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In this episode, we have some pretty wild discussions about taxation, reaching $10 million dollars in the bank, finding balance in life, and much more.


We hope you enjoy this episode and if you’d like to join us in The Online Fitness Business Mentorship you can grab your seat at


Thank you!

-J & M


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You can download a PDF version of the transcript here


Or you can expand to find the full episode transcription below:


0:00:12.7 Mike Vacanti: Hello Jordan.


0:00:12.8 Jordan Syatt: What’s up, Michael?


0:00:13.9 Mike Vacanti: Welcome to the How to Become a Personal Trainer Podcast.


0:00:15.5 Jordan Syatt: Welcome to it. Thanks for having me.


0:00:20.4 Mike Vacanti: Always. What’d you just eat in that little gap between the mentorship Q&A and now the podcast?


0:00:23.4 Jordan Syatt: I thought you were… You wanted to guess it. Do you want to guess it or you just want me to tell you?


0:00:26.6 Mike Vacanti: I think it’s too random for me to guess you probably ate like a high fiber low carb tortilla with like something else with it.


0:00:35.5 Jordan Syatt: No, you kidding me?


0:00:40.6 Mike Vacanti: Salad that was already in the refrigerator ready to go.


0:00:43.3 Jordan Syatt: No.


0:00:47.0 Mike Vacanti: Was it something in the refrigerator ready for you to eat?


0:00:49.3 Jordan Syatt: Nope.


0:00:50.8 Mike Vacanti: Oh, so it was snacky in nature? Give me the macros.


0:00:51.8 Jordan Syatt: Primarily fat.


0:00:52.8 Mike Vacanti: You just went and had a primarily fat snack?


0:00:55.1 Jordan Syatt: Yep.


0:00:56.3 Mike Vacanti: In that seven-minute window?


0:01:00.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:01:00.8 Mike Vacanti: Olive oil.


0:01:05.7 Jordan Syatt: [laughter] No, I did not drink…


0:01:08.6 Mike Vacanti: Oh. Cheese, cheese.


0:01:09.8 Jordan Syatt: No, no, that’s a good one. But no, not cheese. My cheese is low fat, high protein.


0:01:12.9 Mike Vacanti: You got that GMO cheese, that genetically modified cheese.


0:01:15.3 Jordan Syatt: I love those GMOs.


0:01:16.8 Mike Vacanti: You’re not about that raw life. Uh huh. You just had a… Did you eat an avocado?


0:01:23.1 Jordan Syatt: I had avocado earlier today, but no.


0:01:25.5 Mike Vacanti: Was this a clean or a dirty snack?


0:01:28.0 Jordan Syatt: Clean. This is super clean. Superfood clean.


0:01:30.6 Mike Vacanti: Oh nuts.


0:01:32.0 Jordan Syatt: There we go. Yeah. Nuts.


0:01:34.4 Mike Vacanti: That was that was horrendous by me. That was some of my worst guessing ever.


0:01:38.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I was surprised with that one. I was like, is he thinking protein is like a major source in these things? And so yeah, no, it’s was little combo of…


0:01:45.9 Mike Vacanti: Why would I think protein is a major source and then come out swinging with extra virgin olive oil?


0:01:49.8 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know. I have a couple left in my pocket.


0:01:52.9 Mike Vacanti: All right, we’ll finish them.


0:01:55.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m finishing them.


0:02:04.1 Mike Vacanti: “All right, well finish them.” It was so unnecessarily like authoritative and aggressive.


0:02:11.8 Jordan Syatt: I’ll finish them all right. We got people listening to this, right?


0:02:13.6 Mike Vacanti: Do you eat in the mic on other… Like if you were going on someone else’s podcast, would you?


0:02:15.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, all the time.


0:02:17.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Okay, cool. If anyone has clips they can send me of that. I think that you probably don’t. But if I see the clips and they’re dated before February 29th, 2024, I’ll believe it.


0:02:28.1 Jordan Syatt: Dude, they’re out there in the ether. They’re there. I’ve had an apple on one before.


0:02:32.9 Mike Vacanti: Well, yeah, apple is reasonable. Apple… What you’re doing when you’re eating an apple on a podcast is you’re putting on a show of how to live for people watching and listening. Because eating an apple as a snack is a behavior that should be modeled and imitated by the masses.


0:02:49.9 Jordan Syatt: Love that.


0:02:51.1 Mike Vacanti: Guess what I did this morning, Jordan?


0:02:55.0 Jordan Syatt: What did you do, Mike?


0:03:00.7 Mike Vacanti: I forgot to set an alarm and slept right through Gary.


0:03:04.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, my gosh. That is not good. Wow. Is that the first time you’ve ever done that?


0:03:09.1 Mike Vacanti: It’s the second in… It’s been about 10 years and then you had a three-year stint in there. So out of seven years, it’s the second time it’s happened.


0:03:18.7 Jordan Syatt: He was probably pretty happy about it.


0:03:20.8 Mike Vacanti: No, no, because that’s what we would think. It’s like he’d be happy because he would take the opportunity and sleep in a little more himself. He went down to the gym and he did a 30-minute incline treadmill walk.


0:03:29.7 Jordan Syatt: Shut up.


0:03:30.6 Mike Vacanti: Mm-hmm. I was so pumped. I was so pumped. But also…


0:03:42.0 Jordan Syatt: That’s crazy.


0:03:42.1 Mike Vacanti: Like, at the same time, felt really bad. And it’s been long enough that I know his reaction wouldn’t be upset. But his reaction was literally… I think he said, “Happens once every three years. No worries.” It’s like, cool. [laughter] That’s accurate.


0:03:54.5 Jordan Syatt: What time did you wake up?


0:03:55.4 Mike Vacanti: I woke up on the back end of his workout. So I woke up at 6:53 and woke up to text from him and then like pictures of him in the gym on the treadmill, like showing me what he was doing in there.


0:04:09.2 Jordan Syatt: Wow. Did you call him?


0:04:09.3 Mike Vacanti: No, we were just texting. It was like workout’s done at seven and yeah. But…


0:04:14.0 Jordan Syatt: Wow, let’s go, Gary. That’s awesome.


0:04:14.4 Mike Vacanti: Let’s go Gary, for getting done. And also, we’re not going to name drop or anything here. But do you remember the time I was like deathly sick and literally set an alarm and slept straight through it? This time I just… I forgot to set an alarm, I don’t know how. But 10 plus years ago, set an alarm, slept through it and missed a few in person coaching sessions. And then had like a real punishment, and I don’t even know if it was legal, like docked my pay for a bunch of… Like I had to work a bunch of hours for free. And I was just like, okay, like if that’s what… You know, I didn’t think anything of it. But in hindsight, it was kind of wild.


0:04:58.5 Jordan Syatt: That wasn’t Gary. People have to know like Gary did not do that.


0:05:01.4 Mike Vacanti: No, no, no, no, no, no. This was a different gym owner who I really like and like help me and good dude. But that one instance was pretty wild.


0:05:12.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, that’s nuts. Oh, man. Wow. I’m glad it all worked out well. I was expecting Gary to be like…


0:05:18.7 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think he’s listening anymore these days. We’ll leave it in as a little Easter egg. If he’s listening, bro… Bro, if you’re listening and you heard that we gotta golf sometime soon. You gotta come visit and we gotta go golfing.


0:05:30.0 Jordan Syatt: I’m not going golfing. You two can golf. I’m not a golfer.


0:05:33.2 Mike Vacanti: I know you had a golfing experience not long ago that you really didn’t enjoy.


0:05:37.1 Jordan Syatt: I enjoyed it because I was… I was like the heckler in Happy Gilmore. I was like the jackass, and I thought it was really funny. But two of the guys thought it was funny. One of the guys was pissed. One of the guys on the trip was really upset with me and it was my first time meeting him. And yeah, I’m not a golfer, dude. I just I can’t… The culture I don’t like. The sport I respect the skill of it. But like golf culture is just not my arena.


0:06:12.5 Mike Vacanti: I think… I think it actually is. I think you just golfed with a couple of people who were on the douchier side for lack of a better term, but a pretty accurate term.


0:06:17.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah.


0:06:20.5 Mike Vacanti: But Jordan was… Jordan was like… By the third hole you had given up on your golf performance and even like… The thing you were having the most fun with was talking while this guy was swinging to piss him off as much as you could to make the other people laugh. And like if I was like golf… I probably would have taken a swing at you.


0:06:36.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah. Basically, what happened was like from the beginning, I was like, I’m not… Like, I don’t care how well I do. Like I was not invested in my performance at all. So I was just fucking around trying to make him laugh with me. And then this one kid, he hit the ball. And like, as soon as club hit ball, I just… Like not trying to be funny. I said, “Oh, nice hit” or whatever. Like I was just trying to be me. Just nice. But it was… Ended up being a terrible hit. Like, because it just… You can’t know from that immediate moment. So but I was just trying to be nice. And the other two kids started losing it laughing as soon as… And for me, if I get a laugh, it’s a game over. Like I’m just going to keep doing that thing over and over and over again, just because like I get that laugh. That’s like oxygen to me. And so then consistently, I was just like sort of talking shit. Every time he like backswings… “Oh, that was sick!” Yeah, the other two thought it was a hit.


0:07:40.0 Mike Vacanti: It’s funny.


0:07:41.1 Jordan Syatt: No pun intended.


0:07:45.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. So Jordan’s not a golfer. It’s all good.


0:07:47.2 Jordan Syatt: Well, What’s funny?


0:07:51.0 Mike Vacanti: Comedians and their proclivity to be ESTPs and like, be able to navigate how other people are reacting to things and also like so desperately like to get the reaction that they’re going for. I was watching Shane Gillis host SNL. We’re filming a little bit in advance. So this was a few weeks ago. He was getting so much positive feedback. I was like, Oh, I got to listen to this monologue that he did, because I don’t know, he got fired from the show. Then they brought him back on because he’s gotten so popular online…


0:08:17.0 Jordan Syatt: I just watched it this morning.


0:08:20.1 Mike Vacanti: The number of… Like the amount that he was and Schulz did this too at VeeCon. The amount that these guys like are gauging the audience response to what they’re saying and then visibly pissed when they don’t get the response they want is mind-blow… So when I saw him doing that, I immediately was like “Shane Gillis MBTI.” “Shane Gillis is an ESTP that…” I was like…


0:08:42.9 Jordan Syatt: Oh, is he really?


0:08:44.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:08:44.7 Jordan Syatt: Interesting. Yeah, I mean, it blows my mind when people don’t do that. When people like don’t look at people’s reactions, facial expressions, listen to their tonality, like body movements. It’s funny, like, we joke about how… How to Win Friends and Influence People Dale Carnegie, like that just all made sense to me naturally. I’m reading a new book right now. It’s called Never Split the Difference by Chris Voss. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of it.


0:09:10.8 Mike Vacanti: Yep.


0:09:14.6 Jordan Syatt: Really good book. He’s a… He was a hostage negotiator for the FBI. And this is another example of like where he’s explaining you listen for the tonality, you watch their body movement, and all of this stuff. I’m like, I can’t believe this is a book. Like this is like the tone inflections. And like, when you see them do this, it’s like, for me, I’m reading it like this is very cool. But like, I intuitively do this stuff all the time. It would be weird for me… It’s weird for me to think that people don’t do that all the time.


0:09:39.3 Mike Vacanti: It’s definitely beneficial if you know what outcome you’re trying to get.


0:09:44.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah.


0:09:45.6 Mike Vacanti: And in comedy, you’re trying to get laughs because that’s dollars. That’s the career. So it makes sense.


0:09:51.8 Jordan Syatt: For whatever it’s worth and Shane’s stand up… There was one time that he said, “I thought that was going to get a bigger laugh,” that I think he was serious about. But the other times I think it was part of his routine, where he had certain lines that didn’t get a big laugh, but he deliberately said it knowing that that line wasn’t going to get a laugh. And that actually ended up getting a laugh him saying. There was one part where I saw was like, oh, yeah, he definitely expected that to be a bigger hit. But I think there were two other times where he said something like that, where I think it was part of his routine about that.


0:10:22.5 Mike Vacanti: He thought that was funny?


0:10:23.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, yeah.


0:10:25.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:10:25.7 Jordan Syatt: He’s super funny, man. He’s…


0:10:27.4 Mike Vacanti: He is I didn’t think he… I didn’t think he was in the monologue. But he is in general.


0:10:32.5 Jordan Syatt: He looked visibly nervous. He… And he even said it. He was like, “I’m really nervous right now.” Like he looked more nervous than I’ve ever seen him, ever. Like he looked like…


0:10:42.0 Mike Vacanti: I would be too.


0:10:44.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, SNL, especially being fired from it. And with cancel culture. I mean, and of course, literally, as soon as he comes out, like he’s being attacked by all these like, they had Shane Gillis on this, like, racist misogynist, like… Like immediately attacked as soon as he’s done with it. Even before he did it, he started like all these news stations were being like, they shouldn’t bring him on. This is bad. Like, I’m not surprised he was super, super nervous.


0:11:08.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Makes sense. What are you sipping on?


0:11:12.7 Jordan Syatt: I’ve got three drinks. I’ve got my water right here. Right? Then I’ve got my coffee right here. Then I’ve got a little ginger ale right here.


0:11:24.7 Mike Vacanti: Oh, nice.


0:11:26.4 Jordan Syatt: What are you drinking?


0:11:26.5 Mike Vacanti: Trio of hydration. Just water.


0:11:27.9 Jordan Syatt: Just water.


0:11:29.6 Mike Vacanti: Just reverse osmosis filtered water.


0:11:30.9 Jordan Syatt: Wow. You have a water filter in your house?


0:11:34.4 Mike Vacanti: Yes.


0:11:34.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:11:34.4 Mike Vacanti: Might be the best $300 I’ve ever spent, to be honest.


0:11:37.1 Jordan Syatt: Does it taste different?


0:11:37.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, it tastes… It tastes like nothing. It tastes delicious. It’s actually one of the downsides is because now all other water has a tinge. But certainly worth it to get all the crap out of there.


0:11:53.8 Jordan Syatt: Is it a plastic container?


0:11:55.7 Mike Vacanti: Don’t worry about that, Jordan. Don’t worry. Don’t worry about that, Jordan. Don’t worry about that. Not the bad plastic.


0:12:04.7 Jordan Syatt: Bro, you should get this thing. This is… This is a… You should get this.


0:12:08.3 Mike Vacanti: I know. I know what it is. Jordan is holding up a Stanley cup and he’s about to make a…


0:12:12.4 Jordan Syatt: No, it’s not a Stanley. It’s not a Stanley.


0:12:15.1 Mike Vacanti: What is it? A boy Stanley?


0:12:15.5 Jordan Syatt: No, it’s a HyrdoJug.


0:12:17.6 Mike Vacanti: It’s a Stanley knockoff.


0:12:17.7 Jordan Syatt: Yes, it’s… Stanley knockoff is better.


0:12:18.7 Mike Vacanti: When’s your glute guide coming up?


0:12:20.4 Jordan Syatt: I’m not doing a glute guide.


0:12:22.1 Mike Vacanti: You got your Stanley. You’re dropping a glute guide. You got your…


0:12:27.6 Jordan Syatt: My booty bands. I need to get some booty bands to sell. Yeah, yeah. I think those took a real rise and fall. I don’t see anyone really doing booty bands anymore. Those were like really big for a couple years. And now I don’t see… I think like everyone who made them really regrets it. Like, I don’t really see anyone using them anymore.


0:12:46.3 Mike Vacanti: Oh, like maybe as a product line?


0:12:47.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah. Because like research was like, “this is a waste.”


0:12:52.0 Mike Vacanti: Unnecessary.


0:12:52.1 Jordan Syatt: It’s like really doing nothing for you. Yeah.


0:12:53.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Let’s fire up some questions. People love questions.


0:13:00.4 Jordan Syatt: All right. I don’t know if you’re gonna like this question or not. Let’s see. “What are some tips for balancing working out, school and sleep?”


0:13:06.5 Mike Vacanti: Hmm. Yeah, we can talk about that. What do you think college or high school?


0:13:10.5 Jordan Syatt: I would imagine this is probably college but like it doesn’t even necessarily just have to be about school. Like it could be balancing work, working out and sleep, school, working out and sleep. Like just balancing life in general. Probably a good discussion to have and it could be for fitness but also could be like for business like as a business owner starting out how do I balance working out? Well, building my business and sleep all that stuff.


0:13:39.2 Mike Vacanti: You want to start?


0:13:40.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, you don’t want to do this one?


0:13:44.3 Mike Vacanti: You just threw a lot at me. You threw a lot. You made it more complicated. Then there were several different situations and then talking about business owners and… Yeah, I’ll talk about it. This sounds like it’s coming from a fitness enthusiast or are we assuming it’s not?


0:14:00.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it is. It is. It is.


0:14:01.6 Mike Vacanti: Okay.


0:14:02.8 Jordan Syatt: It’s on my account so it’s a fitness enthusiast not a coach.


0:14:05.5 Mike Vacanti: You can lead on this one.


0:14:07.0 Jordan Syatt: You want me to lead? Okay. I mean my go-to answer is always one of the best things I ever heard which is out of fitness, sleep, business, family and friends, out of those five things you can ever really only focus on two at one time and that’s like at most. Oftentimes, it’s really just one where you really focus on it and then you do your best to maintain the rest. So I think what I will say is if we’re talking to a college kid, you can definitely do more than one. You can do at least two, sometimes even three. Unless you’re in med school or engineering or law school. That’s different. But if you’re just liberal arts, you’ve got time. Even when I was in exercise science, you’ve got fucking time. You do. They’re really intense degrees. No, I understand it but that’s like having more than a full-time job. But if you’re in college, you can focus on fitness and school and sleep and that really shouldn’t be an issue unless you’re deliberately choosing not to. But as you get older, you’re out of school, you have more priorities then I think it drops down to two and then depending on how seriously you want to take it, it could just be one.


0:15:38.9 Jordan Syatt: And so, For example, when I was coaching Gary, my one singular focus was business. That was it. That’s all I focused on. Business was number one. My health got worse. I lost some friendships and other relationships because that was my singular focus. My sleep went down the drain. I didn’t have to do that but I chose to do that for the sake of growing my business and that was a decision and I don’t regret it but that’s what I did during those years. I definitely would not do that right now. Someone asked me in a speaking event the other day, how would you have handled it if you were married and had a kid? I was like, “I wouldn’t have taken the job.” I wouldn’t have taken the job coaching Gary if I was married and had a kid, just based on the requirements of that job. There’s a completely different time of my life and requirements that wouldn’t have worked. But I think from a college perspective, generally speaking, you have plenty of time to do it but then as you get older, it makes sense to look at life as various seasons and say, in this season, I’m going to focus on one or two things.


0:16:42.4 Jordan Syatt: So maybe now I’m going to focus on my business and my own fitness, which for a business owner in the personal training world, that’s a really good idea. Having three to five years where you just go super hard on your own fitness and your own business and that’s all you focus on for three to five years, especially if you’re younger, that’s the winning strategy. If you’re older and maybe you have a family and not as much time, then I would still say the same thing but you have to understand, generally speaking, the older you are, the more responsibilities you have. You’re not going to have as much time as these young bucks. You’ve got a 23-year-old, 25-year-old kid, they’re going to have way more, not even just time, but the mental, emotional capacity, the energy to be working way more than you are probably. And If you’re the outlier that can do that at 70 years old, amazing, crush it. That’s fucking awesome but it’s usually not how it goes.


0:17:43.1 Jordan Syatt: I do think that the word balance is very overrated. I think that people are so often told you have to find balance, have to find balance, have to find balance. I really don’t think balance is very realistic, especially early on. I think it’s something that you can develop over time once you’ve spent enough time unbalanced and you’ve built up enough ability to balance a lot of what you’ve built. But when you’re in the building phase, it’s hard to have balance because you’re still building it. Once you’ve built up enough, then you can balance them out. But if you haven’t built something, you need to focus on that and be unbalanced in order to build it.


0:18:20.4 Mike Vacanti: So I agree and disagree.


0:18:22.3 Jordan Syatt: All right.


0:18:23.6 Mike Vacanti: Or maybe I just… Maybe I just agree. We’ll see. Because maybe I don’t know. I think what you described that we’ve talked about a lot on this podcast going back years, which is that building an online business, you need to be unbalanced early on or be incredibly patient and be balanced but just know that it could take 5 to 10 years to get to where you otherwise could have gotten in two to three years unbalanced. I think that advice is pretty specific to not just building an online fitness business, but like to becoming great in something very narrow. Like for the average college student, and you differentiated there.


0:19:14.0 Mike Vacanti: But even like for the average working person who’s working a nine-to-five and also wants to lose 20 pounds of body fat and, you know, learn how to lift weights and also wants to spend time with their family and also wants like a reasonable social life, I think you can balance those four things and still make steady progress on each of them. Or maybe three of the things like, you know, we can argue semantics over what the number is. But I think when you are building your own business, that’s when you see the most upside to being unbalanced for a period of time.


0:19:50.2 Jordan Syatt: I agree with that.


0:19:51.8 Mike Vacanti: Two, three, four years. Shifting gears a little, for me personally, if I was in college again, the thing that I would do less of is the “fun socializing”. Like the… I made a lot of great memories with friends, but I think they would’ve stood out to me in the same way had I made 30% less of those memories with friends. And maybe it’s just… It just comes with the territory of being in that age range. Well, maybe not because you weren’t doing that.


0:20:28.8 Jordan Syatt: Not for me.


0:20:28.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:20:28.9 Jordan Syatt: I was a loner.


0:20:29.1 Mike Vacanti: But the proclivity for pleasure seeking, whether that be through hookups or getting a girlfriend or alcohol or partying, like all of these things that are associated with college culture in the west are… And maybe I’m just the old guy now or maybe hindsight’s 2020, but they’re all very overrated, in what they provide you with. And by the way, you can still, you know, for most people, balance going out a few nights a week, getting pretty reasonable if not good grades, and getting three to four lifts in a week and having your nutrition somewhat on point. So you actually can balance all of those things, while getting adequate sleep too. I don’t think I answered the question very effectively.


0:21:22.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I think you did.


0:21:23.0 Mike Vacanti: Unbalance is associated in my view, with building something. If you aren’t in a position like you just described, you wouldn’t take the Gary job traveling to London and Tokyo, etcetera. If you had a wife and child, like you would then expect a slower rate of growth in your business because you wouldn’t have been working 18 hours a day.


0:21:44.9 Jordan Syatt: Mm-hmm. Correct.


0:21:45.9 Mike Vacanti: You would’ve been working eight or 10 or I… Who knows what the number is, but you wouldn’t have expected to grow your business as quickly as you did.


0:21:54.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. And I do think that there… There’s a difference between having young kids and having older kids. Right? So, like with young kids, I think if you have older kids, you have more opportunity, right? Your kids probably don’t wanna be around you as much. They’re doing their own thing. They’re more independent with younger… Like if I had a young kid, there’s absolutely no way. With an older kid, I think it would’ve been more doable. And I even see it now. We even see people, in the mentorship and otherwise who, like, they have older kid, they’re like in their 40s and 50s and 60s and they’re fucking crushing it now. And they’re a little bit unbalanced, because they’re dominating their business and their own fitness. But there’s that like tweener period of time that like in the middle maybe you have kids and you’re working a lot.


0:22:37.4 Jordan Syatt: It doesn’t have to be a fitness business where it just, it’s very difficult. Like, it’s super, super challenging. Time is limited. I also think a major difference between a college kid and someone working a regular nine-to-five, generally speaking, a college kid, maybe they go to a class and they have a few hours off, and then… And like with those few hours off, they can go to the gym or they can do something. Whereas with nine-to-five, like generally you’re at the office, right? And even if you’re not at the office, maybe you’re on calls or you’re needed for certain things. I think that’s one of the main differences with that nine-to-five, where even though, even though you can balance it, I think it gets more difficult with a nine-to-five than it does in college.


0:23:16.3 Jordan Syatt: So I think we’re very much in agreement. I think the less… The less, ambitious you are, the more you can balance. The more ambitious you are, the less you can balance. Which makes sense. The more ambitious you are, the more you want to accomplish, the more you really have to focus on that thing you wanna accomplish. The less ambitious you are and the more, like content you are. And not saying one is better than the other, it’s just like, clearly I think like there’s a lot of benefits to being less ambitious, for many different reasons. Probably more content, greater levels of happiness, greater maybe even better community. They like, there’s a lot of…


0:23:57.7 Mike Vacanti: Health, stress and…


0:23:58.8 Jordan Syatt: Health benefits to less ambition.


0:24:02.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:24:02.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. So it’s not saying one or the other, it’s just like categorizing more versus less ambitious. I would say that the less ambitious you are, the more balanced you can be.


0:24:13.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:24:13.4 Jordan Syatt: And with that lower levels ambition, may also come, like you’re… You don’t need to be, as high level of a lifter or get to as low of a level of body fat. You’re just working out for health. So it’s like you need to really figure out what are your goals? What’s your ultimate… What do you ultimately wanna achieve? And then from there, decide, all right. Do I have the ability to be more or less balanced?


0:24:32.6 Mike Vacanti: Good answer.


0:24:34.4 Jordan Syatt: All right. When I’m sleep deprived, it’s very hard to work out and it becomes a cycle. Should I force those workout? Anything with sleep, you’re a fan of.


0:24:42.7 Mike Vacanti: It’s the most… It’s the smoking of our generation for sure. There’s no question maybe sitting.


0:24:53.3 Jordan Syatt: Sitting is the smoking of our generation. The lack of sleep? I definitely agree with.


0:24:58.0 Mike Vacanti: What did you think I meant. That I meant sleep was bad for you like smoking is?


0:25:02.7 Jordan Syatt: No, No, no, no, no. I don’t necessarily agree that sitting is the smoking of our generation, but I definitely agree that lack of sleep is.


0:25:05.4 Mike Vacanti: You don’t think lack of activity?


0:25:08.1 Jordan Syatt: No, I think lack of activity is definitely an issue. But I would say a lack of sleep is a better… Is more analogous to the negative effects of smoking than sitting. I would say.


0:25:20.8 Mike Vacanti: Someone who sits like a zero step count sitting?


0:25:24.1 Jordan Syatt: Well, I would just say, because if you sit a lot, there’s still the ability to offset that with movement later. Like… But with lack of sleep, you really can’t offset that.


0:25:33.2 Mike Vacanti: Naps.


0:25:34.9 Jordan Syatt: But then you’re not getting a lack of sleep.


0:25:39.0 Mike Vacanti: So what’s the balance here? The balance is if you need to miss a workout once in a blue moon because you didn’t get enough sleep, sure. But immediately fix the problem on the front end. Like whatever the issue was, find a way to rectify it. Because what this person is describing is they don’t have their schedule under control or they’re giving into a temptation. Perhaps they’re going out at night, they’re on their phone and they’re tired and they know they should go to sleep and it’s 9:45, but for some reason they scroll for two hours. Or like legitimate reasons, like there’s something going on. They have a sick spouse, like, who knows? But, do what you can that… Within your control so that you are getting enough sleep. And that’s gonna mean sacrificing some things. And it could mean sacrificing leisure and fun and pleasure.


0:26:34.0 Mike Vacanti: And you should sacrifice those things to get out of your sleep deficit and get on track with getting enough sleep. Now, if there’s someone who, you know, one night has an event going late and it… They’re training… Let’s say they’re training Monday, Wednesday, Friday mornings and Tuesday night they have something going on. And so they’re thinking, I’m gonna skip my Wednesday workout even though I’m… I’m just training three hours a week. I’m gonna skip my Wednesday workout because I was up late Tuesday night. And I feel like that would be better for me. No, you should take the one night of less sleep, get up at your alarm and go work out. There’s enough research showing that chronic sleep deprivation negatively impacts strength, but acute sleep deprivation doesn’t impact strength.


0:27:22.5 Mike Vacanti: I think it impacts endurance, but doesn’t impact strength. So if you have one night where instead of getting eight, you’re getting six and a half, go get your workout in the next morning. Not only is that, the workout still gonna be beneficial for you, but it also puts you in a mindset of, I’m not skipping workouts, I’m doing things that are difficult, which bleeds into other areas of your life. Yeah. If you’re acutely sleep deprived, still do your workout. If you’re chronically sleep deprived, get that figured out is my answer.


0:27:55.0 Jordan Syatt: I agree with that completely. All of it. What I’ll add is the component of momentum. That really plays such a huge role that especially like… Learned a lot of that with Gary, where like when he was just unbelievably sleep deprived chronically and it was a major, major issue. But we realized that just getting in the gym, even if it wasn’t the best workout, but just getting in there every day and keeping the momentum going was the most important thing. ‘Cause as soon as you lose the momentum, it’s so freaking hard to pick it back up and get the ball rolling again. And so I think it’s keeping it from the perspective of just keep the momentum going. Just go.


0:28:47.1 Jordan Syatt: Doesn’t have to be the best workout, doesn’t have to be an amazing workout. Doesn’t even have to be the same total volume or intensity, just get there. Get to the gym, do something, move so that it’s still part of your routine. That I think is the critical component of this, where it’s like you don’t have to force yourself through a devastating workout, but you force yourself to get up and keep that routine going. And then like you said, if it’s chronically under sleeping, you got to fix that shit, which now Gary has done.


0:29:14.5 Mike Vacanti: Which Gary did.


0:29:14.5 Jordan Syatt: Gary’s done a really good job of fixing his schedule and his routine. But it wasn’t an overnight thing. It took a while and you got to make the necessary changes to make that happen.


0:29:26.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Great answer. You’re absolutely right too. Because the biggest tragedy in this would be someone who really doesn’t enjoy working out but has been doing it consistently for a while, maybe a number of years, but is like, I’m sleep deprived, I got to get caught up on sleep. I’m gonna stop working out. Three weeks of not lifting for someone who doesn’t enjoy lifting and then to get back on, that person very well might never get back on.


0:29:53.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:29:54.6 Mike Vacanti: And so what you said in regards to momentum is absolutely right. And yes, long-term fix it, which Gary is now getting seven to nine a night, which is… Like in the last month, he’s probably brought it up to me two or three times almost in awe of the fact that like, can you believe it used to be six max for most nights and now…


0:30:17.6 Jordan Syatt: That was a really good night.


0:30:19.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Exactly. And now the place he’s in with his sleep is really… It’s really impressive and hugely beneficial for his health.


0:30:29.2 Jordan Syatt: I remember, I think it was with you when he… When you came back that he really started getting better sleep after a little while. And I remember there was a period of time where in all of his content he was like, sleep is the game. Like he just went on a tear of… He was like, no, sleep is the best. Like you need to be getting sleep. It was, you could see that there was a certain point when he really started loving sleep because he was in… All of his content that’s all he was talking about. And he would be like giving a keynote, sleep. Everyone needs to sleep.


0:31:00.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Well that was also… That was one of the reasons, but I also speculate that his message got misconstrued by so many people, some who like didn’t like him saying, oh, hustle culture’s bad, blah, blah, blah. And taking things he would say out of context that he actually didn’t say and attributing it to him. Like, oh, these people think you should never sleep. It’s like, no, actually I said, it doesn’t matter how much you sleep, it matters what you do while you’re awake. Like, that’s what I actually said. But so part of it may also have been for that reason, but…


0:31:32.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:31:33.8 Mike Vacanti: Good questions so far, Jordan. You’re really picking them well.


0:31:35.4 Jordan Syatt: Dude, I’m trying my best. Now I’ve got pressure for those next one.


0:31:39.3 Mike Vacanti: You’re really picking them well. By the way, you said freaking in that last answer. I don’t think I’ve ever heard you say that word.


0:31:44.7 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know if I’ve ever said that before. No, I don’t know where that came from.


0:31:49.0 Mike Vacanti: It sounded nice. It rolled off the tongue nice for you.


0:31:51.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, really?


0:31:52.5 Mike Vacanti: It didn’t necessitate an f-bomb. It definitely wasn’t like… Didn’t need that level of emphasis, but it was harder than just hard. So you said freaking hard. I think that was very accurate.


0:32:02.0 Jordan Syatt: Do you not like it when I drop the f-bombs?


0:32:05.1 Mike Vacanti: You can do whatever you want.


0:32:07.2 Jordan Syatt: That’s not the question. Wow. You don’t like it when I swear?


0:32:10.1 Mike Vacanti: No, I don’t…


0:32:10.2 Jordan Syatt: Does that bother you?


0:32:10.7 Mike Vacanti: No. No. I’m… No.


0:32:12.8 Jordan Syatt: Okay. But…


0:32:13.0 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know if this is pod… It’s 0%… It’s 0% related to you specifically. In general over the last number of years. And I curse like I still, they come out.


0:32:27.4 Jordan Syatt: I haven’t heard you curse in a while.


0:32:29.8 Mike Vacanti: I’ve… I don’t know why. I’ve been more sensitive to cursing, but not specific to any individual. More just like.


0:32:38.0 Jordan Syatt: Is this, you turn 37 and you’re not a curser anymore.,


0:32:41.0 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know what it is, but…


0:32:44.5 Jordan Syatt: Does your dad curse?


0:32:45.6 Mike Vacanti: Not often, but yeah. If he’s… If the emotion triggers it, I guess, I don’t know.


0:32:55.2 Jordan Syatt: All right. I’ll be mindful of my cursing.


0:32:55.3 Mike Vacanti: No, no, no, no. You don’t have to make it… [laughter] ESTP just like… No.


0:33:06.3 Jordan Syatt: All right. Well, let’s…


0:33:08.2 Mike Vacanti: Now you’re gonna make a joke out of it. Freaking darn gosh, darn It. No, Jordan, I want you to be you.


0:33:21.4 Jordan Syatt: All right, let’s see.


0:33:23.7 Mike Vacanti: I didn’t turn 37 yet. I just… For the last three minutes, I thought I was 37 for some reason.


0:33:29.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, you’re only 36. Well, you’re 37 soon.


0:33:33.5 Mike Vacanti: You had me sold on my… On the wrong age.


0:33:35.8 Jordan Syatt: So you just… Did you just do math. You were like, hold on.


0:33:39.9 Mike Vacanti: No, but I was just like, yeah, I’m getting up there. Yeah, yeah. I’m gonna be 30… I was like, wait, no, no, no, no, no.


0:33:47.9 Jordan Syatt: Dude, I think this was the fastest year ever…


0:33:50.3 Mike Vacanti: Of your life?


0:33:52.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Birthday is coming up.


0:33:54.0 Mike Vacanti: This might be… And I can’t prove this, but the speed of time accelerating seems to be related to habits. So if you were to be very consistent in what you did day to day from like 41 to 42, but then from 42 to 43, you had a whole bunch of new experiences. I think the new experiences year would seem longer, whereas there’s something about…


0:34:18.0 Jordan Syatt: Oh, really?


0:34:21.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. And there’s just the fact that time…


0:34:23.5 Jordan Syatt: ‘Cause you’re more present?


0:34:23.5 Mike Vacanti: There’s just the fact that time is relative, like from age… From age nine to age 10, that was 10% of your life, which is a huge chunk of your life. So it felt like it was taking forever and it felt like a long time.


0:34:36.5 Jordan Syatt: That’s a good point.


0:34:37.2 Mike Vacanti: But from age 29 to 30 is like 3% of your life. So it there… There’s something to the relativity of time. Yeah.


0:34:47.4 Jordan Syatt: That Absolutely makes a huge difference. I wonder like if you’re 79 going on 80, if the year feels fast or slow.


0:34:54.4 Mike Vacanti: It does. I’ve talked to a bunch of older people about this, like in their 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s. And like they say that time continues to speed up as you get older. But I think part of that’s within your control. If you… If you continue to work to have new experiences, I think you can slow it down to a degree.


0:35:10.7 Jordan Syatt: That’s very interesting. I would’ve thought the opposite. I would’ve thought that new experiences slow it down.


0:35:15.6 Mike Vacanti: They do.


0:35:16.6 Jordan Syatt: I mean, I would’ve thought the opposite. That new experiences speed it up.


0:35:19.1 Mike Vacanti: Habits, like put you on autopilot. And so when you’re… When you’re super routinized… I don’t remember if James Clear talked about this somewhere related to habits or not. Yeah. There’s definitely something to the concept though.


0:35:35.0 Jordan Syatt: How is this year for you? Did it go by fast?


0:35:38.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. The years have been going by faster for me. Yeah. Whenever I do like a… Like 2014 to 2017 felt like a long time for me.


0:35:54.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:35:56.2 Mike Vacanti: But 2018 to 2024 felt like nothing.


0:36:02.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I feel like 2011 to 2019 took a long time. But 2020 to 2024… I can’t believe it’s already 2024. Like that’s… It’s went by so fast.


0:36:24.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Well, all the mean… Like, you know, “oh, 2019, that was two years ago.” It’s like, no, that was five years ago.


0:36:28.2 Jordan Syatt: It feels like that.


0:36:31.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:36:31.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s crazy.


0:36:31.6 Mike Vacanti: Some of that’s definitely COVID related. And like 2020’s just a sharp… Was such a sharp change in the day-to-day lives for so many of us. And… Yeah.


0:36:44.6 Jordan Syatt: Mike asked to increase his freeroll on me the other day.


0:36:48.4 Mike Vacanti: We’ll talk about this in a second, but first, I… For a while, over the last six to 12 months, there were periods of time where I would say I’m getting old, or I feel like we would say like, we’re getting old. I’m going to stop doing that because I really think that we speak that into existence.


0:37:08.8 Jordan Syatt: By old you mean like speaking the hat… Like the… Not just the age, but what comes with being old.


0:37:14.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:37:15.5 Jordan Syatt: Like the mentality lifestyle.


0:37:16.1 Mike Vacanti: Whether it’s like sneaky joints or whether it’s any of the negative things that you would associate with it. I don’t want to… And I don’t even like this word at all, but I don’t wanna manifest them for myself. And I think there is something to speaking what you want.


0:37:29.7 Jordan Syatt: Wow. I didn’t realize you were manifesting.


0:37:33.1 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think I am, but I don’t wanna be. So I’m not gonna be. [chuckle] I’m not.


0:37:39.6 Jordan Syatt: I’ve definitely never heard you use that word before. That’s crazy.


0:37:44.1 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know why that came to me.


0:37:44.2 Jordan Syatt: You’re so young now. Yeah, you’ve manifested young.


0:37:48.4 Mike Vacanti: I’m quite youth. [laughter] I’m quite young. There’s just no reason to talk yourself into having a bad back if you don’t have to. When you could just…


0:38:01.3 Jordan Syatt: Dude.


0:38:02.3 Mike Vacanti: When you could just stretch.


0:38:02.4 Jordan Syatt: Just do mobility.


0:38:04.4 Mike Vacanti: What were… Oh, oh, freeroll?


0:38:04.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Freeroll.


0:38:07.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:38:07.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:38:07.7 Mike Vacanti: Well, I thought I was gonna catch Jordan sleeping. ‘Cause he was… So, Jordan and I have this freeroll. Are we gonna describe it?


0:38:14.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, ’cause most people who listen for a while will know, but for the people who don’t, we can just quickly describe it.


0:38:20.7 Mike Vacanti: So I don’t remember what drove you to say that you’re done at 10.


0:38:28.2 Jordan Syatt: Well, I think you asked, you were like, what’s enough?


0:38:32.9 Mike Vacanti: Oh yes.


0:38:33.7 Jordan Syatt: Like what’s your number?


0:38:34.5 Mike Vacanti: Yes. Yeah. When we were talking about money and I said, what’s… And you said, I think we already… We already talked about this.


0:38:39.2 Jordan Syatt: You said what number do you think would be the number that you could everything is set, family’s set, finances are set.


0:38:47.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, you know what it was? It was around safety and security. And when would you feel good and not feel fear around money?


0:38:56.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I think it was like, what number would you need to have in the bank to feel good and no fear. And I said 10 million is what I would need in the bank to have no fear around money and to lose that concern.


0:39:07.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. And then I said…


0:39:11.1 Jordan Syatt: And then you said, if you ever get 10 million, would you stop posting on social media?


0:39:17.6 Mike Vacanti: I think I actually said, yeah, but once you get to 10, you’re just gonna keep going and set a new goal. You’re still gonna be posting, building businesses…


0:39:23.1 Jordan Syatt: Oh yeah. That’s what happens.


0:39:24.7 Mike Vacanti: And doing all this. And you’re like, no, I’m not.


0:39:27.5 Jordan Syatt: No. Yeah. I was like, then I’m done.


0:39:28.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:39:28.5 Jordan Syatt: And you were like, no, you’re not.


0:39:30.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Knowing you and your personality and yeah, I was like, absolutely not. And you’re like, yes I am. And you were very confident.


0:39:37.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I am super confident that if that is to ever happen… That if that is to ever happen, which should be an outrageous amount to ever have, and I’m nowhere close, not even nowhere close to that. If I was to ever get to that point, I would stop for sure. I’d retire…


0:39:51.0 Mike Vacanti: And so Jordan offered me $100,000 freeroll, or I don’t remember how it came about, but it was basically like, I’m so confident in this that if I keep posting and keep building, I’ll give you $100,000. I was like, all right, cool.


0:40:04.3 Jordan Syatt: No, you asked, you were like, can I have a freeroll? And I was like, what’s a freeroll? And you were like, it’s a bet where if you do this, if you don’t abide by this, then I’ll get 100,000. And I said, well, what do I get? And you said, nothing. It’s a freeroll. And I was like, “Okay. Deal.”


0:40:19.5 Mike Vacanti: That’s what a freeroll is. Well, because you were so confident that… You were so confident that you’re gonna stop at 10. I was like, all right, give me a freeroll.


0:40:26.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. And I’m still so confident.


0:40:30.3 Mike Vacanti: I know what it was, I saw that tweet, right? Is that what sparked it?


0:40:33.4 Jordan Syatt: Oh yeah. You sent me the tweet. You sent me the tweet. Yeah. Yeah.


0:40:35.9 Mike Vacanti: This, who was that guy?


0:40:38.1 Jordan Syatt: I got it right here.


0:40:39.3 Mike Vacanti: Austin, the creator of Morning Brew. His name’s Austin something. He tweeted…


0:40:43.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, Austin Rief.


0:40:47.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Do you wanna read the tweet?


0:40:47.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. He said, “it’s funny how everyone I know who has two to 3 million thinks the magic number is 10 million. And everyone I know who has 10 million thinks the magic number is 25 million. And everyone I know who has 25 million thinks the magic number is 100 million.” And then I said to you, and I was like, it’s 10 million.


0:41:02.8 Mike Vacanti: And you’re like, “No, this guy’s wrong. Mine’s 10 million.” The reason why… Well, I mean not because he used the number 10 as an example, which is why I thought it was funny. But I could relate to that so much in, okay, 100, I’ll feel good when I have 100,000 in the bank getting started, and then I’ll feel 200. And basically the number has shifted. And once I had recognized that pattern in myself happen, I don’t know, three or four or five times, then it’s like, okay, well this is something that just like you reset the goalpost every time it happens. So I was feeling… I was partly just joking, just bantering a little bit. I was like, “Hey, let me bump that freeroll up to 500.” And usually you’d laugh or I don’t know what I expect your reaction to be, but you were like, no, I’m not letting you bump it up.


0:42:03.8 Jordan Syatt: Absolutely. It’s like you already got a freeroll. I’m not increasing it more for zero benefit to me. Absolutely not. Dude, you know what? I think it’s 10 for so many reasons, but I remember the 100,000, all that stuff. But then when you start to realize how much they take in taxes and how much just life costs. Like it’s…


0:42:26.3 Mike Vacanti: No, no, no, no. Once you have 10, they’re not taking any more in taxes because it doesn’t matter what your… I mean, sure. The interest income on the returns.


0:42:38.1 Jordan Syatt: Do they take taxes on interest?


0:42:38.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:42:41.5 Jordan Syatt: Shut the fuck up. Are you serious? I’m sorry to swear.


0:42:45.1 Mike Vacanti: The government…


0:42:46.2 Jordan Syatt: They take taxes on income?


0:42:46.4 Mike Vacanti: Dude hang on, that’s stupid. You don’t need to change your behavior. All right. That wasn’t… You pried that out of me. I don’t even… Like stop. Don’t do that. Yeah, no, not… On interest income. Yeah, on returns, like capital gain. If you buy a stock and then the stock increases and then you sell it. If it’s within less than one year, it’s a short-term capital gain. And you pay, I believe, the same rate as your income, which is wild because it just is.


0:43:17.6 Jordan Syatt: That’s crazy.


0:43:18.8 Mike Vacanti: And if it’s long-term capital gains and you’re definitely paying 20% on your long-term capital gains, unless those numbers have changed. But it’s like you either pay zero, 15% or 20% on cap gains depending on what your income is. But yeah, interest income is ordinary income. You’re paying interest on that. The government has its hands in everything. You know what else is wild?


0:43:46.5 Jordan Syatt: Wait, so if you have… What?


0:43:48.4 Mike Vacanti: Let’s say you buy a house, you get a 30-year mortgage, you work your tail off for 30 years, you pay off your entire house, you’ve bought the land, you’ve bought the property, you’ve paid the bank, the loan is gone. You’re still renting it from the government. You still are paying…


0:44:02.9 Jordan Syatt: What does that mean?


0:44:04.4 Mike Vacanti: It means that if you don’t pay your property taxes, which are pretty substantial in most States, government’s taking your house from you. You don’t… You can’t, and we think of America as unbelievably prosperous and it is, but you don’t even own your land. You’re renting your land from Uncle Sam.


0:44:20.4 Jordan Syatt: ‘Cause you still have to pay taxes on it.


0:44:22.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. And property taxes are a lot.


0:44:24.5 Jordan Syatt: I didn’t think about that. Yeah, they’re a lot, they’re a significant amount of money.


0:44:26.3 Mike Vacanti: Especially they are high in… You guys don’t have any income tax in Texas. But yeah.


0:44:30.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, we did the numbers on it. Even though property taxes are high in Texas, it’s still less than I would be paying if I was in New York or something.


0:44:39.4 Mike Vacanti: For sure.


0:44:40.1 Jordan Syatt: In terms of the state tax and all of that.


0:44:42.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, way less.


0:44:46.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, but it’s still a huge amount of money. I didn’t think about it like that. Man, even if you own your land, you still don’t really own your land.


0:44:50.8 Mike Vacanti: But what’s the difference between five and 10 at 5%? It’s basically cost of living. Okay.


0:45:00.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:45:00.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:45:00.8 Jordan Syatt: You just have… Probably you have more wiggle room, right? You have more wiggle room. But let me ask you this, so let’s say you’ve got…


0:45:09.8 Mike Vacanti: You have more interest income coming in at 10% versus 5% assuming.


0:45:15.8 Jordan Syatt: Correct, yep. Double.


0:45:17.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, or I don’t even wanna say interest income. You have a higher rate of… You have more returns, and so you then can spend at a higher rate. Which always brings me back to that Benjamin Franklin quote that I misattributed like eight, nine months ago on the pod, which is.


0:45:33.8 Jordan Syatt: What is it?


0:45:33.9 Mike Vacanti: “There are two ways of being happy. We may either diminish our wants or augment our means, either will do the result in the same.” Although I heard a way better version of it because that was…


0:45:46.7 Jordan Syatt: I was just watching your face as you were reading that you’re like, this doesn’t…


0:45:52.1 Mike Vacanti: I was like this isn’t the quote. “There are two ways to increase your wealth, increase your means or decrease your wants. The best is to do both at the same time.” I’m not liking any of these variations, but basically you can either make more or need less.


0:46:10.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s better. I like that one.


0:46:10.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:46:11.2 Jordan Syatt: Mike Vacanti, we’ll just quote that. Yeah, make more and need less. Yeah, and I would like to do both, and I just think that having 10 would mean that there’s no more concerns.


0:46:26.5 Mike Vacanti: The thing is the people with 10 are trying to…


0:46:30.7 Jordan Syatt: Financially.


0:46:30.8 Mike Vacanti: The people with 10 are trying to get to 50 though.


0:46:31.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, they’re losers because they don’t realize that they’ve got it. They’re good.


0:46:36.9 Mike Vacanti: What about the people who are at five and they’re content and they’re living great and they see people aiming for 10 and they’re like, why does he need that much when you could be here?


0:46:44.8 Jordan Syatt: I mean, good for them.


0:46:46.0 Mike Vacanti: I sent you… When we were having this discussion a month or two ago, I sent you the clip of the podcast where the people had the guest on. We definitely talked about this here too, so we’ll be very quick. But basically there’s the two podcast hosts of My First Million, and then the guest and one of the hosts is terribly afraid that he doesn’t have enough when he has tens of millions, many tens of millions. And then the guest had 100 million, or maybe between 50 and 300 million. I don’t remember the exact number, but he was also terrified that he didn’t have enough, and the third guy on the podcast is like after minutes and minutes of these two going back and forth, like being neurotic, he’s like, I can’t tell if you guys are just posturing and doing this out of some branding. Or if you’re both delusional and neurotic and just terrified of losing everything. And they’re both like, yeah, it’s the second one. We’re serious. We’re really afraid.


0:47:54.1 Jordan Syatt: We’re dead serious. This is an actual legitimate concern.


0:47:56.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:48:00.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Needing less is definitely a real power play.


0:48:03.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but at the end of the day, because we’re mortal, there’s no such thing as ultimate safety and security.


0:48:12.8 Jordan Syatt: But let me ask you this. This is less philosophical. Let’s say you have your money in a high interest savings account, right? Do you pay taxes on the interest you get from that savings account?


0:48:26.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:48:28.8 Jordan Syatt: What is… Why?


0:48:31.3 Mike Vacanti: Because it’s income. It’s interest income.


0:48:36.1 Jordan Syatt: It’s purely from your money though.


0:48:40.4 Mike Vacanti: Any realized gain on the stock…


0:48:41.8 Jordan Syatt: It’s not like I’m working for it. It’s like it’s already… The work’s been done. I’m just putting it in there and the bank is paying me for saying, thank you for using us.


0:48:50.8 Mike Vacanti: My brother… My brother, you should be grateful that we don’t have a net worth tax yet because…


0:48:57.4 Jordan Syatt: Thank God.


0:48:57.7 Mike Vacanti: Because that is in the works from many people in Congress and there are people who want that.


0:49:05.6 Jordan Syatt: That’s crazy.


0:49:06.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:49:07.1 Jordan Syatt: That’s absolutely crazy.


0:49:08.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:49:08.6 Jordan Syatt: And you should be grateful there’s no net worth tax either.


0:49:15.0 Mike Vacanti: Jordan’s a funny guy. Sometimes there’s a delay, but he always gets the joke in there. But I’m saying you’re like, oh my gosh, they tax interest income.


0:49:25.3 Jordan Syatt: That’s crazy. Then it’s really not even like I get that percentage interest. I get half of that.


0:49:30.9 Mike Vacanti: No, you get more than half. You’re in a zero state income taxed state. You get at least two third, you get two thirds of it.


0:49:38.3 Jordan Syatt: Dude, taxes are the worst. There’s nothing that will put me in a worse mood than taxes.


0:49:45.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I don’t know that we need to go down that. It’s just like… It would be nice if government operated more like a well-oiled, publicly traded company and the tax money we paid was used more efficiently and each dollar got more done. That would be great. They’re definitely… Due to the inherent unfairness in life, there needs to be some redistribution.


0:50:16.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I agree with that.


0:50:17.7 Mike Vacanti: But yeah.


0:50:18.6 Jordan Syatt: I wish they told us exactly where our dollars went. I think they should be required to say…


0:50:25.2 Mike Vacanti: I think they do.


0:50:26.2 Jordan Syatt: Where?


0:50:27.4 Mike Vacanti: You want me to start listing things on this podcast?


0:50:31.7 Jordan Syatt: No, I need to go see where… I would like to have a notebook or some type of an AI where it’s like, yeah, here’s how much we took from you. This is how much went into this and this is paid to…


0:50:48.4 Mike Vacanti: Well, no. But here’s what you can see is you can see government…


0:50:52.5 Jordan Syatt: Spending.


0:50:55.2 Mike Vacanti: Revenue and spending.


0:50:56.6 Jordan Syatt: But then they lose money somehow all the time. Oh, we don’t know where that money went. And like oh, so like oh you don’t know where those billions of dollars went?


0:51:01.6 Mike Vacanti: Trillion… Trillions sometimes.


0:51:02.8 Jordan Syatt: That’s crazy. Yeah, it’s insane.


0:51:04.9 Mike Vacanti: There have been times in not too distant history where trillions of dollars were lost.


0:51:13.3 Jordan Syatt: Wasn’t around 9/11, right around 9/11 there were trillions of dollars that just went out of nowhere and…


0:51:19.6 Mike Vacanti: Right before.


0:51:21.4 Jordan Syatt: Didn’t that happen? Right before 9/11?


0:51:21.5 Mike Vacanti: Yep. Right before 9/11, yep.


0:51:23.3 Jordan Syatt: Just crazy. So I would love it if they actually legitimately had to show us, ’cause clearly they don’t have to. I wanna see where’s this money freaking going? Show me.


0:51:37.5 Mike Vacanti: Would be interesting.


0:51:38.0 Jordan Syatt: That’s for sure. That’s for sure. How to become a personal trainer.


0:51:46.0 Mike Vacanti: You get that and some.


0:51:48.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. That and some.


0:51:50.2 Mike Vacanti: Want to do one more question?


0:51:51.7 Jordan Syatt: Let’s not do another question. Let’s just… How is your body comp, how are you feeling right now? You’re maintaining, cutting, bulking, what are you doing?


0:52:01.8 Mike Vacanti: We got a pod today and then we got a pod on Tuesday, and then we have a few weeks off and I’m gonna be in Florida, and when I come back, I’m gonna be in a wonderful place.


0:52:13.7 Jordan Syatt: What do you mean, in terms of your body comp?


0:52:16.3 Mike Vacanti: Habits, consistency. Yeah. Maybe a little body comp, but just yeah, I’m maintaining, I’m…


0:52:30.7 Jordan Syatt: You’re not in a deficit right now?


0:52:30.8 Mike Vacanti: No. I think I’ve been in a surplus a lot of days. I have a client, he’s been with me for a long time. Dude’s a beast, has gotten jacked out of his mind and unbelievably strong. One of his hobbies is baking, and he’s a phenomenal baker, basically…


0:52:51.8 Jordan Syatt: Legit. Yeah.


0:52:53.0 Mike Vacanti: He has a really good career. Really, he crushes it at work, but he could just open a bakery in France and just dominate. This was probably a week ago. He sent us a whole box of goodies, and if it’s in my refrigerator, if it’s in my cupboards. There were all these different variations of chocolate chip cookies that were incredible, these rainbow cookies and yeah.


0:53:28.5 Jordan Syatt: Was it just cookies? Were there anything else in there?


0:53:31.2 Mike Vacanti: Just a bunch of cookies.


0:53:32.1 Jordan Syatt: Oh, that’s all… Did you eat all of them?


0:53:32.6 Mike Vacanti: No, I didn’t eat all of them, but I had quite a few cookies.


0:53:37.1 Jordan Syatt: That’s the difference between you and me. That’s the difference right there, is that you don’t eat all of them.




0:53:51.8 Mike Vacanti: This is why I don’t… Are there… I know there are. What percentage of the population do you think can just keep delicious, highly palatable, like their main type of food in their environment where they’re spending loads of time. So if they work from home and live at home, just in their kitchen and in their cupboards, can just have it there accessible and eat it in reasonable portions and maintain super solid body comp and habits and just never give in. What percent of the population?


0:54:23.5 Jordan Syatt: Less than 3%. Yeah.


0:54:24.1 Mike Vacanti: Yep. Environment is… Do you think environment is over or… I don’t even know how to ask you. Environment is…


0:54:30.6 Jordan Syatt: Under.


0:54:32.1 Mike Vacanti: So under… It’s underrated and under discussed somehow, even though it’s discussed a solid amount.


0:54:38.3 Jordan Syatt: And it’s still very discussed, but it’s still under discussed.


0:54:40.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:54:41.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah.


0:54:42.5 Mike Vacanti: It’s everything.


0:54:43.2 Jordan Syatt: And people hear it and they don’t actually… They’re like, yeah, I know, but then they do nothing to fix it. Environment is, people talk about it and people nod their head. Yeah, environment’s really important. Who you spend your time with is really important. Dah, dah, dah. But then they never change it. That is super… It’s the number one for sure.


0:55:01.2 Mike Vacanti: When I was most on point for many years in New York, the only time I ate dessert was if I went to go buy the ice cream and then bring it back to my apartment and eat the ice cream that I bought. There’s never anything “bingeable” that I just stored in my cupboards or in my fridge or in my freezer.


0:55:23.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:55:25.4 Mike Vacanti: And then you have kids. They have things that they like. Those things are accessible. It’s not easy to manage your environment all the time, but it’s unbelievably useful for setting yourself up for maximum probability of success.


0:55:41.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s tough, man. I mean, we baked cookies this morning for my daughter.


0:55:47.7 Mike Vacanti: This morning.


0:55:51.7 Jordan Syatt: I was like, I wanted to say afternoon. I was like, no. That was before her nap. That was at like 10:00 AM we baked fucking sugar cookies. And I didn’t have any. I just didn’t have any, but I’ll probably have some later ’cause we’ve got a whole tray full of sugar cookies right now that are delicious. Yeah.


0:56:08.7 Mike Vacanti: You didn’t have any dough?


0:56:09.6 Jordan Syatt: I need to get into a deficit. No, I didn’t have any dough, dude, because of my stomach issues.


0:56:16.6 Mike Vacanti: But you got the green light from the doctor on… You haven’t seen the GI yet?


0:56:20.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I got to go see a GI.


0:56:21.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:56:22.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:56:23.0 Mike Vacanti: But as far as the test…


0:56:23.7 Jordan Syatt: No stomach cancer.


0:56:25.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:56:28.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:56:30.5 Mike Vacanti: Which is great.


0:56:30.6 Jordan Syatt: Super helpful.


0:56:31.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, launching the app, you’ve had a lot going on over the last handful of weeks.


0:56:36.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, we’re getting a dog in a couple weeks, dude.


0:56:39.6 Mike Vacanti: What a transition.


0:56:42.4 Jordan Syatt: Well, I’m just thinking of all the stuff we’ve got going on and I’m like, yeah, now I’m gonna add to that. I’m gonna get a dog.


0:56:47.7 Mike Vacanti: Dog might reduce stress.


0:56:49.4 Jordan Syatt: I hope so.


0:56:50.2 Mike Vacanti: You’ll be taking him outside, going on walks.


0:56:54.2 Jordan Syatt: 5:00 in the morning running. Yeah. I’m excited about it. Golden Retriever.


0:57:01.2 Mike Vacanti: That’s exciting. A boy or a girl?


0:57:04.2 Jordan Syatt: I think a boy. ‘Cause we’ve got my wife, my daughter, and then God willing, our other daughter, so it’s just me in a house with a bunch of ladies, so I needed a boy dog.


0:57:13.2 Mike Vacanti: I love that.


0:57:14.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Would you ever get a Dog?


0:57:17.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I’m open to the idea.


0:57:17.9 Jordan Syatt: What’s preventing you? Is it ’cause of the travel?


0:57:20.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, we travel a good amount.


0:57:22.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, that makes sense.


0:57:25.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.


0:57:25.4 Jordan Syatt: What kind of dog would you get if you could get a dog?


0:57:28.2 Mike Vacanti: I haven’t thought about it that much.


0:57:28.8 Jordan Syatt: You don’t wanna say right now.


0:57:30.4 Mike Vacanti: Off the dome, what kind of dog would I want? I really have thought about it zero. I wouldn’t get a husky because of the conditions that we live in and summers, but I think huskies are cool dogs. I don’t love shedding. I haven’t thought about it at all.


0:57:52.0 Jordan Syatt: Cool.


0:57:52.3 Mike Vacanti: You got to lose a little, you were saying?


0:57:53.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I’m a little chubby right now, I’m on the higher end of my maintenance range. I’m at that 155, 156, 156 ish, but my movement’s been super down just because everything with the app and everything going on, my steps have not been good recently. So I would imagine once those pick back up, I’ll naturally lose a little bit. But yeah, I need to rein it in.


0:58:14.6 Mike Vacanti: Let’s rein it in.


0:58:16.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.


0:58:17.1 Mike Vacanti: Great episode.


0:58:18.4 Mike Vacanti: Thanks for listening everyone. We appreciate it. Have an amazing, amazing week. If you like the episode, please leave a five star review on iTunes, Spotify, written reviews help the most. Thank you so much. If you’d like to join the mentorship, you can do that at the link in the show notes. You can apply. And with that being said, have a wonderful week. Talk to you soon.


0:58:37.4 Mike Vacanti: We will see you next week. Have a great week. Goodbye.

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