This is…

0:56:42.6 Jordan Syatt: I might have to read it. I know which one it is. I already have it up.

0:56:46.9 Mike Vacanti: Cheater.

0:56:48.7 Jordan Syatt: How is it a cheater? I didn’t memorize this whole one and you’ll know when I say which one it is ’cause I think you know which one it is.

0:56:53.9 Mike Vacanti: All right. I’m gonna try and say yours off hand without even… It’s better to be a warrior in a garden than a gardener in a war.

0:57:02.8 Jordan Syatt: Wow. That’s a good one.

0:57:04.7 Mike Vacanti: Oh, that wasn’t yours though?

0:57:05.9 Jordan Syatt: No, no, I don’t need to Google that one.

0:57:12.9 Mike Vacanti: I like any motivational quotes around short term versus long-term pain that are basically, they’re like the… What is it? The pain of suffering is better than the pain of regret.

0:57:28.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:57:29.5 Mike Vacanti: Something along those lines, like do the hard thing now, hard… Like do the hard thing now, easy life later, easy life now, hard life later.

0:57:37.4 Jordan Syatt: You’re gonna love… I know you know this one. This is like one of my favorites of all time. I’m gonna get this in a poster, it’s gonna be in my gym, it’s gonna be in each of my children’s room, God willing, I have more, gonna have this in every room, like every child’s room. It’s called The Man In The Arena. You know this one, right?

0:57:57.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:58:00.9 Jordan Syatt: It’s by Theodore Roosevelt. Should I read this? Should we end this podcast with a quick reading of The Man In The Arena?

0:58:05.4 Mike Vacanti: Yes.

0:58:05.9 Jordan Syatt: Okay. This is like, this is so good. This is one of the greatest quotes of all time. So let’s, let’s quickly read this. Okay. This is how we’re gonna end the podcast. The Man In The Arena, by Theodore Roosevelt. “It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming, but who does actually strive to do the deeds, who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be, shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.” Yeah.

0:59:17.6 Mike Vacanti: That hits, that hits.

0:59:17.8 Jordan Syatt: It’s just, this applies to everything and especially, especially I think with an important ending here, with creating content. This is so, so important with creating content because it is so easy for people who are not making content to comment on your shit and say, “Well, you should have said this better and you should have done that better and you should have done this and should have said that and you should have da, da, da.” “Shut the, shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up.” If they wanna make better content, then they can make better content. But it’s better for you to just keep making content, doing your best to make good content to help people. Sometimes your content is gonna suck, sometimes it’s gonna offend people, sometimes it’s just not gonna be good, whatever it is, at least you’re out there trying to make good content to help people.

1:00:06.4 Mike Vacanti: Here’s the analogy I like. Your business is your job. You’re a pro, you’re a professional, making content is the marketing department of your business. It is what is gonna bring you new clients, it’s what’s gonna get you revenue, it’s what’s gonna put food on the family for your table, on the table for your family. The food’s not for the table. Imagine someone in another field, imagine a professional athlete, imagine a wide receiver in the NFL, who on Sunday drops a pass, gets booed, gets told he sucks, gets told to quit, gets yelled at from the fans when that happens, imagine if he quit. He’s like, “I dropped a pass and a fan said I sucked. I’m done with this. I must suck. That guy over there in the stadium just said I sucked, I’m done.” No, you would never even consider it. That’s… Like earmuffs to the, to the boos, also earmuffs to the applause and just focus on the process. Keep going. Let’s go. Episode 102, weekly uploads.

1:01:12.6 Jordan Syatt: Thank you for listening. Five star review. Not one, two, three, or four, five. Five star review. Thank you very much. We love you. See you in the mentorship.

1:01:21.9 Mike Vacanti: See you soon.

1:01:22.8 Jordan Syatt: Link in the show notes.