Episode 264: The Top 20 Forms of Cardio Ranked S to F Tier

0:00:11.7 Mike Vacanti: Hello, Jordan.

0:00:12.3 Jordan Syatt: What’s up, Michael?

0:00:13.0 Mike Vacanti: What are you snacking on?

0:00:14.0 Jordan Syatt: Some oatmeal cookies.

0:00:15.1 Mike Vacanti: What are the macros on those?

0:00:17.3 Jordan Syatt: They are… We’ve got two cookies is 90 calories with 3 grams of fat, 0.6 grams of saturated fat, 4 grams of protein, and 8 grams of fiber and 14 carb.

0:00:33.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s not bad. That’s not bad.

0:00:38.0 Jordan Syatt: They good? Bro, delightful.

0:00:39.3 Mike Vacanti: Nice. Nice. Dude, can we really consider Khabib or Jon Jones the GOAT given that their careers seemingly ended before they should have?

0:00:49.5 Jordan Syatt: I don’t think we can consider Khabib the GOAT just because he never… His lineup of who he faced wasn’t the greatest.

0:01:00.7 Mike Vacanti: Like 24 nobodies and then his last six fights were more legit and then he retired.

0:01:04.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah.

0:01:06.2 Mike Vacanti: Respectfully, nobody…

0:01:09.2 Jordan Syatt: Like one of the best in the world to ever do it, clearly, obviously. But if you just look at who he faced when he faced them, it wasn’t… He can’t be the GOAT for that alone. Jon Jones, however, I think he can, because even though his career was actually cut short…

0:01:26.5 Mike Vacanti: Even dodging Aspinall.

0:01:30.0 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know how much of it was him dodging it versus what’s going on behind the scenes with Dana, and I have no idea. I have no idea what’s going on. I know every fan wanted and wants to see that fight. I think… I don’t know if Jon is worried or if more the UFC is worried about what it would mean if Jon Jones lost.

0:01:52.4 Mike Vacanti: Interesting.

0:01:53.2 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know if Jon is as worried as much as the UFC, because there’s so much behind Jon being untouchable. But then again, Jon essentially lost to, in my opinion, to Dominick Reyes. I thought that he should have won that fight. I think most people did.

0:02:12.5 Mike Vacanti: Anyway, I was just thinking…

0:02:14.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I wasn’t expecting you to dive into that. That was a highly unexpected start to the podcast.

0:02:19.8 Mike Vacanti: Brother, today we are talking about S tier to F tier… 20 forms of cardio.

0:02:28.0 Jordan Syatt: Let’s do it. I love that.

0:02:29.5 Mike Vacanti: Me too.

0:02:30.1 Jordan Syatt: That’s a lot of cardio.

0:02:32.2 Mike Vacanti: Hey, if you’re doing them all, it certainly is. Having some issues with tab management over here. Let’s get it together.

0:02:39.4 Jordan Syatt: You have another Riverside tab open?

0:02:41.1 Mike Vacanti: No, just tried to go to my AI but accidentally opened Safari and opened Notes by accident. I think my computer… I’ve had my computer for about eight years. It’s a MacBook Pro and it’s starting to get a little bit weird on me. I think it’s time to get a new computer.

0:02:57.7 Jordan Syatt: Eight years is a good run.

0:02:58.9 Mike Vacanti: I think eight years is a good run too.

0:03:00.0 Jordan Syatt: Especially with how much you use it.

0:03:01.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah. I’ve deleted a whole bunch of stuff to create more memory, but it continually… I’ll have programs shut down randomly. Sometimes I can’t use it unless it’s charging, like the battery doesn’t hold a charge. Feels like it’s just on its last leg here, unfortunately. We had a good run. You got anything interesting before we start talking cardio?

0:03:27.8 Jordan Syatt: Had a great trip out to Minnesota.

0:03:29.6 Mike Vacanti: Oh, yeah. Let’s go. Yes, you did.

0:03:31.5 Jordan Syatt: Hung out with the Vacanti fam, filmed some great videos for the mentorship.

0:03:36.6 Mike Vacanti: Yes, we did. Yes, we did.

0:03:38.9 Jordan Syatt: I’m excited. It was good. Good to be out in Minnesota.

0:03:42.0 Mike Vacanti: It was a productive trip.

0:03:43.4 Jordan Syatt: I forgot my running shoes, so I did my zone 2 cardio in my boots. Had to get it in.

0:03:49.7 Mike Vacanti: Are they not meant to be run in?

0:03:51.2 Jordan Syatt: They can be. They’re like military-style boots, so they can be, but it’s way more comfortable to run in running shoes. So I started off jogging and then I ended up switching to incline walking. It was just far more comfortable and I got the same benefit.

0:04:08.6 Mike Vacanti: Man, this is gonna be relevant to today’s discussion. Well done. What’s going on with daylight savings? You got a little… You’re thrown off?

0:04:16.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. My youngest is thrown off by it. She’s been having trouble figuring it out with her nap schedule and then bedtime schedule.

0:04:25.8 Mike Vacanti: What did you guys do from Saturday to Sunday? Like, you put her down at her normal time Saturday and then did you let her sleep until her normal time Sunday or did you wake her up an hour early?

0:04:36.5 Jordan Syatt: Woke her up an hour early.

0:04:37.7 Mike Vacanti: Okay, so you woke her up at the time on the clock that she normally wakes up?

0:04:41.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:04:44.0 Mike Vacanti: Yep, yep. That’s what we did too. And then what? Her first nap on… Or she does one nap a day, so her Sunday nap wasn’t good?

0:04:51.8 Jordan Syatt: No, it was terrible. Like, wasn’t sleeping for an hour, then went down for 20 minutes and then woke up. Is that similar for y’all?

0:05:01.3 Mike Vacanti: I love the y’all. Everyone should use y’all. It’s such a good… Like, it’s such a useful term.

0:05:07.2 Jordan Syatt: So much more efficient.

0:05:08.3 Mike Vacanti: Uh-huh. Sunday actually was fine. Monday, recently she does two naps and usually her first one is long. It’s like two hours. And then her second one is anywhere between 30 and 60 minutes. And she’s been unbelievably consistent on that first nap for like months at this point. And yesterday morning she slept for like 30 minutes on the first nap and then she was up and she was cranky and…

0:05:43.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeesh.

0:05:44.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Daylight savings.

0:05:45.8 Jordan Syatt: Just get rid of it.

0:05:46.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I don’t understand it. It’s always a big debate, and I’m just not that interested. I’m a big like light and sleep guy, as you know. I’m not a fan of it being light out late at night. I know a lot of people are. I think it’s bad for… I mean, unless you’re really going caveman style, where during the summer months you actually are sleeping less each night and then during winter months when the days are shorter and the nights are longer, you’re actually getting more hours of sleep per night. No one is. We have modern electricity and we have lights in our house. So we’re not actually following the sun in terms of our sleep patterns. I don’t like it being bright out at 8:30 at night if I want to go to bed at 9 o’clock. That’s not good for my melatonin production. That’s not good for winding down. Not a fan.

0:06:38.0 Jordan Syatt: Agreed.

0:06:38.6 Mike Vacanti: So if we didn’t spring forward, we wouldn’t have that.

0:06:40.9 Jordan Syatt: That’s true.

0:06:41.6 Mike Vacanti: But I don’t even… When people argue about it, I thought it was gonna pass in the Senate… Or the whatever…

0:06:47.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it looked like it was.

0:06:48.2 Mike Vacanti: Like a year ago. Were they gonna make it permanently how it is now or permanently how it was during the winter?

0:06:53.9 Jordan Syatt: It’s a really good question. I have no idea.

0:06:56.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:06:56.8 Jordan Syatt: But they didn’t do anything.

0:06:57.2 Mike Vacanti: They did nothing. As usual. Nothing at all. They lined their pockets and that’s it.

0:07:04.4 Jordan Syatt: Insider trading.

0:07:05.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. How’s your scrolling?

0:07:10.0 Jordan Syatt: It’s not bad.

0:07:13.3 Mike Vacanti: 7 out of 10 in terms of 10 is you’re doing amazing, one is you’re doing awful.

0:07:15.9 Jordan Syatt: 10 out of 10 is the best?

0:07:17.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:07:17.7 Jordan Syatt: And 1 out of 10 is the worst? I’d say I’m like 6 out of 10, probably.

0:07:22.9 Mike Vacanti: Attaboy. I’m a 10 out of 10 on Instagram. I’m a 15 out of 10 on Facebook. I’m a 1000 out of 10 on TikTok. Haven’t scrolled TikTok in years.

0:07:37.0 Jordan Syatt: Same.

0:07:37.5 Mike Vacanti: I haven’t had Instagram on my phone in months. I only use Facebook for the mentorship. I’m not even tempted by my Facebook feed. It’s just beyond… It’s not even dopaminergic. It’s just garbage. Like rancid, like trash. My X, I’m at a 3 out of 10 on X.

0:08:01.5 Jordan Syatt: You redownloaded it? How often are you downloading it, deleting it, downloading it, deleting it on a weekly basis?

0:08:08.4 Mike Vacanti: On a daily basis, my brother. On a daily basis.

0:08:13.6 Jordan Syatt: Do you think it’s beneficial to just keep deleting it? Does it actually help you do it less than you would have if it was just always on your phone?

0:08:20.2 Mike Vacanti: Absolutely.

0:08:21.0 Jordan Syatt: Oh, got it. Okay.

0:08:22.0 Mike Vacanti: Absolutely. That probably saves me multiple X opens by it not being on my phone. Then I’ll hit a breaking point of either something happening in the world or just something happening with my neurotransmitters and I need that.

0:08:36.5 Jordan Syatt: Do you search stuff on it or do you just open it and see what’s there?

0:08:39.1 Mike Vacanti: If something’s going on, I’ll open it because I want to search stuff on it.

0:08:44.2 Jordan Syatt: And then do you just see the top posts for that or something?

0:08:46.8 Mike Vacanti: I don’t… They don’t even… Yeah, I guess, because you can sort it by latest or top and I leave it on top because latest is usually an unrelated… Well, it’s like an unrelated post that just happened to have those words in it from some bot in who knows where. Yeah, I’m actually… I’m gonna update. I’m gonna say I’m at a 4.7 out of 10.

0:09:10.9 Jordan Syatt: Okay. Nice.

0:09:11.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, it could be significantly worse than it is. I’m probably under an hour… Well, let’s look.

0:09:22.6 Jordan Syatt: This is good content.

0:09:23.7 Mike Vacanti: Now I’m frightened, actually. Now I’m a little frightened. Screen time. Okay. 3 hours and 23 minutes per day is my average for this week. That’s actually way better than I would have guessed.

0:09:39.9 Jordan Syatt: Were you gonna say you’re under an hour per day?

0:09:43.4 Mike Vacanti: On X. That was gonna be my guess.

0:09:45.0 Jordan Syatt: But you’re three hours per day on X?

0:09:47.5 Mike Vacanti: On my iPhone.

0:09:48.6 Jordan Syatt: Oh, on your phone as a whole.

0:09:50.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:09:50.7 Jordan Syatt: Got it. Okay. Got it. I was like, damn, dude, you’re really scrolling X.

0:09:55.5 Mike Vacanti: Pull yours up here, buddy. If you’re gonna make jokes about that, pull yours up, pal.

0:09:59.4 Jordan Syatt: Dude, listen…

0:10:00.2 Mike Vacanti: Whip it out.

0:10:02.2 Jordan Syatt: I’m not.

0:10:02.8 Mike Vacanti: 8 minutes on X so far today. Pretty happy about that. But I also worked out this morning and I was playing with my daughter, so that’s…

0:10:10.1 Jordan Syatt: Where’s the screen time? Let me see the screen time. Where is it?

0:10:12.6 Mike Vacanti: Hour 36 yesterday. Not ideal.

0:10:14.4 Jordan Syatt: On X?

0:10:14.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Hour 52 the day before. Yeah. So it’s the only thing I’m really using. My clock, that was for Gary’s workout for 48 minutes. YouTube, 19 minutes. Pretty good. YouTube today was long. I was listening to a Chris Bumstead podcast during my workout.

0:10:37.3 Jordan Syatt: All right, we’ve got today.

0:10:39.8 Mike Vacanti: Let me see that screen. Okay, now click on yesterday. Just click the bar next to the bar you’re on now.

0:10:46.4 Jordan Syatt: Yesterday was Monday, March…

0:10:50.2 Mike Vacanti: Yep.

0:10:50.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yep.

0:10:51.1 Mike Vacanti: Okay. 10:23. And then the day before. 11:09, 11:10, 3:21, 24. It’s 8 hours per day this week.

0:11:07.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:11:07.6 Mike Vacanti: It’s a full work day. It’s a 9 to 5.

0:11:09.8 Jordan Syatt: Full work day. Yep. Yep. Let’s see. Chess is about an hour a day.

0:11:16.8 Mike Vacanti: That’s good. I like that.

0:11:20.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:11:20.7 Mike Vacanti: Your chess game’s gotten good.

0:11:21.2 Jordan Syatt: Oh, so close in Minnesota.

0:11:23.2 Mike Vacanti: All right, all right. Preface. Tell the story. I have a really nice chess set that my wife bought me many, many years ago for my birthday.

0:11:31.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, it’s a beautiful chess set. Yeah.

0:11:33.8 Mike Vacanti: And it’s out as decor, basically.

0:11:35.8 Jordan Syatt: And then I was showing you a move, a setup that people used to get me with a lot, and I figured out how to beat it. And then we started from that beat position…

0:11:45.7 Mike Vacanti: Jordan showed me an opening where white gets very aggressive with the queen that used to end up working to take his rook. But he was showing me how he learned how to defend it. And so we started in a position where I had my queen out in the middle of the board, and he had three pieces developed. And then I was just like, “What if we do here from this move?” And then you’re like, “I would go here.” And then I don’t even know how it turned into a game. And then it got unbelievably competitive. And then we reached a… I think it was dead even with… We both had our queen, we both had a knight, and we either had even pawns, or I had more pawns than you, but you had two passed pawns on the far side of the board. So all the action was in the… A lot of people don’t know what we’re talking about, but that’s okay. In the E3 through G7 region. And then Jordan had his A and B pawns were both just flying down the board, and it was very competitive.

0:12:54.9 Jordan Syatt: And then you mated me, and you didn’t even realize you mated me.

0:12:57.5 Mike Vacanti: I eked it out. Well, I knew that I forked you.

0:12:59.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:13:00.4 Mike Vacanti: I forked your king and queen. So I knew in my mind, I was like, “I won the game,” but it actually happened to be checkmate as well.

0:13:08.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah.

0:13:10.9 Mike Vacanti: Over the board is different than online.

0:13:11.1 Jordan Syatt: It’s so different, dude.

0:13:13.8 Mike Vacanti: Online, it would have just said checkmate.

0:13:14.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, man. Yeah.

0:13:15.8 Mike Vacanti: Cardio. Let’s dive in. We worked in a little pre-banter. Number one, running/jogging. S tier to F tier based on vibes, based on science, based on evidence, based on personal preference, based on programmability, based on benefit, based on whatever we want.

0:13:37.0 Jordan Syatt: I’m giving running/jogging an A. A tier, which is super good. It’ll be interesting if I come up if any of them have S tier. There might be no S tier today. The only reason I didn’t give this one S tier is because my brain went to it’s not appropriate for everybody and a lot of people can’t start with running. It’s where it’s like S tier in my mind for some reason today is everybody can do it, and not everyone can start with it, and I think there’s a huge percentage of people who can’t with running or jogging, they should start with just walking or whatever. So that’s why I gave it an A, but it’s an amazing… One of the best forms of cardio.

0:14:20.3 Mike Vacanti: Could not agree more with the rating and with your reasoning. It’s gonna be fun to apply that same reasoning in a few picks because you’re gonna want to give S tier, but you’re not gonna be able to because of that logic.

0:14:33.2 Jordan Syatt: I love it.

0:14:34.2 Mike Vacanti: Running is excellent. I mean, I guess we cap running at a certain speed, right?

0:14:40.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s not sprinting.

0:14:42.3 Mike Vacanti: Running could be zone five if you’re not in very good shape. But if jogging puts you into zone five, then you probably shouldn’t be jogging. Maybe there’s a population that could… You’re just getting started back into cardio.

0:15:01.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, walk-jog, walk-jog type thing.

0:15:03.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, you can do it anywhere, which is one of the real benefits here compared to something like swimming. You can control the pace. It’s classic. We can go ‘Rocky,’ gray hoodie, 4:30 in the morning, have your raw eggs after. Running’s a classic form of cardio.

0:15:24.6 Jordan Syatt: Get nature, fresh air.

0:15:26.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. Pounding the pavement. Number two, brisk walking.

0:15:34.7 Jordan Syatt: Ooh. This might be S tier. I think brisk walking is S tier. It’s because brisk is really individual-dependent. For one person, a brisk walk could be relatively fast. For someone else, what’s brisk for them might be absolutely slower comparatively, but it’s still brisk for them. And it’s… Anyone can do it regardless of their size, regardless of their fitness level. That’s S tier.

0:16:02.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Are we assuming brisk walking gets… And you made a good point. The absolute speed is different. Similar to someone might deadlift 600 pounds and someone might deadlift 200 pounds, but they can both reach an RPE 9 at those weights.

0:16:18.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:16:18.7 Mike Vacanti: Are we assuming that the brisk walk here is getting someone into zone two?

0:16:26.7 Jordan Syatt: Maybe even zone three or four, depending on their fitness level. But you can always oscillate between brisk walk to a slow walk. You can use it as part of your training strategy. It doesn’t have to be all or nothing.

0:16:38.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I also think this is S tier. This is my favorite form of cardio, brisk walk. I would kinda lump incline walk in here with brisk walk. I don’t know if it gets broken…

0:16:48.7 Jordan Syatt: Is incline on the list?

0:16:49.8 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think it is.

0:16:50.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh, man, that’s a mistake by AI.

0:16:53.8 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think it is.

0:16:54.7 Jordan Syatt: I’d put incline on S tier as well.

0:16:56.0 Mike Vacanti: But don’t worry… Don’t worry. Jump squats are on the list, so…

0:16:58.9 Jordan Syatt: Oh, geez.

0:17:02.0 Mike Vacanti: Hey, we got to have range…

0:17:04.6 Jordan Syatt: From S to F.

0:17:07.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Brisk walking has all of the benefits of running/jogging with a lower injury risk profile and a bigger net of who can do it, with equal cardiovascular heart health upside, better recoverability from brisk walking. Brisk walking is an S.

0:17:28.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:17:29.6 Mike Vacanti: It might be above an S. It might be sitting on top of the whole rectangle.

0:17:34.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:17:35.2 Mike Vacanti: Cycling/biking.

0:17:36.5 Jordan Syatt: My personal bias is I fucking hate it.

0:17:38.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, same.

0:17:40.3 Jordan Syatt: And I’m assuming this isn’t an assault bike. This is just cycling.

0:17:46.5 Mike Vacanti: Yes.

0:17:47.6 Jordan Syatt: I hate it. It’s a great form of cardio, but I personally hate it.

0:17:52.8 Mike Vacanti: Dude, there are so many on here that you’re personally gonna hate. But keep going.

0:17:56.4 Jordan Syatt: It destroys my gooch.

0:17:58.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:17:59.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s just… Even when I was working with Viada and he had me doing a fair amount of cycling, I got these special shorts that have padding over your gooch to make it more comfortable. Still terrible. It still was not comfortable at all. And it just felt like I was wearing a diaper. It was just…

0:18:24.5 Mike Vacanti: Who wants to do that?

0:18:25.5 Jordan Syatt: I don’t wanna wear a diaper. Definitely not when I’m doing cardio. And I know a lot of people love it. I just fucking hate it. It’s also statistically, if we’re doing it on the road, just way more dangerous. Obviously, you got a Peloton, you’re inside, that’s fine. But if we’re doing it… Like, running could be outside getting fresh air, just more dangerous. The falls, the cars, whatever. I would say more cost prohibitive.

0:19:03.3 Mike Vacanti: Absolutely. You need a piece of equipment.

0:19:05.5 Jordan Syatt: And you have to upkeep it, maintain it, make sure that the tires are good. All that stuff. Make sure it’s not getting rusty on you.

0:19:17.7 Mike Vacanti: Before… I love the buildup to this, but are you… Is any part of your rationale here a distaste for bikers as a motor vehiclist who’s on the road?

0:19:29.7 Jordan Syatt: No.

0:19:31.4 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

0:19:32.0 Jordan Syatt: I don’t really mind that much. I’ve never come across personally any road cyclists that have really infuriated me. I’m sure I will in the future, but…

0:19:45.6 Mike Vacanti: You haven’t been to New York City since the motorized bikes have taken off.

0:19:50.6 Jordan Syatt: Oh, yeah.

0:19:51.8 Mike Vacanti: ‘Cause those things are flying around. And I’m not driving when I’m in the city, but as a pedestrian, it’s annoying, for sure.

0:19:58.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Objectively, I’m gonna give it an A.

0:20:03.4 Mike Vacanti: Wow.

0:20:03.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m gonna give it an A just because it’s a phenomenal form of cardio. And if we take into account the stationary bikes and all of that, there’s just so much great stuff you can do with it, even though I personally absolutely hate it.

0:20:19.9 Mike Vacanti: But I think we include our personal preferences in these rankings. So, I think…

0:20:24.4 Jordan Syatt: If I’m including my personal preference, I’m gonna give it a B. It’s a B, then.

0:20:27.8 Mike Vacanti: Okay. All right. I think it kept… I have a similar personal preference in that not only is it uncomfortable on my butt and whatever area, but it’s also I don’t like my hip positioning. You’re never getting full hip extension when you’re pedaling, which just doesn’t feel good. Doesn’t feel amazing on my back over a long period of time. Not in a pain way, but maybe like an achy… Like, there are other things I could be doing to get my heart rate up that would be beneficial in the same way that just feel better biomechanically for me. You need the equipment, costs money, upkeep of the equipment. It’s been a while since I did difficult biking, but quad burn isn’t the greatest feeling ever.

0:21:30.5 Jordan Syatt: It sucks.

0:21:31.0 Mike Vacanti: And there’s a lot of that. No shade. I know a lot of bikers out there. I know a lot of cyclists and people who love it, and good for you and it is a great form of cardio. But I’m gonna go C on this one because of my personal disinterest in the form of cardio.

0:21:49.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, you bring up the great point of just rounded over, hunched over, hip flexors tight, thoracic just completely rounded. We get enough of that in our day-to-day.

0:22:00.0 Mike Vacanti: Most people are getting that at their desk for eight hours a day.

0:22:02.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah.

0:22:04.3 Mike Vacanti: Swimming.

0:22:05.2 Jordan Syatt: This one’s interesting. I was waiting for this one. So there’s so much to consider here. Purely cardio, it’s outrageously good. If we’re only focusing on how good is it for your cardio, it’s amazing. There are so many things to consider. Number one, the skill. You are a great swimmer.

0:22:29.6 Mike Vacanti: No.

0:22:30.1 Jordan Syatt: Yes, you are, dude. You got like 24 saves.

0:22:32.9 Mike Vacanti: You don’t have to be a great swimmer for that. I’m a slightly above average swimmer.

0:22:36.0 Jordan Syatt: If you’re saving someone from drowning, you’re a great swimmer.

0:22:39.2 Mike Vacanti: Thank you. But I’m objectively… I don’t have great technique and I don’t have great endurance. I’m a sprinter of a swimmer. I’m not a distance swimmer.

0:22:48.7 Jordan Syatt: You’re a lifeguard swimmer. Yeah.

0:22:49.9 Mike Vacanti: I’m a pool lifeguard swimmer, not an ocean lifeguard swimmer.

0:22:53.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, that’s different.

0:22:55.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:22:55.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, so the skill of it is a lot. The difficulty of getting to a pool is something that I think is worth noting. My neighbor Alan, he did a triathlon a few months ago and the only time that he could get to the pool, he had to literally leave his house at 2:00 in the morning. There’s a 24/7 pool because he’s a… Actually, I don’t want to give away what he does just because people are gonna find an Alan who does whatever. He owns his own businesses and he’s got two young kids, and so he had to find a 24/7 pool. And what’s crazy is he was like, “The lanes were always taken up at 2:00 in the fucking morning.” It’s just if you don’t have your own pool, and never mind a good length pool, it’s difficult.

0:23:50.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I remember lap swim was restricted to… Lap swim at the pool I worked at for all those years was from 6:00 AM to 8:00 AM before the actual pool opened.

0:24:03.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:24:05.0 Mike Vacanti: My counter here would be anyone who wants to strength train with real equipment is gonna have to go to a gym and you could go to…

0:24:11.8 Jordan Syatt: But you can buy stuff and have it in your house. You can’t just be like, “I’m gonna buy a pool,” not as easily as buying a barbell and a rack and adjustable dumbbells.

0:24:25.5 Mike Vacanti: That’s a limited home gym. But for a commercial gym where you have a leg press, quad extension… I bet it’s pretty simple… Not a full-length pool, you’re right. I’m gonna say it’s a notch harder to get to a pool. Yeah, it’s definitely harder to get to a pool than it is to get to a gym. A lot of gyms have pools that you can swim at, so I would join that gym, but there are more gyms than there are pools.

0:24:50.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. And when you buy a pool, the whole construction of it, you got to clean it, you got to maintain… It’s much easier to buy your own home gym equipment and get an effective home gym workout compared to fucking installing a pool in your backyard.

0:25:05.2 Mike Vacanti: I think both are champagne problems because I think most people are going to a gym and most people are going to a pool.

0:25:12.7 Jordan Syatt: I would say one is hundreds of thousands of dollars problem and one is a millions of dollars problem.

0:25:20.8 Mike Vacanti: But and again, the pools at most houses in America aren’t pools where you’re gonna be able… They’re not 25-meter length pools. They’re little pools that are 10 meters maybe across.

0:25:33.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:25:34.3 Mike Vacanti: But yes, it’s harder to get to a pool than a gym.

0:25:37.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. So we’ve got the skill of it, all of that. The other part that I think is really interesting is people often hate on the stress of something like running or jogging, like it’s bad for your joints. I don’t think it is inherently bad for your joints, number one. I think if you do too much of it, it can be bad. And people say, “Well, just do swimming instead.” There’s actually a lot of really interesting research around swimming, and specifically when you look at kids whose main or only sport is swimming and that’s what they do from childhood all the way through high school, their bone density throughout the rest of their life is statistically much lower and they’re at a greater risk of bone issues compared to athletes who are running or sprinting or who are on hard ground, which makes sense because you have a lot less stress on your bones. You get a lot of bone benefit from that impact on the ground from other sports. So I think while for some people, if they’ve got chronic joint and pain issues, it can be a great tool, I wouldn’t use it as your only one. Whereas if someone’s like, “Hey, I only want to brisk walk,” or “I only want to jog,” or “I only want to whatever…”

0:26:55.3 Mike Vacanti: For cardio?

0:26:56.5 Jordan Syatt: For cardio, I’m like… I’m usually like, yes, someone’s like, I only want to do whatever. Like, I’m almost always fine with it, except for swimming. I would rather them do another type of cardio as well that has more consistent impact because I think it’s helpful for your bones and your joints. So purely from a cardio perspective, it’s great, but I’m gonna give it a B again.

0:27:22.2 Mike Vacanti: I think B’s a reasonable rating, especially given the two bigger issues in my eyes are difficulty to get to and skill of learning, which might even be a bigger learning curve than we’re letting on here. And not learning how to swim, but learning how to swim with proper technique isn’t easy. I actually think B is perfect for swimming. The point you bring up is interesting too, because we hear a lot of, “Such low impact is so good for you.” Yes, if you are generally older/have some pain issues with basically most of the other forms of cardio, yeah, and you still want to get cardio in, good, swimming’s an awesome option. But like you mentioned, if most people, if it’s their only form of exercise, it’s like, no, you actually want to be doing things that is gonna improve your bone mineral density.

0:28:22.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. And most people can’t swim, going back to the skill of it, in zone two or zone three for very long. They start going, they’re immediately in zone five. They get two lengths in and it’s like, “Alright, I’m breathing super heavy.” I would say it’s probably better for sprinting for most people than it is for longer duration, lower intensity until you build up the skill of it.

0:28:43.8 Mike Vacanti: One of… I don’t think I’ve ever told this story publicly to you anywhere. One of the times I was the hungriest, physically hungriest I’ve ever been in my entire life was in college. Randomly, I don’t know why, my roommate at the time, Joe Woolley, and I went to the pool at the SERF. Where was the pool? I don’t remember where the pool was in Wisconsin, but we went to the rec center pool and swam for, I don’t know, 45 minutes. We swam laps and I was basically the most exhausted I’ve ever been after. And three hours later, I probably ate 4000 or 5000 calories.

0:29:28.7 Jordan Syatt: Holy shit.

0:29:29.4 Mike Vacanti: Just starving, like a bottomless pit. So, yeah…

0:29:34.4 Jordan Syatt: Makes sense.

0:29:36.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Unbelievably inefficient at it, brand new form of cardio, doing it for the first time for a pretty long session. Yeah.

0:29:45.5 Jordan Syatt: Did I get the number of saves right? Is it 24?

0:29:48.8 Mike Vacanti: I believe it’s 24. Legends grow with time, and so I’m trying to… It could be higher, honestly, I don’t know.

0:29:57.6 Jordan Syatt: Oh, wow.

0:29:58.1 Mike Vacanti: It feels right. I think 24 is right. I feel like I remember six by four, six per four summers or four per year over six years. I don’t remember the exact math. We’re gonna have to get fact checked there. Jump rope.

0:30:12.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh, this is gonna be an interesting one because I love jump rope. I absolutely love it. But the vast majority of people cannot do it. It is a skill in and of itself. I would say one of my favorite times coaching Gary was when he really wanted to get good at jump rope. That was one of the most fun experiences was coaching him on improving his jump rope, and he actually got really good at it.

0:30:41.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, he did.

0:30:42.7 Jordan Syatt: I would say for most people, jumping repeatedly over and over and over again, and especially when you don’t know how to do it and you’re just slamming into the ground, this is going to the other end of the spectrum with impact.

0:30:55.2 Mike Vacanti: Too much.

0:30:56.4 Jordan Syatt: It’s too much. Way too much for most people starting. And the only reason that I can do it the way I do it is because I had 10 years of wrestling where we would warm up 10 to 15 minutes at the beginning of practice every single day, five, six days a week. And so I developed that skill at a young age. Man, it’s such a great one. I’m gonna give this a… I’m oscillating between C and B because if I can give swimming a B, I can give jump rope a B. There’s a skill of it. It’s very difficult for most people to do it and not be in a super high zone basically immediately, especially when their technique sucks. The main benefit, or one of the main benefits, is you could put it in your backpack. It’s super cheap. You can get it anywhere. It’s so convenient. I would always have one with me whenever I traveled. I’m bumping it to a B just because if it’s a skill you want to learn and develop, it’s so convenient and cheap to have in your backpack or have in your house. I’m giving it a B.

0:32:08.1 Mike Vacanti: It definitely offsets swimming in terms of availability and ease of doing, logistically. Right?

0:32:17.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:32:17.5 Mike Vacanti: You can take it with you anywhere. You can do it pretty much anywhere versus swimming, you need to find a pool that’s of a certain length that you can use at the right time. So that’s a one point for jump rope. There’s definitely a much bigger population that can’t jump rope, not because of the skill of it, but because of their current body composition.

0:32:43.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:32:43.6 Mike Vacanti: That many jumps on their knees and ankles specifically is unsafe.

0:32:50.0 Jordan Syatt: Agree.

0:32:51.2 Mike Vacanti: Even if they got really efficient with… When you’re first learning and you’re slamming into the ground, even if you got past that point and you were lighter on your feet and so there was less impact on each jump, it’s still a lot of weight if we think about a Western society that’s primarily overweight or obese.

0:33:08.3 Jordan Syatt: I’d be petrified they’re gonna snap their Achilles. Yeah. And every jump, I’d be like, please don’t, please don’t.

0:33:12.5 Mike Vacanti: Like if you’re coaching that person, there’s no reason to be jump roping.

0:33:18.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, absolutely not.

0:33:25.5 Mike Vacanti: I definitely… It’s between C and B, and those are the factors at play. So…

0:33:31.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:33:33.0 Mike Vacanti: Put it where you want it. Rowing.

0:33:36.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, I hate rowing.

0:33:37.9 Mike Vacanti: Really?

0:33:38.6 Jordan Syatt: I fucking hate the rower, dude. I absolutely hate it.

0:33:42.6 Mike Vacanti: Why do you hate the rower? I’ve done very little rowing over my lifetime, but I like the idea of rowing.

0:33:49.5 Jordan Syatt: I like the idea of it. There are movies where there are really great scenes and the music is playing and they’re just going and going and going, and it’s like, whoosh, whoosh.

0:34:00.4 Mike Vacanti: The Facebook movie.

0:34:01.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. I love the idea of it. And it’s a great form of cardio. I just personally hate it… All the ones that I’ve used, the seat’s ridiculously uncomfortable. It’s just not fun. It’s not fun for me at all. Yeah, I personally don’t enjoy it. I know a lot of people do. I would say convenience is high, very high level of convenience. You could buy one, have it at your house. Most gyms have them. They are… I’m gonna give it an A in terms of it’s a great form of cardio, but boy, do I hate that fucking… And I don’t hate it because it’s hard. I just hate doing it in the same way that I hate cycling. I hate cycling more.

0:34:52.4 Mike Vacanti: I want to hear more about why you… As someone who’s done almost no rowing and I just like the idea of it, I want to hear more about why you hate doing it.

0:35:01.1 Jordan Syatt: It’s uncomfortable. I don’t like the wrist arm position as I’m pulling it into my chest. It’s just awkward. Wrist is… I don’t know.

0:35:11.9 Mike Vacanti: You want a parallel grip? Would that help you?

0:35:13.8 Jordan Syatt: I would like a parallel grip. I would prefer a parallel grip.

0:35:16.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, that makes sense.

0:35:16.5 Jordan Syatt: I would absolutely prefer… That’s a genius idea. I don’t know why they don’t make that.

0:35:20.8 Mike Vacanti: They should.

0:35:22.0 Jordan Syatt: They should. Maybe they’re just trying too hard to mimic what’s actually going on in a rowboat. But I would rather have a… If they had a parallel grip and a cushioned seat, I would enjoy it way more.

0:35:34.7 Mike Vacanti: These feel like easy fixes.

0:35:36.5 Jordan Syatt: That’s what I’m saying, dude. Yes. Parallel grip, cushioned seat, I’m in.

0:35:41.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, you’re in better posture than cycling. And the seat is, even if uncomfortable, is more comfortable than a bike seat. Accessibility’s high. Easy to get your heart rate up.

0:35:57.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s nice, too, ’cause you can track wattage, how hard you’re pressing into it. You can track the progressive overload over time in terms of it’s not just how long you can go or how fast you’re going, but literally how much force you’re putting in. Similar to cycling, you can track the same thing.

0:36:14.8 Mike Vacanti: I’m giving rowing an A.

0:36:17.3 Jordan Syatt: I gave it an A, right?

0:36:18.0 Mike Vacanti: You did. I think that’s perfect for it.

0:36:21.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:36:21.8 Mike Vacanti: StairMaster/stair climbing.

0:36:24.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, bro, I so badly want to give that an S tier. I might pull back and give it an A.

0:36:31.7 Mike Vacanti: Because of population?

0:36:33.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. Not everyone is equipped to be doing a stair climber, not yet…

0:36:40.5 Mike Vacanti: We go A plus.

0:36:41.5 Jordan Syatt: I’ll go A plus. It’s just I would… If I have someone of the typical Western persuasion coming in…

0:36:50.3 Mike Vacanti: Good word.

0:36:51.1 Jordan Syatt: I’m not gonna be like, “Let’s hop up on the stair climber.” I’m gonna go, “Let’s get on the treadmill and walk, maybe mild incline.”

0:36:59.9 Mike Vacanti: Less strength required, less balance required, coordination.

0:37:03.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. I’ve tripped on a stair climber before and I’ll catch myself. The front of my shoe will hit the lip. I’ll be like, “Oh,” you know? I fucking love that thing. I wanted one in my home gym. I just had to prioritize. And you can get very similar with a really high incline on the treadmill. You bring that sucker up to like a 15. It’s very similar. So, but I do love a stair stepper, stair climber, dude. Yeah, that’s an A plus.

0:37:35.0 Mike Vacanti: I think A plus is perfect. I’ve done very little of it over the years due to difficulty. It also, I’m just getting… I actually like stairs more than the StairMaster. Like walking, running stairs, a stairwell. I’m not doing it in my house, but if I’m on the 15th floor of a hotel, I’ll do stairs. I’m trying to think of why. It’s almost like I… It’s almost… This is completely anecdotal, potentially false, but why I’ve been biased against it for myself, which is I feel like I’m accumulating glute fatigue on the StairMaster machine, but without enough stimulus to actually produce strength and muscle gains. Whereas I’d rather be zero or 100. I’d rather be training my glutes or not training or just doing something that’s cardio rather than doing something that’s cardio and a little bit of accumulated fatigue, but without producing a positive result there locally to the muscle. That being said, it’s definitely better than everything we put in A so far, but not quite S tier because the population who can do it is limited. So A plus.

0:39:04.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, fair.

0:39:05.6 Mike Vacanti: Jordan’s favorite, number eight, burpees. And we got to go. We got to go into speed round here.

0:39:10.1 Jordan Syatt: You’re gonna be surprised by this one. Okay. So, dude, I’m gonna give burpees…

0:39:16.3 Mike Vacanti: Are you going contrarian on all of your opinions from seven years ago just because you’re bored?

0:39:22.3 Jordan Syatt: No.

0:39:23.5 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

0:39:24.2 Jordan Syatt: Listen…

0:39:24.4 Mike Vacanti: I’m listening. What do you think of diarrhea teas? Do you like those too now? Have you… Okay, sorry, sorry, sorry. Go ahead. You’re like, “I’m tired. Come on.”

0:39:33.3 Jordan Syatt: Here’s the thing. When most people program burpees, they don’t have a reason for it. They’re like, “I’m just gonna do it just to make you tired.” They just throw them in there into a group fitness class just because. There’s not much rhyme or reason behind it. If you are at home and you want to get cardio in and you don’t have any equipment and you want something that you can do, maybe you’re watching your baby and you don’t have a treadmill and you can’t go… Honestly, bro, a well-done burpee is an amazing, very convenient, and highly modifiable way to increase your heart rate for a sustained period of time. So I’m gonna give it an A because in this very specific context, this is where it’s supposed to be used. I don’t like it the way that the vast majority of coaches program them, and I don’t think it makes sense the way that most coaches program them. But when we’re looking at it purely from a cardio perspective and convenience, here it goes, here it works.

0:40:57.3 Mike Vacanti: I get similar vibes as StairMaster, which is I’m using random muscles more than I want to be, but not enough to do anything, not enough to make me jacked. And it’s just uncomfortable and not fun. You outline a good usage, a good case where they could be used effectively. At home with a kid. I’d rather walk laps around the kid, even if it’s two steps, two steps, two steps, two steps. But that’s even no matter how fast you’re walking, that’s actually gonna be less intense than doing burpees. I guess you sold me on bringing it from a C to a B is where I’m at.

0:41:46.6 Jordan Syatt: Let’s go. And still, fuck burpees. You know what I mean?

0:41:50.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I’m never doing them. Thankfully we have all of these cardio options. I’d rather, if I’m with my kid constantly, I’m just lounging. Good news, we have these things called strollers and you can walk with the child. And even if it’s super cold outside, you can walk inside with the child. Or kid gets mad, doesn’t want to be in the stroller, cool, carry the kid. Now I’m rucking. I’m rucking in my own house. I’m doing stairs with a kid, little offloaded right side, left side.

0:42:28.3 Jordan Syatt: Rock-a-bye baby walk, dude. Just hold ’em in the arms, little Zercher hold.

0:42:33.6 Mike Vacanti: Put on your shoulders, do whatever you want to do. Do whatever you want to do.

0:42:37.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:42:38.6 Mike Vacanti: Isometric curl. Just… Yeah. However you want to do it. High intensity interval training. This is not very specific.

0:42:47.3 Jordan Syatt: This went from very specific modalities to a method, a wide range of…

0:42:56.2 Mike Vacanti: I’ll read it to you.

0:42:57.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:42:57.5 Mike Vacanti: Alternating bursts, e.g., sprint circuits. You know what? Let’s say circuits. Throw out HIIT. This is circuits.

0:43:05.7 Jordan Syatt: I’ll give it a C. It’s just not enough to…

0:43:10.9 Mike Vacanti: You’re stuck in the middle.

0:43:12.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. You’re not really… You’re… Listen, from a health and fitness perspective, great. It’s an efficient way to do a little bit of both, but you’re not really gonna progress in either one dramatically. Health, fitness-wise, wonderful. Maybe if you’re doing a great group class, good community, awesome. You have fun, wonderful. But you’re not targeting… You’re not lifting heavy enough to really get a lot stronger and build muscle, and the way that you’re doing cardio is not sufficient to stress your cardiovascular system enough to make dramatic improvements in that either.

0:43:47.1 Mike Vacanti: C.

0:43:48.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:43:49.0 Mike Vacanti: Totally agree. Mountain climbers.

0:43:50.0 Jordan Syatt: Ugh. You know what? Those suck.

0:43:52.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:43:53.3 Jordan Syatt: I would rather do burpees than mountain climbers.

0:43:56.2 Mike Vacanti: We have to put them together, right?

0:43:57.8 Jordan Syatt: No. No, mountain climbers dude… They suck, dude.

0:44:01.4 Mike Vacanti: When performed properly, burpees suck too.

0:44:03.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, but burpees, you can get extended and you can get up and move around. Mountain climbers, you’re on the ground, you’re hunched over. Yeah, you’re just driving your knees to your face and it’s just like…

0:44:18.2 Mike Vacanti: And within 45 seconds, you just have this massive round in your low back and you look like…

0:44:23.5 Jordan Syatt: A turtle.

0:44:23.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Butts up in the air.

0:44:25.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. And your wrists and your shoulders. It’s just… No, dude. I’m giving mountain climbers a D.

0:44:31.1 Mike Vacanti: I mean, I almost… If mountain climbers are a D, I can’t in good faith put burpees at a B.

0:44:37.4 Jordan Syatt: You can. You can, ’cause they’re so different.

0:44:40.0 Mike Vacanti: I mean, they’re the two most similar on this whole list.

0:44:42.8 Jordan Syatt: No.

0:44:44.0 Mike Vacanti: What is more similar?

0:44:45.1 Jordan Syatt: Cycling and rowing are way more similar.

0:44:48.8 Mike Vacanti: Now I got you. Ever since my comment about cycling, you’re really thinking about body position and what feels good. I’ll give mountain climbers a C, I suppose, only because I put burp… It’s either C, D or B, C for me.

0:45:02.0 Jordan Syatt: You could do burpees sustained for a really long time. You can’t do mountain climbers sustained for a long time. You could pace yourself and do burpees for an hour.

0:45:12.4 Mike Vacanti: You can do zone five mountain climbers. You do ’em and then you rest and then you do a little upward dog hold…

0:45:17.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, if you’re doing ’em for HIIT, that would make more sense, but even then, I’d rather you just do burpees faster.

0:45:22.4 Mike Vacanti: Look, wherever we put ’em, cool. I’m not doing any of them for cardio. I’m gonna be doing a whole lot of brisk walking and then a couple of other things here, but…

0:45:32.5 Jordan Syatt: Mountain climbers suck, a D.

0:45:35.9 Mike Vacanti: This is a family-friendly program, people. Jordan doesn’t like mountain climbers. Number 11, elliptical training.

0:45:43.1 Jordan Syatt: Ooh. Love the elliptical. Big fan.

0:45:45.7 Mike Vacanti: You extra love it because a lot of people don’t like it.

0:45:48.3 Jordan Syatt: No, I love the elliptical. I’ve always loved the elliptical. I used to use it to cut weight for wrestling.

0:45:56.3 Mike Vacanti: My boy Arjun Maini lost a lot of weight in high school on Hydroxycut and elliptical and Diet Coke. Shout-out, Sarge.

0:46:08.4 Jordan Syatt: Hydroxycut, elliptical, and Diet Coke, bro. That’s amazing. Arjun Maini, huge props, brother.

0:46:16.1 Mike Vacanti: He was a beast on the elliptical.

0:46:18.2 Jordan Syatt: He just…

0:46:21.0 Mike Vacanti: No, more just the sheer number of hours per week, not going super intense.

0:46:26.5 Jordan Syatt: And that was before smartphones, so he wasn’t watching shit. He was just fucking looking at the timer.

0:46:33.1 Mike Vacanti: SportsCenter was on the TV in the high school gym…

0:46:35.8 Jordan Syatt: Okay, okay. You guys had a TV in your school gym? That’s amazing.

0:46:40.2 Mike Vacanti: We got to really go into overdrive here, but yes. After my ninth grade year, the activity center opened up and it was this huge community center with all brand new stuff. It was enormous.

0:46:52.4 Jordan Syatt: Oh, that’s amazing.

0:46:54.2 Mike Vacanti: It had six benches, five racks, all these cables, dumbbells. It was legit.

0:47:00.4 Jordan Syatt: Damn. I would do the elliptical and just look at that timer for 30 minutes. It was awful.

0:47:06.2 Mike Vacanti: We got 10 left. We just got to give a like a thought and a grade.

0:47:10.7 Jordan Syatt: Elliptical. I’m giving it an A.

0:47:12.1 Mike Vacanti: I’m giving it an A also. Most people can do it. It’s a great way to get your heart rate up. I don’t personally love it myself, find the movement a little bit awkward. It’s just not my favorite relative to brisk walking, but it’s an A.

0:47:24.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Sometimes my feet fall asleep, so I like to do it shoeless ’cause having bare feet helps my feet not fall asleep. And also it lacks impact, which for some people is great, but I do like a little bit of impact, so that’s why I’m giving it an A, not an S.

0:47:41.8 Mike Vacanti: Dancing.

0:47:43.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m between A and S. I’m gonna give it an S.

0:47:51.6 Mike Vacanti: No, you’re not. All right, you’re just doing that because I reacted the way I reacted. Give it an A. It’s not an S. Dancing isn’t S.

0:47:58.1 Jordan Syatt: I guess it depends what type of dancing, but dude, dancing, anyone can do it.

0:48:04.1 Mike Vacanti: You’re placating your audience here. You’re placating your female-dominant audience.

0:48:08.1 Jordan Syatt: I’m telling the truth, bro. Listen, I’m not dancing, but I’ve danced and I’ve done a Zumba class, and that shit will get your heart rate up for a long period of time. You get jumping, you get impact, you get some…

0:48:27.1 Mike Vacanti: Okay, now I’m picturing someone who’s out, they just had four margaritas, chips, and guac, they’re on the floor, they’re sloppy.

0:48:34.8 Jordan Syatt: Why are you adding that in? We’re talking about exercise.

0:48:37.2 Mike Vacanti: I didn’t know. Hang on. I’ve never seen anyone dancing. I’ve seen them doing random movements with super loud music that’s very distracting and annoying in that room over to the side from the weights where I’m like, “Hey, can we get a soundproof thing here? Because I want to focus on lifting. I don’t want to hear this circus over here.” I’ve heard that before. But when you say dancing, I’m picturing a sweaty dude on the floor who might’ve ripped a line of coke in the bathroom and now he’s out there grinding. To the window, to the wall.

0:49:11.9 Jordan Syatt: Dude, that’s so funny that dancing makes you think of 50 Cent.

0:49:19.7 Mike Vacanti: Well, Lil Jon, by the way, but yes, yes.

0:49:22.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:49:26.4 Mike Vacanti: I would throw what you said in workout classes, but…

0:49:29.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, but Zumba is a workout dance class. Dance workout class.

0:49:34.5 Mike Vacanti: Agree to disagree. We don’t have time to go in the nuts and bolts on this one. C.

0:49:39.5 Jordan Syatt: S.

0:49:40.3 Mike Vacanti: Hiking.

0:49:41.0 Jordan Syatt: A.

0:49:41.6 Mike Vacanti: A is good. Kickboxing/boxing.

0:49:44.6 Jordan Syatt: A.

0:49:45.3 Mike Vacanti: S.

0:49:47.4 Jordan Syatt: That’s fair.

0:49:48.0 Mike Vacanti: I’m giving it an S.

0:49:50.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I would say if it was just boxing, I’d say S. Kickboxing, I’m saying A.

0:49:53.6 Mike Vacanti: Kickboxing limits the population. Boxing is… Yeah, that’s exactly where I was. Sprinting.

0:49:59.6 Jordan Syatt: Man.

0:50:00.3 Mike Vacanti: Let’s just say S for the population who can do it.

0:50:03.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, anyone who can do it, it’s great.

0:50:05.9 Mike Vacanti: Jumping jacks.

0:50:07.3 Jordan Syatt: B.

0:50:07.9 Mike Vacanti: I knocked burpees down to a C and mountain climbers to a D, so I’m okay putting jumping jacks at a B because jumping jacks are above burpees. Jump squats.

0:50:19.0 Jordan Syatt: C.

0:50:19.6 Mike Vacanti: Let’s say jump squats for population who it’s not an injury risk.

0:50:24.0 Jordan Syatt: C. I’m not using… Maybe even a D. I’m not doing ’em for cardio.

0:50:27.5 Mike Vacanti: No, I’m not either, but one of the reasons they’re knocked down is because a lot of people…

0:50:32.1 Jordan Syatt: Can’t do it.

0:50:33.6 Mike Vacanti: Or they’re high injury… Yeah, yeah.

0:50:34.6 Jordan Syatt: Correct.

0:50:35.6 Mike Vacanti: Rucking.

0:50:36.6 Jordan Syatt: I sort of put that in the same thing as hiking.

0:50:39.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but you got to have a heavier pack than normal.

0:50:42.2 Jordan Syatt: Oh, it’s even heavier?

0:50:43.4 Mike Vacanti: Well, hiking, technically, you don’t have a pack. That’d be like camping hiking.

0:50:47.2 Jordan Syatt: We’ll go A minus.

0:50:48.9 Mike Vacanti: Oh, interesting. But it’s not a weighted vest. We’re not being trendy. It’s like a rock that you’re carrying to the top of the hill.

0:50:57.2 Jordan Syatt: Oh, really? I thought it was like a weighted vest.

0:50:59.2 Mike Vacanti: I think it probably is, but I think it can be anything.

0:51:02.3 Jordan Syatt: You said a log.

0:51:03.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s a boat. It’s a boat. You’re carrying a boat up a hill. It’s at least an A, I think.

0:51:11.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s in the A’s for sure. It’s amazing. I just… I’m thinking not everyone is gonna… A lot of people don’t need the extra weight, but, yeah.

0:51:19.7 Mike Vacanti: That’s a really good point. I’m going more on vibes at this point in the episode. Battle ropes.

0:51:26.0 Jordan Syatt: I hate battle ropes. I think they’re so overrated. I’m giving ’em a D.

0:51:30.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Get out of the way. You’re taking up a lot of room. I’m trying to get over this to get to the turf over there.

0:51:36.1 Jordan Syatt: You’re taking up the entire turf strip with your fucking…

0:51:48.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:51:52.9 Jordan Syatt: You’re working your shoulders…

0:51:55.3 Mike Vacanti: Again and again. It’s like fatiguing a certain body part to get cardio. All right, last one. Team/recreational sports.

0:52:03.4 Jordan Syatt: S.

0:52:04.1 Mike Vacanti: Oh, nice. Nice.

0:52:05.8 Jordan Syatt: Got to go S.

0:52:07.0 Mike Vacanti: Nice.

0:52:07.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. I mean, you can play at your own level, get movement in, get the community benefit of it, running around, like often being outside or even indoor soccer, whatever stuff. It’s great. S tier.

0:52:19.5 Mike Vacanti: Community, touching grass, interacting with people, off your devices. Those are all the huge benefits to me. You can pick a sport and a level that’s appropriate for you. I think I have to go A, even though I like the idea of S, because of, one, injury risk. I just have coached enough people who love their rec sports and they’re constantly getting hurt and it’s taking them out of the gym. And also, there’s a percentage of people who I think aren’t getting intense enough cardio.

0:52:59.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, that’s fair. It’s funny, people are always worried about getting injured from lifting, but it’s like you get way more injured from recreational…

0:53:08.1 Mike Vacanti: Playing soccer over the age of 35. Yeah.

0:53:13.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:53:14.0 Mike Vacanti: Great episode. We’ll be back next Tuesday. Five-star review, like the YouTube video, subscribe. See you soon.

0:53:19.6 Jordan Syatt: See you.