Episode 266: The Top 30 Healthiest Foods Ranked S to F Tier

0:00:11.7 Mike Vacanti: Hello, Jordan.

0:00:12.3 Jordan Syatt: What’s up, Michael?

0:00:13.1 Mike Vacanti: My camera’s looking extra crispy on this new computer.

0:00:15.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude, you’re looking good.

0:00:18.2 Mike Vacanti: No, I don’t think good. I think just crispy.

0:00:20.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, you’re looking good.

0:00:22.2 Mike Vacanti: Wasn’t my point. I don’t think it’s a good or bad thing. I think it’s just more crisp.

0:00:25.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m saying you look good, dude.

0:00:27.5 Mike Vacanti: You look good.

0:00:30.2 Jordan Syatt: Thank you.

0:00:30.7 Mike Vacanti: You look good.

0:00:31.5 Jordan Syatt: Thank you.

0:00:32.9 Mike Vacanti: Gosh, you really know how to take a compliment. Well done, Jordan. I am a higher percentage Larry David than I want to admit…

[overlapping conversation]

0:00:46.0 Jordan Syatt: Bro, you’re super Larry David.

0:00:47.7 Mike Vacanti: Nope, not super, but I’m higher… I’m not single digit. I’m not single-digit Larry David. I’m like 11.5% Larry David. Here’s what happened.

0:00:58.8 Jordan Syatt: What happened? Yeah, tell me what happened.

0:01:49.4 Mike Vacanti: Post-workout, I’m in a hurry. I gotta get back for the podcast. I’m running a few minutes late. I don’t know how it happened. I think I thought I had an 11:40 flex, but then we don’t have a Q&A today, so I really didn’t have the flex to 11:45…

[overlapping conversation]

0:01:57.6 Jordan Syatt: Hold on, I’m gonna pause you for one second. I think your microphone is your headphones and it’s just fucking…

[vocalization]

0:02:05.8 Mike Vacanti: That’s a wonderful pause. Well done. All right, we’re back. After some technical difficulties, I’m back on the old computer. Got the audio working good.

0:02:14.0 Jordan Syatt: Not as crispy anymore, but still looking good, dude.

0:02:22.2 Mike Vacanti: Thanks, bro. Thanks.

0:02:28.5 Jordan Syatt: All right, let’s hear the Larry David story. I want to hear it.

0:02:30.4 Mike Vacanti: Larry David. All right, I get done with my workout. Head over. I wasn’t prepared, so I had to stop by the gas station, get a protein shake and a Clif bar. I go in the gas station. I’m in a hurry ’cause I gotta get back here to podcast with you. Go to the back corner. No Muscle Milks. Shoot. Think of where’s the closest gas station that has Muscle Milks. The other one that’s close by doesn’t stock ’em, and I don’t know where another one is that has them nearby. I’m worried about being late with you. I think, okay, gas stations like this usually have a backup supply. So I stick my face in the door, right? And I can see through some of the empty SKUs into the back cooler area, and I see a big box of Muscle Milk Pro Series 40 chocolate. I’m like, okay, we’re golden. It’s me and one other guy in the store. Nice-looking old man. He’s browsing around. He might be filling up a cup of coffee. I go to the front, and there’s no one behind the cash register. So I chill there for a minute, two minutes, two and a half minutes. I’m starting to think, is there anyone here? Should I just go to find another gas station? I’m gonna be late for the podcast. This isn’t good. Dude walks in right then and goes behind the cash register. At this point, it’s me and the old dude waiting in line and no one else in the store. I say to the old guy, he just has a cup of coffee, I’m like, “You go ahead. I gotta do something.” He pays for it real quick, makes his way out. Just me and the cashier in the store, no one else. I’m like, “Sir, I’m looking to buy a Muscle Milk, and I see there are some in the back, but there aren’t any up front. Would you be able to help me and go grab one, please?” He’s like, “I’m here alone. Can’t do it.”

0:03:20.0 Jordan Syatt: Oh, jeez.

0:03:21.1 Mike Vacanti: I’m like, “It would really help me out a lot.” Meaning he doesn’t have another employee there with him. I guess there’s usually two of them. I’m like, “It would really help me out a lot. Is there any chance you could go back there and just grab one for me real quick?” And he goes, “The thing is is I can’t leave this area with no one else here.” And I go…

0:03:40.1 Jordan Syatt: “You were just gone.”

0:03:42.2 Mike Vacanti: I literally just. I was like, “Sir, I was standing here for three minutes and there was no one behind the cash register.” And he goes, “That’s ’cause I was outside.” And I just stare at him. And he hustles off to run back there and get the Muscle Milk. Goes back there, gets the Muscle Milk, comes out to the front. I’m overly thankful, even though I’m slightly annoyed at how he acted in the whole thing. But, yeah, I think I’m Larry David.

0:04:07.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. I mean, to be fair, you were way more polite. And when that guy came back out, Larry David would have been like, “See? It wasn’t that hard, huh?”

0:04:18.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[laughter]

0:04:20.3 Mike Vacanti: That’s actually good. I should have done that.

0:04:22.7 Jordan Syatt: You’re far more polite than Larry David.

0:04:24.9 Mike Vacanti: Okay, well, that’s why I’m only 11.5%.

0:04:27.3 Jordan Syatt: “What do you mean? You were just…. I was here for three minutes. Where’ve you been?”

0:04:29.9 Mike Vacanti: Well, it was such like. Yeah. He’s like, “I’m sorry, sir, we can’t leave this area unattended.” I’m like, “You gotta be…” In my mind, I’m like, “You gotta be kidding me, bro.”

0:04:38.2 Jordan Syatt: You’ve been unattended for longer than you’ve been attended.

0:04:40.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, exactly.

0:04:42.4 Jordan Syatt: What is going on? Oh man.

0:04:44.8 Mike Vacanti: Exactly. So, got the Muscle Milk, and here we are recording live in the flesh.

0:04:48.1 Jordan Syatt: Let’s go.

0:04:48.8 Mike Vacanti: We are rating the top 30 health foods.

0:04:52.7 Jordan Syatt: Oh, 30.

0:04:53.5 Mike Vacanti: We’re gonna go rapid fire because there’s… Like, what are we gonna say about dark leafy greens? There’s a lot of things on this list that we just, yeah, sure. S-tier to F-tier. A lot of nostalgia, a lot of personal preference, a lot of fact, a lot of evidence-based, but also a lot of just letting it rip.

0:05:10.6 Jordan Syatt: A lot of emotion.

0:05:12.6 Mike Vacanti: Maybe from your end. Not a lot of emotion.

0:05:13.1 Jordan Syatt: I’m bringing some emotion into it.

0:05:14.4 Mike Vacanti: Why?

0:05:15.4 Jordan Syatt: Nostalgia is emotion. If we’re using nostalgia, then we’re using emotion.

0:05:19.4 Mike Vacanti: Hang on, is nostalgia emotion?

0:05:31.9 Jordan Syatt: You’re fact-checking me on this?

0:05:35.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I am. Feels like it should be in a separate category, like, horizontal to emotion. Doesn’t feel like it’s under the emotion umbrella. Yeah, you’re right. Okay, we’ll bring some emotion to it. Number one, leafy greens. Kale, spinach, Swiss chard, collard greens.

0:05:49.3 Jordan Syatt: Hmm. I’m gonna give this…

0:05:52.1 Mike Vacanti: We can’t go S-tier because nostalgia.

0:05:53.9 Jordan Syatt: That’s not S-tier.

[overlapping conversation]

0:05:55.8 Mike Vacanti: This could be the physically, physiologically, biologically healthiest food for humans ever, and it wouldn’t get an S because it has reverse nostalgia.

0:06:05.3 Jordan Syatt: Dude, I’m gonna give it a B.

0:06:08.7 Mike Vacanti: Wow.

0:06:10.2 Jordan Syatt: I’m gonna give it a B.

0:06:12.6 Mike Vacanti: Wow. Okay, Paul.

0:06:14.2 Jordan Syatt: Well, no, Paul would give it an F because he’d say they’re toxic to you and that they’re dangerous.

0:06:16.7 Mike Vacanti: Does he not eat them?

0:06:18.0 Jordan Syatt: No, he says that they’re dangerous.

0:06:20.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but then he will in two years. He’s trending that way.

0:06:25.2 Jordan Syatt: Here’s the reason. The dark leafy greens are great. They’re fantastic. I also think you can get the benefits of dark leafy greens in other areas, and I just don’t think… And the taste is, I’m factoring taste into it.

0:06:47.9 Mike Vacanti: As we should.

0:06:50.1 Jordan Syatt: And I just think that there are… I think they should be included on a regular basis, but in terms of the actual density of the nutrients, in addition to… I’m also considering necessary for life and function. People can do really well without them.

0:07:12.0 Mike Vacanti: Does that mean you’re gonna put foods that have macronutrients above those that are almost purely micronutrients?

0:07:18.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:07:19.3 Mike Vacanti: Okay. So to be a health food, having calories, an actual amount of calories, is going to bump it on your list.

0:07:26.3 Jordan Syatt: Yes, correct.

0:07:27.5 Mike Vacanti: Cool. I’m going to give it an A. There’s a little bit of nostalgia going back to Nutrition 101 with Dr. Anderson back over at Ag Hall in Wisconsin. Dark leafy greens came up a lot in that semester. I actually hate kale. I think it’s an atrocious food. The texture bothers me. The taste isn’t good. I find it difficult to mask, no matter what’s on it, what dressing, etcetera.

0:08:03.0 Jordan Syatt: How many times a month do you eat dark leafy greens?

0:08:09.2 Mike Vacanti: Meals that have a dark leafy green in them?

0:08:12.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:08:13.9 Mike Vacanti: Problem is, I don’t like cooked spinach. Is arugula a dark leafy green?

0:08:18.9 Jordan Syatt: I don’t think so. Is it?

0:08:20.6 Mike Vacanti: I’m just going by color. Romaine lettuce obviously isn’t.

0:08:24.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, romaine lettuce is not. Let me see if arugula. Yes, it is. It is classified as a dark leafy green.

0:08:29.8 Mike Vacanti: Okay. Arugula is our main salad for side salads.

0:08:34.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, me as well.

0:08:35.2 Mike Vacanti: So probably 15 times a month.

0:08:40.3 Jordan Syatt: Okay.

0:08:41.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I eat dark leafy greens. I’m not afraid of vegetables.

0:08:44.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:08:45.6 Mike Vacanti: Hey, I don’t hate the B rating. I just gotta give it… I think it’s an A. Two, broccoli and other cruciferous vegetables like Brussels sprouts, cabbage, etcetera.

0:08:55.3 Jordan Syatt: Hmm. I’m gonna give these… Here’s what I’m gonna do. I’m gonna bump dark leafy greens up to a B-plus, and I’m gonna put these on a B-plus as well.

0:09:06.1 Mike Vacanti: Oh, interesting. I thought you were going to put them a peg below dark leafy greens.

0:09:10.2 Jordan Syatt: The reason is because these fill you up more. So incorporating these, I think, is actually better for weight loss because they fill you up. You get way more satiation from eating these cruciferous vegetables as opposed to the leafy greens, which don’t really fill you up that much. So I think these have the benefit of added satiety. So that’s where. But I’m gonna put them equal because, unless I’m mistaken, the dark leafy greens are more micronutrient dense. So you’ve got more micronutrients with the dark leafies, but you’ve got more fullness from the cruciferous. So both B-plus.

0:09:53.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, and it gives us little notes here that we know deep in our soul, but yeah, there are more folate, iron, calcium. There are definitely more micronutrients in dark leafy greens. Hypothetically, what if you are on an MTV show in the mid-2000s and you take an entire head of lettuce and you cut it with a scissors, or perhaps eat two heads of lettuce cut with a scissors and a little bit of fat-free Italian dressing? That doesn’t fill you up?

0:10:24.1 Jordan Syatt: No, that’ll fill you up.

0:10:25.1 Mike Vacanti: Are you catching the reference?

0:10:26.5 Jordan Syatt: What is that from, dude?

0:10:27.6 Mike Vacanti: It’s from True Life with that Long Island dude, that Italian guy.

0:10:32.7 Jordan Syatt: True Life?

0:10:33.8 Mike Vacanti: True Life TV.

0:10:36.5 Jordan Syatt: No, I know what True Life is, but I’m trying to remember which episode this is.

0:10:37.4 Mike Vacanti: Dude’s jacked out of his mind. His whole family’s eating lasagna.

0:10:40.1 Jordan Syatt: Oh, the bodybuilder.

0:10:41.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah.

0:10:45.1 Jordan Syatt: True Life: I’m a Bodybuilder. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:10:47.1 Mike Vacanti: That guy’s a legend. Yeah, I really like Brussels sprouts.

0:10:57.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, roasted. Roasted Brussels sprouts, bro. Come on.

0:10:58.1 Mike Vacanti: There’s gonna be a lot of personal preference here, especially with digestibility because some people do better, some people do worse with these types of vegetables. I like them much more cooked compared to raw and digest them better cooked. I think in the B tier is fine, although I put the dark leafies in the A. So sure, B-plus, I’m fine with.

0:11:20.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Roasted Brussels sprouts with buffalo sauce. Like buffalo roasted Brussels sprouts.

0:11:26.0 Mike Vacanti: Oh, interesting. Super good. I haven’t tried that combo.

0:11:29.9 Jordan Syatt: It’s amazing. Highly recommend.

0:11:32.4 Mike Vacanti: I do like buffalo sauce and I do like Brussels sprouts, but I haven’t. I’ll give that a shot. Three, blueberries and other berries like strawberries, raspberries.

0:11:41.4 Jordan Syatt: S-tier.

0:11:42.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, say no more. I don’t even think we need to elaborate.

0:11:45.7 Jordan Syatt: S. Berries, S. Four, salmon. S. Salmon is S-tier. Berries are S-tier. They’re just… They’re both just supreme.

0:11:57.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, salmon, getting those delicious omega-3 fatty acids.

0:12:04.0 Jordan Syatt: Protein, high-quality fats, filling. Berries get the fiber, the micros. It’s just, yeah. I have both almost every day. I have berries legit every day and salmon almost every day.

0:12:15.5 Mike Vacanti: Correct me if I’m wrong, because I just might not be consuming this type of content, but is supplementing fish oil less popular now than it was 10 years ago?

0:12:24.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it is.

0:12:25.9 Mike Vacanti: Why is that?

0:12:28.8 Jordan Syatt: I just think… I think 10 years ago it wasn’t… It was like the content to make around it was less. Like it was still relatively new. And I think now it’s been already made so much that people just don’t make as much content around it.

0:12:46.0 Mike Vacanti: You’re not going viral on the “take two capsules of fish oil a day.”

0:12:50.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, no.

0:12:51.5 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

0:12:52.0 Jordan Syatt: And so many people have done the EPA to DHA ratio that it’s just been done.

0:12:56.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I find that when I start tracking again, and I like to go lower fat, lower fat training day especially if I’m in a surplus, you end up getting more carbs. Great for performance, great for recovery, but it limits your fat sources. Or it limits your total fat, obviously, which in turn leads to, okay, I’m having salmon less often than I otherwise would, which made me dig in the freezer like, hey, do I still have? Because we eat salmon at least once a week. And so I don’t need to be supplementing fish oil, but it made me think, oh, do I have fish oil? And they were in there, so I started taking them again.

0:13:37.0 Jordan Syatt: Oh, let’s go.

0:13:38.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, day two. But five, avocado.

0:13:43.6 Jordan Syatt: S-tier. Avocado’s S-tier. Super high-quality fats, a lot of fiber. A lot of fiber, which is surprising to people. Filling, delicious. It just… It goes with everything. It’s amazing.

0:13:56.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah, I think what, like depending on the size of the avocado, nine to 14 grams of fiber.

0:14:03.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah.

0:14:03.8 Mike Vacanti: Which is way more than you would expect.

0:14:06.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:14:06.6 Mike Vacanti: Got those monounsaturated fats, the king of fats. I know. I know we had this. We had that debate, not you and I, but steel-manning monounsaturateds versus all of the “seed oils are the best, you should eat seed oils” crowd, which was really just a response to the “seed oils are the devil” crowd. Yeah, avocado’s delicious, too. It goes on so many things.

0:14:33.9 Jordan Syatt: It’s delicious. Yes.

0:14:38.7 Mike Vacanti: Six, eggs.

0:14:39.9 Jordan Syatt: This one’s tough. If you’d asked me this 10 years ago, I would have given a different answer. 10 years ago, I would have said S-tier.

0:14:48.3 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

0:14:49.4 Jordan Syatt: Now I’m gonna say B. I’m gonna say B tier.

0:14:55.0 Mike Vacanti: B. Wow.

0:14:57.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. And I’ll give you my thoughts. So the yolk is so nutrient-dense. It’s wildly nutrient-dense. There’re so many great benefits to it. Eye health, high-quality protein. With that being said, I think I’m not gonna say the most important thing first. I’m gonna say sort of like a sidebar first. People often talk about how whole eggs are an incredible source of protein, but realistically, egg whites are an incredible source of protein, if we’re being honest. Whole eggs have a significant amount of fat per whole egg, and it’s 6 grams of protein for like 70 cals. Significant amount of fat, just not… It’s really the entire egg is not the most extraordinary source of protein. It’s very high quality, but it really. The egg white is the best part of the protein.

0:15:50.6 Mike Vacanti: Exactly. And just to back you up there, there’s like five grams of fat in a large egg. Basically all of that is in the yolk. There’s 6 grams of protein, like 4-ish of that is in the white, 2 is in the yolk. So when you think about fats being 2.25 times as dense as proteins, like 5 fat, we’re talking like 12 to 2 ratio of fat to protein, which is massive in the yolk.

0:16:16.0 Jordan Syatt: And in terms of the potential for cholesterol issues, for me, it’s just not worth it on a very regular basis. I think for me, I would just rather have something lower cholesterol on a more regular basis. I think the idea… Like eggs, they’re really good, but I think if you’re having it on a daily or almost daily basis, whole eggs, especially if you’re a little bit more at risk for cholesterol issues, just not worth it. And you can easily substitute that for something else, whether it’s Greek yogurt, cottage cheese, chicken, whatever. There’s just so many other options that I’d rather you have on a regular basis. So I know that for our earlier years in the industry, eggs were just like every… There was a period of time where I was having like 12 eggs a day. It was just like they were… I just used to think they were S-tier. As I’ve gotten older, as more research has come out, it just…

0:17:24.2 Mike Vacanti: Saturated fat is a precursor to testosterone. So if you consume 12 eggs a day, your total test levels will shoot into the 1500 plus range.

0:17:33.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:17:34.3 Mike Vacanti: This is a fact. That was like 2014 logic.

0:17:38.5 Jordan Syatt: Correct. Correct. Yeah. So I think they’re a really great option. I also think that people overestimate how great the overall protein is from whole eggs. And I think if you want to have them regularly, I would say like a 4 to 1 ratio of egg white to yolk. So like if you’re gonna have… I would rather you have like eight egg whites and two whole eggs rather than having like five whole eggs or something. It’s just I would just much rather you really prioritize the egg white and you don’t need a bunch of whole eggs in order to get the benefit from it.

0:18:15.7 Mike Vacanti: It’s a very respectable answer. I cannot give eggs S-tier for the protein reason that you just outlined, which is they’re not a great source of protein. They’re primarily fat. And because so many people need to be eating more protein and limiting their fats, really limiting their total calories, but by extension limiting their fats and carbohydrates, eggs aren’t S-tier for the majority of people. I actually don’t know this. I don’t know how many foods contain significant amounts of choline, but I know eggs do. And I know that my brain works better when I’m eating eggs consistently. Top 10 foods in choline: beef liver, chicken liver, eggs, caviar, beef kidney, salmon, beef, soybeans, pork, chicken breast. Interesting. So I don’t eat liver. Maybe I should. I’m not on that caviar level of income. I’ve never eaten kidney before.

0:19:25.0 Jordan Syatt: Gary loves caviar.

0:19:27.0 Mike Vacanti: Gary does love caviar. Interesting. I don’t eat a lot of pork. Chicken breast, beef, salmon.

0:19:39.3 Jordan Syatt: Soybeans are interesting.

0:19:41.0 Mike Vacanti: Soybeans are interesting. Best plant-based source, good for vegetarians. 107 to 200 mgs. So 214 in a full cup of soybeans versus 169 in one egg yolk, which is kind of crazy. That’s one of the reasons I like eggs. There’s definitely a nostalgia to eggs. The thing is, if you’re tracking your intake, you just have to plan if you want to make scrambled eggs work into your day. If you want to have four scrambled eggs, that’s 20 grams of fat, not that much protein. So personally, right now, I would do it on a non-training day where I have more fats to play with. But the point you make about for the majority of people, especially if you’re trying to get more protein in your diet, doing a combination of whole eggs and egg whites with more egg whites than whole eggs in a serving is a really good idea. Eggs are an overrated source of protein relative to the number of calories they have. I don’t know enough to speak on authority about the exact relationship between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol. For sure, if you have high cholesterol and eating more cholesterol leads your cholesterol levels to go even higher. Yeah, you gotta pay attention to that and not be just eating a five-egg omelet every single morning. I’m sure there are people who can eat a few eggs per day and not have issues with their cholesterol. And for those individuals, great. Do your thing.

0:21:28.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:21:32.9 Mike Vacanti: Almonds.

0:21:34.7 Jordan Syatt: Oof. I’m gonna give these an A. I think this is an A. It’s an incredible, incredible food. Super nutritious, great fiber, decent protein. Decent. Decent. Not great.

0:21:48.9 Mike Vacanti: Really good monounsaturated fats.

0:21:50.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I think they’re a really great addition to basically any diet. But yeah, it’s an A tier.

0:21:58.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I would knock them down a peg from S in that many people who… And this is just for nuts in general. Many people who think of nuts as healthy overeat nuts in calories. “Oh, it’s a super healthy snack. I’m just gonna have a few handfuls.” It’s like, well, that’s 700 calories. That’s not a snack. Yeah. Easy.

0:22:23.1 Jordan Syatt: I also don’t know how they do that. I get nauseous if I have too many. And some people, I see them just scooping out handfuls. I’m like, bro, that’s so much. You just need a palmful, maybe.

0:22:35.5 Mike Vacanti: Have you always had that?

0:22:36.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:22:37.4 Mike Vacanti: Do you get that from other, if you were to eat 40 grams of fat from a different source, would it make you nauseous?

0:22:43.8 Jordan Syatt: Any nut. Any nut.

0:22:44.7 Mike Vacanti: Maybe you have a sensitivity.

0:22:47.0 Jordan Syatt: Could be cashews, could be any. Yeah, maybe. I can’t have huge quantities of nuts.

0:22:51.6 Mike Vacanti: What if you put something sweet in there, like trail mix?

0:22:54.1 Jordan Syatt: It’d be way easier, but I would still feel a bit nauseous.

0:22:57.3 Mike Vacanti: Interesting. You might have a little sensitivity. I digest almonds wonderfully.

0:23:03.8 Jordan Syatt: But you have 18 almonds. You’re not having three handfuls.

0:23:07.2 Mike Vacanti: First of all, 28 almonds is one serving size. Second of all, if I’m really hungry or if I’m in a fat loss phase, I can easily rationalize, “I’m still starving after those 28.” I don’t just eat 28 almonds, obviously. It’s a scoop of protein powder, 28 almonds, and a banana would be some kind of mealish, snackish thing that I’m having during the day at some point. But if I’m still starving after, I’ll be like, “Oh, have another half serving, another 14 almonds. Give me another 14. Give me one more 14.” I’ll borrow those fats from dinner and feel great doing it. Garlic. Almonds A tier, by the way. I agree with you.

0:23:50.1 Jordan Syatt: Man, so now we’re moving into this spice category.

0:23:54.3 Mike Vacanti: We’re just dipping our toe in and then we’re bouncing back out.

0:23:56.9 Jordan Syatt: I think garlic is super underrated. But when I say garlic, I don’t mean the powdered garlic. I mean, you’ve got the shallot.

0:24:06.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, the clove.

0:24:08.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, the clove. What’s a shallot?

0:24:11.4 Mike Vacanti: A shallot is a different food item that’s very similar to garlic.

0:24:15.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, got it. Okay.

0:24:16.2 Mike Vacanti: It looks like garlic.

0:24:17.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, okay. So the clove. Garlic clove, fresh.

0:24:21.1 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know if clove is the right terminology either, by the way. We’ll roll with it, but…

0:24:24.7 Jordan Syatt: It’s either a shallot or a clove. We’ll call it a clove. It’s a clove of garlic. Yeah, clove of garlic. I think that’s the whole clove. But what’s one…

0:24:35.5 Mike Vacanti: Clump of little garlics? Maybe a sliver?

0:24:37.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, we’ll call it a sliver. So garlic, I think is… The research on it is pretty extraordinary. Great anti-inflammatory benefits. I think just overall great health benefits to it. I also wonder how much of it is you’re not having garlic with Doritos. You know what I mean. People who are eating a lot of fresh garlic are making their own food and typically are more health-conscious. You’re not having garlic with your Oreos.

0:25:16.7 Mike Vacanti: You didn’t buy a box of six bags of mini muffins that are super high-dense fat muffins and you just ate all six boxes in eight minutes with your garlic. That didn’t happen.

0:25:19.2 Jordan Syatt: Exactly. So I think by emphasizing fresh garlic, you have to be emphasizing whole, minimally processed, and more nutrient-dense foods in and of itself. But I’m gonna give garlic a B because I think it has the potential for many great health benefits, but by itself, it cannot do great things in the absence of an overall great diet and lifestyle.

0:25:48.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I’m with you. I’m great with it, but there are many healthier “foods”. And by the way, we really need to somewhat preface this list with: we can rank individual foods as healthy to unhealthy and have fun with it and talk about each one and give some nuance and some context, but no individual food can be healthy or unhealthy without seeing the entire diet, seeing what other foods you’re eating in terms of micronutrients, seeing how many total calories you’re consuming a day relative to your total daily energy expenditure, seeing how much protein you’re eating, seeing how much fiber you’re eating, seeing how much activity you’re doing. The big picture is more important for health outcomes than whether or not you eat chia seeds or whether or not you eat carrots or don’t eat carrots, right?

0:26:41.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:26:42.3 Mike Vacanti: Still a fun list, and I think we’ll probably do decent. There have been how many “the top 13 superfoods” articles have we seen over the last 20 years?

0:26:53.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. But I think if your diet is mainly what we outline as B tier and up, you’ve got a very healthy diet.

0:27:05.5 Mike Vacanti: Yes. What’s interesting here, I’m gonna give you a little case study. Two people, both have caloric maintenances of 2300 calories per day. Person A consumes 1800-ish calories that’s 70% processed foods over a five-year window. And person B consumes 3300 calories that are 80 to 90% foods off of this list. Both are 30 pounds overweight at the start of the experiment. Both do the same, have the same amount of sleep, same amount of exercise, etcetera. Who’s gonna be healthier after five years?

0:27:51.8 Jordan Syatt: I sort of lost it when you said 2300 instead of 2000 just because I was like, why is he doing that number? So I didn’t even fully listen to the different options.

0:28:01.0 Mike Vacanti: One person is eating 3300 calories per day at a 2300 maintenance.

0:28:06.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh, okay.

0:28:07.4 Mike Vacanti: And one person’s eating like 1800 and change.

0:28:10.5 Jordan Syatt: The 1800 is gonna be healthier.

0:28:13.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Now, it’s easier to eat fewer calories. Obviously, that’s in a vacuum, right? If we eat healthier foods, more nutrient-dense foods, foods with more fiber, more protein, etcetera, satiety is gonna be better. You’re gonna be able to manage your calories better on that intake. But let’s not get too focused on one tree. Let’s back up and see that forest. Olive oil, extra virgin style.

0:28:37.9 Jordan Syatt: Oof. Bro, it’s so good. Literally got my olive oil right here.

0:28:45.3 Mike Vacanti: Very nice.

0:28:47.3 Jordan Syatt: I’m gonna give it A. It can’t be S. It’s just not providing enough for an S-tier by itself. But looking at the instances in which you would be adding some type of an oil, it’s just the supreme oil to be adding. It’s the supreme.

0:29:05.1 Mike Vacanti: Supreme.

0:29:09.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s just the best one. It’s very easy to overdo, ridiculously calorically dense. So you’ve got to be aware of how much you’re having. But in terms of overall health benefits, anti-inflammatory benefits, especially with the polyphenol content, heart health benefits, all of that. And just also if you’re using olive oil instead of something like butter, just the benefit of not having something like the super high saturated fat content, it’s just great. It’s an A.

0:29:40.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, swapping your saturateds for some monounsaturateds is a really good idea over the long term. Doesn’t mean you can’t eat saturated fat. But yeah, you make a great point about it being easy to overconsume, especially in something like a dressing or if you’re drizzling it on vegetables and not measuring or if you’re dipping bread in it. These are all places where you can easily consume three, four, five servings of olive oil in a very short period of time. One tablespoon contains 14 grams of fat, which is in the 110 to 120 calorie range, which if you think about a tablespoon, that’s quite small, but ridiculously healthy source of fat.

0:29:52.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:30:33.8 Mike Vacanti: Just don’t want to overdo it. A tier. 10, Greek yogurt.

0:30:37.7 Jordan Syatt: Ooh, I gotta give this an S, dude.

0:30:39.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:30:44.5 Jordan Syatt: Greek yogurt has to be an S. Super high protein. And by the way, I’m gonna go with the lower-fat Greek yogurt options. I just don’t see much of a reason to be getting the full-fat one.

0:31:00.1 Mike Vacanti: Taste.

0:31:03.0 Jordan Syatt: Unless maybe someone’s underweight or if someone likes the taste of it and they are aware of their calories as a whole. But if you’re trying to watch your calories, you just don’t need the full-fat option. And the low-fat options taste great. They’re filling. They’re awesome.

0:31:13.2 Mike Vacanti: Oh, you go low, not no?

0:31:16.3 Jordan Syatt: I go no. I go no-fat.

0:31:19.4 Mike Vacanti: Not like you.

0:31:22.3 Jordan Syatt: I go no-fat. But it’s also such a great vehicle for berries and nuts as well. So there are so many things that you can do with it to elevate it even further. So for me, Greek yogurt, berries, and almonds, it’s just what a great breakfast.

0:31:40.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:31:41.3 Jordan Syatt: Or great pre-bed snack.

0:31:44.3 Mike Vacanti: Are you consuming Greek yogurt that contains much sugar/any artificial sweetener?

0:31:54.8 Jordan Syatt: I prefer that tart-ish flavor of just the natural without the sugars and stuff.

0:32:01.4 Mike Vacanti: Purple Fage. 0%, nothing added, just get after it.

0:32:04.5 Jordan Syatt: Correct. Yeah, Skyr. I like Skyr a lot. Super good. But yeah, I’m not the biggest fan. And it’s not that they’re bad. It’s more just I just like the taste of the regular version. But my daughters have the one with the flavor all the time. They love the vanilla flavor one. And by the way, it’s ridiculous.

0:32:28.7 Mike Vacanti: It’s good. I know.

0:32:29.7 Jordan Syatt: The vanilla flavor is wildly good.

0:32:30.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Something you can do if you do like have a little sweeter tooth, you can get the lower-sugar, low-fat option and then drizzle honey on there. You can even do a little bit of Splenda or Stevia, whatever your sweetener preference is if you want to go with a lower-calorie option. Yeah, I think Greek yogurt’s S-tier. A lot of digestive benefits, great protein source, tasty. Can put good stuff in there. Fruit, apples, bananas, berries. Any of these can mix well into Greek yogurt. And even the higher-fat versions, like the 2%, which isn’t high-fat, but the 2% has 17 grams of protein and 3.5 grams of fat per three-quarter cup, which…

0:33:30.9 Jordan Syatt: Isn’t bad at all.

0:33:33.8 Mike Vacanti: It’s not a ton. So if you have a preference based on texture. I grew up drinking skim milk. Like non-fat milk…

0:33:35.7 Jordan Syatt: Same.

0:33:38.8 Mike Vacanti: Is what we drank in our house, and so I never had a problem with it. I know people who need 2% milk, otherwise they just don’t like the taste.

0:33:44.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, they’re like, “It tastes like water.”

0:33:46.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Great.

[overlapping conversation]

0:33:52.0 Mike Vacanti: It’s just straight protein and carbs. I feel like skim milk is an underrated…

0:33:52.9 Jordan Syatt: Agreed.

0:33:56.1 Mike Vacanti: Food in general. But also specifically for weightlifters. It got a bad rap in the ’90s in the bodybuilding community for whatever reason.

[overlapping conversation]

0:34:05.3 Jordan Syatt: It’s so good, dude. It also makes your protein shakes taste so good. You can make them nice and thick. It’s amazing.

0:34:12.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s true. Sweet potatoes.

0:34:14.4 Jordan Syatt: I’m gonna give sweet potatoes… Here’s where my brain is going. We haven’t really had any just carb sources yet. So I’m thinking, okay, this is the first real carb source that we’ve got.

0:34:31.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, it’s a starch. It’s not like broccoli or something that has some carbs. But yeah. Yep.

0:34:48.4 Jordan Syatt: I’m gonna go B-plus. I’m going B-plus. It’s a very high-quality carb source. It’s delicious. Very nostalgic, mainly from the era of when I thought white potatoes were bad, so I just had tons of sweet potatoes. I think overall, whether it’s white potatoes, sweet potatoes, whatever, I think they’re all really good. I would give them all a B-plus. But sweet potatoes also have this interesting part in my brain that are like, “Oh, I’m really doing something for my health right now.” Where it’s like, even though I completely know they both have benefits, they’re both great, sweet potatoes feel cleaner to me, just in my brain.

0:35:15.1 Mike Vacanti: Nostalgically.

0:35:16.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, nostalgically, emotionally. So yeah, I’m gonna go B-plus.

0:35:23.0 Mike Vacanti: Nostalgia is definitely an emotion. I’m gonna go A-minus. Thanksgiving gives them a nostalgia bump taste. I love sweet potatoes without added fat. Regular potatoes, I like a little olive oil, I like chopping them like a potato, olive oil, salt, maybe a little garlic powder, roast them… Amazing. But I can pretty much just eat a baked sweet potato with very little, maybe some cinnamon on there. Got those autumn vibes, which I like. It’s football season. There’s a lot of emotion around sweet potatoes. A lot. And high fiber, potassium, beta-carotene, get those orange foods. And the satiety you get from potatoes in general, relative to rice. Almost like if you want to think about clean carbs in a simple way, you can think muscle gain: white rice; fat loss: potatoes, just because it’s easier to eat more rice than it is to eat more potatoes from a fullness perspective. You can get more full on fewer calories with the potatoes. So potatoes are great. Sweet potatoes are great.

0:36:46.5 Jordan Syatt: There’s so many ways to make them. Like, there’s so many options with potatoes.

0:36:51.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. But again, don’t get confused like we all used to. There’s a lot of confusion in the system.

0:36:57.2 Jordan Syatt: There’s confusion in the system.

0:36:58.9 Mike Vacanti: Or at least there was. Maybe there isn’t as much. But that sweet potatoes are incredible and white potatoes are trash…

[overlapping conversation]

0:37:09.0 Mike Vacanti: All potatoes essentially have some benefits. Don’t go down the frozen aisle and get your sweet potato fries that are laced with canola oil, which, whatever, but just bumping the total fat content, and think that that’s a health food, but a white potato is bad for you somehow. No, no, no, no, no.

0:37:23.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, no, it’s insane.

0:37:24.6 Mike Vacanti: Quinoa.

0:37:25.6 Jordan Syatt: Ugh. This one, just as a person, I hate it. Just personally. So this is gonna get downgraded a lot.

0:37:36.1 Mike Vacanti: Downgraded a lot.

0:37:38.0 Jordan Syatt: It’s gonna be downgraded more than it should be just because health-wise, it’s a really great option. But for me, I hate quinoa. I hate the texture. It’s not filling at all. It’s not tasty. I just don’t like it. Just personally.

0:37:57.1 Mike Vacanti: I’m gonna jump in before you even give your rating. Jordan and I have never discussed quinoa in our entire friendship since I’ve known him, to my knowledge. I also hate quinoa. I think it’s disgusting. I think it’s such a downgrade from rice, such an unnecessary… I would eat rice every day of my life before I eat quinoa one time.

0:38:20.8 Jordan Syatt: 100%.

0:38:21.8 Mike Vacanti: The fact that quinoa got propped up as this protein source from 2013 to 2018.

[overlapping conversation]

0:38:29.4 Mike Vacanti: By this delusional, factless community boggles my mind to this day and offends me deeply. The number of people in mid-2016 who told me that they were so pumped with this high-protein meal that was essentially just quinoa and had 8 grams of protein and 47 grams of carbohydrates just made my head absolutely spin.

0:38:56.3 Jordan Syatt: And the way it’s pronounced based on how it’s spelled…

[overlapping conversation]

0:39:00.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s supposed to be Quinoa, if we’re being honest.

0:39:02.2 Mike Vacanti: Let’s call it…

[overlapping conversation]

0:39:02.8 Jordan Syatt: It shouldn’t be quinoa. It should be Quinoa.

0:39:05.3 Mike Vacanti: It’s Quinoa. I’m grading on a curve, which means of these 30, someone’s getting an F, and it’s quinoa. I’m giving quinoa an F.

0:39:15.2 Jordan Syatt: F. F. Fuck it.

[laughter]

0:39:21.8 Mike Vacanti: Lentils. And we gotta pick up the pace.

0:39:24.6 Jordan Syatt: Lentils are S-tier.

0:39:25.9 Mike Vacanti: Really?

0:39:27.0 Jordan Syatt: Lentils are S-tier. Number one, I love them personally. I really enjoy them. I have beans and/or lentils basically every single day for the last at least year, two years. The research around them is astounding. It’s just gargantuan. Decent protein, significant fiber. You can have them with so many different options in terms of they pair really well with so many different meals. I like the taste. You could spice them how you’d like. And now we live in a world in America that’s just there are so many pre-prepared lentil options that you don’t have to prepare yourself, which make them exponentially more convenient and readily available. So I’m going S-tier. I love lentils.

0:40:21.2 Mike Vacanti: I’ll go A. Agree, lots of health benefits. I don’t like them as much as you do. There was a lot of confusion that they were this elite protein source for many years, too.

0:40:31.8 Jordan Syatt: Not elite protein. Definitely not.

0:40:33.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. But fiber and…

0:40:34.2 Jordan Syatt: And good protein. Tag-along proteins. Yeah. Maybe slightly above tag-along.

0:40:39.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, above tag-along. Right. I’m pumped when I see 4 grams of protein in my slice of bread. Beans have usually, like a black bean is 7 grams, 21 carbs, basically no fat. So you’re getting it’s like 25% protein, which in a society that we spent 25 years thinking peanut butter was a protein source, lentils are much more of a protein source than peanut butter. Oats.

0:41:07.2 Jordan Syatt: I love oats. We gotta put them in the same category as sweet potatoes. I might go slightly above the sweet potato because more fiber, potentially more protein, mildly.

0:41:24.8 Mike Vacanti: Oats versus sweet potatoes. Yeah.

0:41:34.1 Jordan Syatt: So I’m gonna give oats an A-minus. Yeah, I think they’re… And I think you gave sweet potatoes an A-minus, but I think I gave them a B-plus. So I’m gonna go A-minus for oats. They’re great. I eat them all the time. Great option. I find them filling. I think they’re great.

0:41:43.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, oats are wonderful. A-minus is a good spot for them. Good source of soluble fiber. I’m a fan. Tomatoes.

0:41:53.2 Jordan Syatt: I’m putting tomatoes at an A, and I’m putting them significantly above what I put the green leafy vegetables. I think that they… Number one, I like the taste way more.

0:42:09.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, you’re a big tomato guy.

0:42:11.5 Jordan Syatt: Love tomatoes. I love making shakshuka. I think that you got the lycopene when you cook them. There’s just so many options for them. I’ll have them cooked, I’ll have them raw. I’ll eat it like an apple. They make a big difference on your turkey sandwiches. You could have them with your breakfast, you can have them with your lunch, you can have them with your dinner. They’re filling relatively per calorie. I love tomatoes. I’m giving them an A. That’s fair.

[overlapping conversation]

0:42:42.0 Mike Vacanti: B. I don’t love the taste. They have health benefits that you outlined. There’s only two people who I’ve ever heard describe tomatoes as filling, and it’s… Do you know who the other person is?

0:42:58.2 Jordan Syatt: Gary.

0:43:00.9 Mike Vacanti: Gary. Gary. Gary at one point had this theory that tomatoes were filling enough to be like he could swap a piece of meat for a tomato and save calories. I mean, and I love the creative thinking. He was actually asking me if it was many years ago, if that was a thing, if anyone ever did that.

0:43:22.6 Jordan Syatt: I think vegans do that.

0:43:23.8 Mike Vacanti: No way.

0:43:24.6 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know.

0:43:25.3 Mike Vacanti: Tomato main course?

0:43:33.2 Jordan Syatt: I made it up. I made it up. But they’ll take vegan ingredients or foods and then make them look like meat. So they’ll take tofu and try and make it look like meat, and I thought maybe they would do that with tomatoes.

0:43:41.0 Mike Vacanti: Perhaps they may. You said tomatoes make or break a… Or they make a big difference in a turkey sandwich. Do you know what really makes a big difference in a turkey sandwich?

0:43:50.5 Jordan Syatt: Avocado.

0:43:51.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:43:51.8 Jordan Syatt: Mustard?

0:43:52.6 Mike Vacanti: Both, yes.

0:43:55.0 Jordan Syatt: The bread.

0:43:55.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, you’re right there too. I don’t think you’re even gonna get the answer. I’ll let you keep going.

0:44:01.7 Jordan Syatt: What else? Are you gonna say Bacon?

0:44:03.2 Mike Vacanti: The pickles.

0:44:04.2 Jordan Syatt: Oh, that’s super Jewish of you.

0:44:06.8 Mike Vacanti: Is it?

0:44:07.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, dude. Jews love pickles.

0:44:11.7 Mike Vacanti: I think I’m legitimately colorblind, and not in a virtue-signally kind of way, in an “I’m stupid” kind of way.

0:44:23.0 Jordan Syatt: Why?

0:44:24.0 Mike Vacanti: I just don’t pick up on trends, whether it’s visual facial features or food preference or

0:44:33.4 Jordan Syatt: Cultural stuff.

0:44:36.5 Mike Vacanti: Last name structure, any of these things. Yeah, bro.

0:44:46.0 Jordan Syatt: On my podcast that I do with Tony, he was telling me about this deli that he goes to, and I was like, “What’s the name?” And he was like, “Bergen something.” I was like, “Oh, that’s definitely Jewish.” And he’s like, “Really?” And I go to the website and it’s like, they’ve got knishes and all clearly super… They’ve got matzo balls. I’m like, “Dude, never mind the name.” But he’s like, “I had no idea that it was the most Jewish thing in the world.” But yeah, pickles are big in the Ashkenazi Jewish community.

0:44:56.8 Mike Vacanti: Really?

0:45:17.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, huge.

0:45:18.4 Mike Vacanti: Do you know why?

0:45:19.8 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know. I think they like pickled foods. Pickled in general is big in the Ashkenaz world.

0:45:26.2 Mike Vacanti: Cool. I think pickled is big in the Nordic world too. My grandma did pickled… We had pickled herring. We had all kinds of pickled stuff.

0:45:36.2 Jordan Syatt: Same thing. Pickled herring is huge. You don’t go to a Jewish funeral, Ashkenazi Jewish funeral. There’s pickled herring all over the place.

0:45:42.8 Mike Vacanti: Really?

0:45:43.4 Jordan Syatt: Oh, yeah.

0:45:46.0 Mike Vacanti: It’s good to know.

0:45:47.2 Jordan Syatt: Gonna go to some Jewish funerals.

0:45:50.5 Mike Vacanti: It’s been a while since I had some good pickled herring and I’m kind of… You know what are the macros on there?

0:45:55.9 Jordan Syatt: Super good.

0:45:56.8 Mike Vacanti: I think so.

0:45:57.6 Jordan Syatt: Maybe a little bit higher fat, but it’s good quality.

0:46:02.4 Mike Vacanti: 12 to 15 protein, 8 to 15 fat, 3 to 8 carb. Rich in omega-3s. Yeah. Huh. Cool. All right, we gotta really rapid fire. We’re 15 in. Here’s our back half of the list. 16: chia seeds.

0:46:29.4 Jordan Syatt: I’ve gotta go A. And I understand I’m sort of going back on what I said in terms of what they provide as a whole. Here’s my thoughts. They’re so easy to add, and I know we talk about how much people are lacking in protein, even more people are lacking in fiber. It’s just such an easy way to add fiber in, and it’s high quality. It’s so easy. It’s simple. They don’t really add any taste. It’s not bad. Just add it and you get way more fiber in your day.

0:46:56.4 Mike Vacanti: I like throwing a little bit of chia seeds in… Excuse me. In my smoothies, like my blended smoothies. They give nice texture and the taste is… They taste like nothing. Yeah. 12 carb, nine fat, 10 fiber, five protein. I think A is reasonable. I have a bias. I have a vendetta that I don’t even know why subconsciously against them, but I think A’s a fine rating there. 17: walnuts.

0:47:34.4 Jordan Syatt: Ooh. You know, in Hebrew, the way you say walnut in Hebrew is… It goes “egoz melech,” which is like the king nut.

0:47:42.9 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

0:47:44.8 Jordan Syatt: It’s the king nut. So I’ve got this emotional attachment as like, “Oh, this is the king of kings right here.” Tons of high-quality fats. I’m gonna give it a B-plus as a more objective ranking. I think it’s very high-quality fat, super good, but yeah, I’m just gonna go B-plus. Trying to speed through this a little bit.

0:48:07.1 Mike Vacanti: I think B-plus is reasonable. I think they’re probably pretty on par with almonds. I don’t remember exactly where we put those, but between a B-plus and an A-minus I think is a fine place for walnuts.

0:48:19.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:48:32.2 Mike Vacanti: Watercress.

0:48:33.6 Jordan Syatt: Ugh. F.

0:48:34.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I don’t…

0:48:35.0 Jordan Syatt: I don’t like it.

0:48:36.4 Mike Vacanti: I don’t like it either. I pick ’em out sometimes.

0:48:37.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I don’t like watercress.

0:48:38.5 Mike Vacanti: I didn’t even realize they had that many health benefits, to be honest.

0:48:39.6 Jordan Syatt: Do they? I don’t think they do. It’s mostly water.

0:48:40.6 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think I’ve spent any time in my life thinking about watercress until this moment. Out of respect for this list and quinoa, I’m gonna put it at E because I just think quinoa deserves the sole F spot still right now. But yeah, watercress… What are we doing? 19: carrots.

0:49:03.0 Jordan Syatt: I love carrot juice. Big fan of carrot juice. Put some ginger in there, ooh, maybe a little jalapeno, make it a little spicy. I’m gonna give… And dude, carrots are filling, by the way. Just straight up crunching on a carrot. I’m gonna go B-plus for a carrot.

0:49:22.3 Mike Vacanti: Oh, you’re struggling with fat? Just eat some carrots. These things are filling. You won’t even want that cake after you have some carrots.

0:49:32.2 Jordan Syatt: A bag of baby carrots will fill you up so fast.

0:49:36.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, there’s… I don’t want to talk about this right now, but super smart people need to get into the difference between the feeling of fullness and… There’s definitely a disconnect between just volume in your stomach fullness versus getting enough calories fullness.

0:49:56.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, agree.

0:49:58.2 Mike Vacanti: And sometimes those get blended together. Carrots are great. Baby carrots are a great snack. They’re nutritious. They’re delicious. I like ’em cooked, I like ’em raw, I like ’em with some brown sugar, maybe a little olive oil. I like ’em all. I love carrots. I like purple carrots, I like orange carrots. At least an A. 20: pumpkin seeds.

0:50:21.4 Jordan Syatt: Ooh, big fan of pumpkin seeds. A. Pumpkin seeds are an A. You got fiber, decent protein, micronutrients, phytonutrients. Yeah. A.

0:50:37.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah. We’re in the back half of this list. We’re just gonna be throwing out letters at this point. Oranges and other citrus, like kiwis, lemons.

0:50:48.7 Jordan Syatt: A-minus.

0:50:49.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I think A’s a good spot. Mushrooms.

0:50:53.6 Jordan Syatt: If it’s not sauteed with onions, don’t give me mushrooms.

0:50:59.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I don’t like mushrooms.

0:51:01.6 Jordan Syatt: I love…

0:51:02.8 Mike Vacanti: Our palates are merging. We used to have a lot of differences in our palates. I feel like we’re discovering more similarities today.

0:51:08.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I think… I had one horrible experience with mushrooms that really tainted my entire view of them. I got a salad, and when I tell you this salad, it must have had, like, six cups of raw mushrooms on top, and it ruined my life for them. I ruined…

0:53:04.9 Mike Vacanti: What age?

0:53:13.6 Jordan Syatt: I think it was high school. Went to Framingham.

0:53:22.2 Mike Vacanti: Pretty prominent memory for you.

0:53:30.8 Jordan Syatt: It was horrible. It was horrible. It was like someone took a dump of mushrooms on my salad. It was just disgusting.

0:53:39.4 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

0:53:39.6 Jordan Syatt: Sauteed onions and mushrooms are amazing. You know what I mean. Especially you go to a sporting event, put some sauteed onions and mushrooms on a sausage. You kidding me, bro? With peppers? That’s… I love that. But it’s really the onions that do it for me. And so mushrooms by themselves, I’m gonna give a C.

0:53:39.9 Mike Vacanti: I think a C is a good rating. I just straight up don’t like the taste of them, no matter how they’re prepared. Onions, no onions, raw, cooked, whatever’s on them. I don’t like mushrooms. Just a personal preference. So I’m gonna go C. People who do like them, great. More power to you. I’ve never had what you just outlined at a sporting event. My go-to order is a broth with sauerkraut and ketchup. That’s best for mine.

0:53:40.1 Jordan Syatt: Oof. That’s great too. But you’ve never had a broth with onions, mushrooms, and peppers?

0:53:40.3 Mike Vacanti: No.

0:54:05.5 Jordan Syatt: Oh, it’s so good, dude.

0:54:30.6 Mike Vacanti: No, not my favorite. I like the grilled onions are amazing. I’m into the grilled onions on there, but peppers… Peppers are hit or miss for me. I think I’ve even… Yeah, peppers are hit or miss.

0:54:55.8 Jordan Syatt: If red peppers aren’t on this list, there’s a problem with this list.

0:55:01.0 Mike Vacanti: There’s no problem with this list. Beet greens and beets. What are beet greens?

0:55:11.3 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know what beet greens are. Beets are great.

0:55:11.6 Mike Vacanti: Beets are great.

0:55:11.8 Jordan Syatt: Beets are like an A tier.

0:55:12.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:55:12.1 Jordan Syatt: Beets are fantastic. Beet greens, I don’t know.

0:55:12.3 Mike Vacanti: Beet greens are just beets. Oh, wait, no. They’re the edible, nutrient-rich leaves that stem from the beetroot plant.

0:55:12.4 Jordan Syatt: I’ve never eaten those. I’ve thrown them out.

0:55:12.6 Mike Vacanti: You should be putting them in your juices, Jordan.

0:55:12.8 Jordan Syatt: I will from now on. I had no idea. I just always threw them out.

0:55:12.9 Mike Vacanti: High in vitamin A, C, and K. Supports immune health, skin, and blood clotting.

0:55:13.1 Jordan Syatt: Interesting. Okay, from now on, I’ll put that in my beet juice. A.

0:55:13.3 Mike Vacanti: I agree, A. I don’t love the texture of straight-up beets. I prefer beet in juice form. I like that vasodilation. I like it around my pre-workout. Although I had a terrible beet juice pre-workout today. Not because of the beet juice, but because of this new pre-workout that I tried. It was like the anti-pre-workout. It made me sluggish, and so I’m off that. But beet juice is an A. Turmeric.

0:55:16.4 Jordan Syatt: Turmeric is the same as garlic. Whatever I gave garlic is what I’ll give turmeric.

0:55:18.6 Mike Vacanti: Oh, interesting. They’re definitely the same category here. I have some turmeric nostalgia. I don’t know if it’s actually a more potent anti-inflammatory than garlic or not, or if it was just marketed that way for many years, but turmeric with some black pepper extract, I’m giving half a grade higher than I gave garlic. I also like Indian food with turmeric on it, in it. I really like the taste. Maybe a touch… I like garlic too, but probably a touch more.

0:55:27.7 Jordan Syatt: Bro, if Indian food wasn’t so high-fat, I mean… I love Indian food. It’s amazing, but so much of it is super high-fat, which is an issue. But otherwise, it’s amazing.

0:55:30.9 Mike Vacanti: I agree. Dark chocolate.

0:55:33.1 Jordan Syatt: I hate dark chocolate, dude. I really do.

0:55:35.2 Mike Vacanti: It’s nowhere near milk chocolate in terms of taste.

0:55:38.4 Jordan Syatt: Not even close. And in terms of health benefits…

0:55:39.6 Mike Vacanti: That’s interesting. You don’t have as much of a sweet tooth, though, and you still prefer milk chocolate.

0:55:41.7 Jordan Syatt: I’m not even the biggest chocolate guy. I don’t like Lindt chocolate. My wife loves Lindt chocolate. I hate it.

[overlapping conversation]

0:55:44.9 Jordan Syatt: I shouldn’t say I hate it. I just don’t like it. If I’m gonna have chocolate, you know what I really like is a Crunch bar.

0:55:47.9 Mike Vacanti: Like a Nestle Crunch bar?

0:55:49.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah. Nestle Crunch is my ideal chocolate bar. I’m not gonna go get a dark chocolate.

0:55:53.1 Mike Vacanti: Yes, you do.

0:55:54.1 Jordan Syatt: No. No, I like chocolate bars with something crunchy inside.

0:55:58.1 Mike Vacanti: Like a rice cake.

0:55:59.1 Jordan Syatt: Like a piece of a rice cake. Is that what it is?

0:56:15.1 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know.

0:56:15.9 Jordan Syatt: Is that what it is?

0:56:16.4 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know.

0:56:17.2 Jordan Syatt: It’s not rice cakes.

0:56:18.1 Mike Vacanti: I just wanted to see your world collapse.

0:56:19.1 Jordan Syatt: No.

0:56:20.2 Mike Vacanti: Edamame. Yeah, dark chocolate. I mean, look, we’re dealing with something that’s high fat, moderate carb, low protein…

[overlapping conversation]

0:56:26.5 Mike Vacanti: And we’re trying to spin some health benefits. I guess if we’re ranking it in a desserts-only category, it would be considered reasonably healthy.

0:56:30.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:56:34.6 Mike Vacanti: Even though I still think ice cream is the king of desserts. By the way, there’s that… I mean, I know it’s observational in nature. But that ice cream study from 2014 where people who eat ice cream daily saw better health outcomes than people who don’t eat ice cream.

0:56:51.4 Jordan Syatt: Yep.

0:56:51.9 Mike Vacanti: And then you can be like, okay, well, the people who ate the ice cream are measuring the ice cream. When you eat ice cream, where do you eat it? You eat it at home. There are people who go out to eat less are doing this, yada, yada, yada. But…

0:57:00.7 Jordan Syatt: Eat more ice cream.

0:57:02.4 Mike Vacanti: Anecdotal. Yeah, ice cream is good for you. Dark chocolate, C, I guess, on this list.

0:57:08.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m gonna give it a D just ’cause I don’t like it.

0:57:12.3 Mike Vacanti: I think I like it slightly more than you, and I think D is still fair. Because…

0:57:15.5 Jordan Syatt: I just get angry when I eat it because I’m like, I could be eating chocolate I enjoy.

0:57:20.0 Mike Vacanti: Oh, well, in that case, do that. Edamame.

0:57:24.8 Jordan Syatt: S.

0:57:25.7 Mike Vacanti: S?

0:57:29.0 Jordan Syatt: Edamame is S-tier, dude. High protein, high fiber, low calorie. Edamame is an S-tier. It’s fantastic.

0:57:36.2 Mike Vacanti: Its amino acid profile is better than I expected.

0:57:40.0 Jordan Syatt: Shocking, dude. Edamame is pretty fucking awesome.

0:57:44.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, edamame is good too. It’s hard to find healthy apps at certain restaurants, especially I’m thinking like hibachi, that type of vibe. Edamame is one of them for sure. It’s got the delicious salt on the outside, high protein, fiber. Okay. Gosh, S, really? Are we putting it there? I’m going S-minus. S-minus.

0:58:08.9 Jordan Syatt: And they have this edamame pasta now that we have, which is just super high protein, super high fiber pasta that’s made from edamame. It’s amazing.

0:58:20.0 Mike Vacanti: The technology. That’s the opposite side.

0:58:22.3 Jordan Syatt: Food science is incredible.

0:58:24.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Chicken breast.

0:58:26.9 Jordan Syatt: A.

0:58:31.6 Mike Vacanti: We were having such a good podcast, and then you do something like that. Like, you put this soy thing at an S, and then you put chicken breast, the bodybuilder staple, at an A because you’re just gonna give me some BS about not liking the taste that much.

0:58:45.8 Jordan Syatt: Yes, that’s it.

0:58:47.8 Mike Vacanti: Go ahead, make your case why grilled chicken breast, which is the most delicious protein of all time with no tag-along fats, is A tier while we have all this other… Go ahead.

0:58:50.4 Jordan Syatt: I just… Listen, if we’re gonna compare it to edamame, edamame’s got the benefit of the fiber.

0:59:09.3 Mike Vacanti: No, I don’t want to compare it to the edamame. And yeah, but there’s way less protein per calorie in edamame than there is in chicken breast.

0:59:18.5 Jordan Syatt: But there’s enough. But I just don’t like the taste of chicken breast. And there are ways easy remedies to it. Add some buffalo…

0:59:27.2 Mike Vacanti: Why don’t you like the taste of chicken breast?

0:59:29.7 Jordan Syatt: Dude, I wish I could tell you. It’s just not my… I like dark meat chicken, but that’s higher fat. So if it’s just chicken breast, which is the optimal macro ratio, I’ve never been like, gosh, I just love chicken.

0:59:46.7 Mike Vacanti: Well, yeah, but it’s not about, “Yeah,

0:59:49.2 Jordan Syatt: Love chicken.

0:59:50.1 Mike Vacanti: I just love chicken.” Hang on. No one just, “I love chicken.” It’s, “I love chicken relative to the foods that go in the chicken group.” It’s not like, what do I want, strawberry shortcake or chicken breast? That’s not the decision. The decision is a protein source versus a protein source. And edamame, actually, I’m mostly just emotion. I’m making an emotional decision here. I’m knocking edamame down into the A tier. It’s only 38% protein. I didn’t realize it had eight fat, 14 carb, 18 protein. Chicken breast would never, on that amount of dietary tag-along fat, that’s just potentially ruining someone’s diet. No, not actually.

[laughter]

1:00:48.6 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think I’m gonna be able to leave this podcast until chicken breast is in your S-tier because it is absolutely elite. You want to talk about filling? All right, Mr. Bag of Carrots, have two slightly well-done chicken breasts, like big honkin’ chicken breasts with some buffalo sauce, where you’ve eaten what, I don’t know, 80 grams of protein and zero carbohydrate and maybe one gram of fat, and then try and eat more food.

1:01:07.1 Jordan Syatt: You’re right. I just… The taste for me, I’ve just never been a chicken guy.

1:01:11.8 Mike Vacanti: Taste is irrelevant. Results are all that matter in this life, Jordan. And you need to either not care about the taste of chicken breast or you need to like it more or find a different way to prepare it. And I don’t even want to hear the, “Well, chicken thighs.” Yeah, chicken thighs if you want more fat, great. If you got the fat to play with, great. Amazing. I like chicken thighs too. Chicken thighs are delicious. Chicken breast is the king.

[laughter]

1:01:50.6 Mike Vacanti: Edamame’s a B. Chicken breast is S-tier. S-tier lean protein. Hey, Jordan, what’s that type of fat that you’ve been ragging on lately?

1:01:54.2 Jordan Syatt: Saturated.

1:01:54.9 Mike Vacanti: How much of that is in chicken breast?

1:01:56.5 Jordan Syatt: None.

1:01:57.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, that’s right. That’s exactly right. Is beef not on this list? I’m adding beef. Beef. Where do you put beef? You’re gonna have to put it B, but you’re gonna put it in A.

1:02:11.3 Jordan Syatt: No, I was gonna put it in B.

1:02:13.2 Mike Vacanti: Okay.

1:02:14.0 Jordan Syatt: I was gonna put it in B.

1:02:15.2 Mike Vacanti: Okay, because saturated of fat?

1:02:15.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

1:02:16.6 Mike Vacanti: All right.

1:02:17.1 Jordan Syatt: And I like the taste better.

1:02:18.5 Mike Vacanti: At least you’re consistent. Well, of course we do, because it’s got fat in it.

1:02:22.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

1:02:22.5 Mike Vacanti: Where would you put bison, by the way? Bison’s not that lean. It’s like 23 protein, 11-ish fat.

1:02:28.6 Jordan Syatt: I’d put it A-minus. B-plus, A-minus.

1:02:31.7 Mike Vacanti: A-minus. So like bumping up against chicken breast.

1:02:34.5 Jordan Syatt: B-plus.

1:02:39.0 Mike Vacanti: Let’s not forget that chicken breast, that choline, which is in egg yolks, that’s also in chicken breast. Let’s just not forget. How do you even cut without chicken breast?

1:02:53.3 Jordan Syatt: If I’m cutting, I’m eating chicken breast.

1:02:55.4 Mike Vacanti: Asparagus.

1:02:56.3 Jordan Syatt: Asparagus.

1:02:58.5 Mike Vacanti: Ruin my day. Guy ruined my day. Yeah, asparagus.

1:03:01.2 Jordan Syatt: C.

1:03:04.3 Mike Vacanti: A.

[laughter]

1:03:09.8 Mike Vacanti: You don’t like asparagus?

1:03:11.3 Jordan Syatt: I only like asparagus when it’s really thin and charred.

1:03:15.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Aren’t you worried about cancer with the charred?

1:03:19.4 Jordan Syatt: Well, I just don’t really have asparagus very much, so the only time I’m eating it is when it’s thin and charred.

1:03:24.7 Mike Vacanti: Do you eat charred stuff?

1:03:27.8 Jordan Syatt: Occasionally. Not often, but occasionally.

1:03:30.6 Mike Vacanti: Am I incorrect on the char-to-cancer pathway?

1:03:35.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I’m not a fan of charring shit from a cancer perspective. It’s not my go-to. So I don’t really eat much asparagus, but if I’m gonna eat it, it’s gonna have to be charred.

1:03:45.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I find asparagus delicious. Like you said, it needs…

[laughter]

1:03:57.8 Mike Vacanti: No, actually, I’m done messing around. Little bit of olive oil, salt, pepper, garlic powder, throw it in the oven. Outstanding. But yes, if they’re too fat and so they’re like stringy and chewy, that’s gross. Not quite to charred, but you want them

1:04:14.2 Jordan Syatt: Crispy.

1:04:17.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah, like on the starting to border crispy is a good spot for asparagus. And obviously low calorie, got some volume, got some micronutrients. Good option. Wait, a C? Why are they at a C?

1:04:30.2 Jordan Syatt: Just because I’m not gonna eat it unless it’s charred, and I don’t want it charred anyway.

1:04:35.2 Mike Vacanti: You had such a strong… We should have just done the top 20 foods because you had such a…

1:04:39.4 Jordan Syatt: Well, you told me to speed it up, and then when I started speeding it up, then you start losing your shit.

1:04:45.4 Mike Vacanti: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Bell peppers. 29.

1:04:48.8 Jordan Syatt: A.

1:04:49.5 Mike Vacanti: They probably are objectively an A.

1:04:51.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, Stan Efferding told us that they’re basically an A. Stan’s the man.

1:04:57.8 Mike Vacanti: There’s more vitamin C in a bell pepper than an orange, right?

1:05:01.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah.

1:05:02.8 Mike Vacanti: Learned that from the Vertical Diet. Yeah, I mean, they’re… Look, no protein, lot of carbs. Not a lot of carbs. More carbs than most of the non-starch vegetables. But again, a lot of micronutrients. I think you can screw them up pretty easily. At least Chipotle’s been screwing them up for like nine years at this point. The grilled peppers and onions from Chipotle are…

1:05:30.2 Jordan Syatt: Agreed.

1:05:33.8 Mike Vacanti: I don’t know what’s wrong with them, but they’re just not tasty.

1:05:35.3 Jordan Syatt: They’re floppy and they’re…

1:05:39.9 Mike Vacanti: Sometimes they’re floppy, sometimes they’re too thick, sometimes they’re hard, sometimes they’re just not digestible. It’s just not good.

1:05:47.1 Jordan Syatt: But at-home bell peppers or from a respected establishment. 30, sauerkraut. Ooh. High A.

1:05:58.4 Mike Vacanti: Ooh, high A. I was just gonna say A. Good, I’m glad we’re finishing on…

1:06:01.6 Jordan Syatt: Agreement.

1:06:03.4 Mike Vacanti: Some camaraderie here.

1:06:04.5 Jordan Syatt: High A. Yeah, yeah. Super good for the gut health.

1:06:08.6 Mike Vacanti: Yep.

1:06:10.8 Jordan Syatt: Filling. Dude, I love sauerkraut.

1:06:13.6 Mike Vacanti: Grok says it’s good for mood support. I don’t know where that research is coming from, but I believe it. Yeah, tasty, good for digestion, it’s a good probiotic source, and some nostalgia too in there.

1:06:32.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, agreed.

1:06:33.3 Mike Vacanti: That’s our list. 30.

1:06:34.7 Jordan Syatt: That’s it.

1:06:35.6 Mike Vacanti: 30 health foods from S-tier to F-tier. Maybe not the most nutritious 30 foods that are out there, but 30 of the top ones that we ranked. Thank you very much for listening. New episodes every Tuesday.

1:06:48.4 Jordan Syatt: If you want to join the mentorship, you can apply at the link in the description. We can help you build your online fitness business. Join a community of incredible coaches looking to be better coaches to get their clients better results and to build sustainable, successful online coaching businesses. That’s it. You can apply at the link in the show notes. Leave a five-star review. Have a wonderful week. We’ll talk to you soon.

1:07:11.1 Mike Vacanti: See ya.