Episode 270: The 20 Healthiest Habits In The World (Part 1)

0:00:00.0 Mike Vacanti: Hello, Jordan.

0:00:02.0 Jordan Syatt: What’s up, Michael?

0:00:13.0 Mike Vacanti: The fitness business mentorship price is going up very soon. If you haven’t listened to the last two episodes, we’ve made this announcement. If you haven’t applied already at fitnessbusinessmentorship.com, apply now. You should apply right now because very, very, very soon the price is going up. The price goes up every one to two years, and we barely ever run sales, like one conventional sale per year and then one price increase every year or two. So if you want to get in at the cheapest the mentorship will ever be, now is the time to apply. Your price will never increase if you join right now. All current stay a member.

0:01:19.0 Jordan Syatt: And stay locked in.

0:01:36.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, correct. Correct. All current members are locked in at their rates. So if you have any interest in growing your online fitness business or starting an online fitness business and you want to learn from Jordan and I rather than Insert Guru, and you want to pay less than Insert Guru, now’s the time to apply.

0:01:54.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. And I’ll say I could do the whole pitch of if you want to build your business, and make more money, and help more people. I’ve said that a million times. Here’s what I’m gonna say. There are many other mentorships out there. I’ll start with we were the first one to call ourselves a mentorship. Everyone fucking copied us after that. But one of these things that I’ve seen with these other mentorships is that you have one person who’s the face of it who will sell you on it, but then they’ve got all these other people who are working with you and who are doing the calls, but the person who actually sold you on it barely ever, if ever, shows up. It’s all… It seems pretty cookie-cutter. When you join, we don’t have any other coaches who you’re gonna be talking to. It’s us. We’re the ones who are in there answering your questions every week. We are the ones who made all the courses, and every week we do live Q&As where you get answers from us. So it’s not…

0:02:11.9 Mike Vacanti: On a live Zoom call with us that you’re actually on.

0:02:15.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. We’re not trying to scale this thing and hire new coaches so that we can just pawn them off onto you. It’s us. That’s what you get when you join. You get access, yes, to us and to all of the other members who are in there. So we’re not trying to build a massive empire so that we can work less and make more. We love what we do. We love working with coaches. And all the coaches in there love helping their clients so they can help more people. This isn’t a get-rich-quick scheme. This isn’t a Ponzi scheme, which I don’t even know what that is, to be honest, but I know this isn’t it.

[laughter]

0:03:00.9 Mike Vacanti: That’s amazing. I do know what a Ponzi scheme is, and this isn’t a Ponzi scheme.

0:03:05.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. This definitely isn’t a Bernie Madoff thing. All right. This is…

0:03:08.3 Mike Vacanti: That’s where my mind went too. That’s awesome.

0:03:09.9 Jordan Syatt: This is just a couple of dudes who like coaching people. We’ve done it for a long time, and we want to help other people be better coaches and build their businesses. And when you ask questions, we’re the ones who answer.

0:03:21.4 Mike Vacanti: Very well said. Now, with that being said, today’s episode. Today’s episode’s a good one. We got a little banter of things to talk about, and then we’re getting into the meat and potatoes. Before we get into the meat and potatoes, I had a 40-day no social media streak.

0:03:31.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh, wow.

0:03:42.2 Mike Vacanti: Which, YouTube on my desktop, not shorts really, no scrolling, very little in general. I broke it yesterday. I basically was like I don’t even know how I would describe the afternoon I was having, but I pulled a Costanza and decided I’m gonna do the opposite of everything in my life, starting right now.

[laughter]

0:04:13.9 Mike Vacanti: It was like smash your video game console. There’s certain things that you do to elicit change in a moment, and I just felt like I’m gonna pattern break. I was telling you about that YouTube channel that I stumbled across that was kind of humorous, but I’m just… So I literally the first decision I made, I was ordering my wife and I dinner for pickup. And from this place that we often go to, I get a salad with salmon or a salad with chicken. I was like, “What’s the opposite of that? New York strip.” Literally got home, was like, “I haven’t been scrolling for 40 days.” Downloaded X on my phone, started scrolling a little bit. Before bed, we’ve been watching a show after my daughter goes down if there’s time there, and there has been, thankfully, over the last month. I was like, “Let’s go through the reels that you sent me.” So me and my wife looked at reels that she had sent me over the last 40 days when I literally was off social media.

[laughter]

0:05:48.4 Mike Vacanti: This morning, whenever I take my trash cans out, I think that I am subconsciously conforming to the expectations of strangers. And I think that living in suburbia does this, which essentially effeminizes and erodes the soul in a way. And so in my mind, I was like, “Well, normally,” ’cause I was just in my underwear and shorts on, I was like, “Normally I’d run upstairs and put a shirt on and put shoes on to take the trash cans out.” I’m like, “Why would I do that?” The old version of me would never do that because I wasn’t even aware of other people’s expectations. I was more like a gorilla. And I was like, “No, I’m just gonna walk out there barefoot and shirtless, and I don’t care what the temperature is. I don’t care about…” I’m taking my trash cans out. I don’t wanna waste 48 seconds going up the stairs to get a shirt to put on. Like, no, I’m not living like that anymore. My workout today, I have been going bodyweight, a little bit higher rep on my chin-ups. I’m like, “No, I’m gonna see how heavy of a dumbbell can I get between my legs and pull my body up.” The opposite, everything. Usually I drive to the gas station after to get my post-workout. I’m walking. I’m walking. I’m not driving. So I’m doing the opposite.

0:06:19.1 Jordan Syatt: Wait, did you walk to the gym?

0:06:20.7 Mike Vacanti: No, Jordan, the gym’s like… You don’t understand.

0:06:21.7 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know…

0:06:26.8 Mike Vacanti: Actually, you do. No, the gym isn’t… I mean, I guess…

0:06:27.3 Jordan Syatt: How close is the gym to the gas station?

0:06:29.1 Mike Vacanti: The gym to the gas station is a five-minute walk.

0:06:32.0 Jordan Syatt: Oh, got it. Okay, okay, okay. That makes more sense. I thought you were just walking across town, walking to the gym, walking to the gas station, walking home.

0:06:39.5 Mike Vacanti: I would. I would love to. If I was in New York City, I would be. But no, that’s…

0:06:45.7 Jordan Syatt: Got it, got it, got it.

0:06:46.8 Mike Vacanti: That’s too…

[overlapping conversation]

0:06:50.5 Mike Vacanti: Inefficient and ineffective use of time. Yeah.

0:06:53.1 Jordan Syatt: The YouTube channel that you sent me, it made me think. I see a lot of people who are like, “Yeah, I put stars or asterisks in my swear words or words that are inappropriate because they feel like they’re getting flagged by the social media, and that’s why their content isn’t doing well.”

[overlapping conversation]

0:07:18.2 Jordan Syatt: Wrong. This account puts every word that you can imagine and beyond, like the worst words that you think you can think of, in the titles of his videos, and they go crazy.

0:07:27.6 Mike Vacanti: And he’s getting views. Yeah.

0:07:29.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. So it’s not you using a swear word. It’s that your content just sucks. So that’s it.

0:07:37.7 Mike Vacanti: That’s a great takeaway. How good is that Costanza scene though, where he’s like…

0:07:40.8 Jordan Syatt: Dude, just do the opposite.

0:07:44.0 Mike Vacanti: “I always order this. I’m doing tuna on rye.” And then there’s the beautiful woman at the counter. He’s like, “Normally I wouldn’t talk to her.” But he’s like, “Hi, I’m George. I live with my parents.” She’s like, “Hi, George, nice to meet you.” He looks over at Jerry and Elaine. It’s so good.

0:08:00.4 Jordan Syatt: That’s a classic, classic scene. I love that you’re just doing the Costanza. That’s amazing.

0:08:05.8 Mike Vacanti: Well, it reminds me of Stu Bickel, legendary NHL fighter who’s a really good dude. He’s very good friends with a buddy of mine. And I remember back in the day when I was studying for the CPA, this accounting exam, 15 years ago at this point, everyone was going out on a Friday night. This is like a year post-college. And he was over, and some other guys were over, and I was studying, and I was hitting a wall. And he told me this story about when, if he ever had a bad game in college hockey, he’d just crush a ton of beers after the game as a reset, and then he’d always play better the next day. And in my mind at the time, it was so structured and so type A, I was like, “I could never.” But it’s really like an anti-science-based lifting and more intuitive approach to life that some people need more of, some people probably need less of. There’s a balance. But if you feel like you’re stuck in a rut, just do the opposite for a few things. See how you feel.

0:09:08.1 Jordan Syatt: It’s funny, when you said the opposite of salmon, I thought you were gonna say like mac and cheese, but you still stuck with the protein. It was just like the opposite protein source.

0:09:17.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I mean, I’m not gonna…

0:09:20.0 Jordan Syatt: You’re not a degenerate.

0:09:22.7 Mike Vacanti: That’s what I was gonna say.

0:09:24.7 Jordan Syatt: You’re not gonna just forgo protein.

0:09:28.3 Mike Vacanti: It wasn’t even that. I think I was craving… I think I’ve consumed way less red meat than I have on average, so I think there was an element of craving it too, because it sounded really good.

0:09:30.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I like that.

0:09:36.5 Mike Vacanti: Baked mac and cheese though, like a high-fat, high-carb meal as a…

0:09:41.3 Jordan Syatt: That’s what I thought you were gonna say, dude.

0:09:42.8 Mike Vacanti: Opposite…

[overlapping conversation]

0:09:45.8 Jordan Syatt: I thought you were gonna say, “I want salmon. I got mac and cheese with extra butter.”

0:09:49.9 Mike Vacanti: Honestly, that makes me nauseous thinking about it. You got any announcements?

0:09:55.6 Jordan Syatt: Doing any announcements? Maybe I’m gonna start doing the opposite.

0:09:58.9 Mike Vacanti: Just try it for a few decisions. The scrolling was so enjoyable after 40 days off.

[laughter]

0:10:06.5 Jordan Syatt: I’m glad that your feed showed you really good stuff. That’s great.

0:10:09.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:10:11.4 Jordan Syatt: It felt like, “This guy’s been off. Let’s hit him with some really good stuff that he’s gonna love.”

0:10:16.4 Mike Vacanti: It felt like 2019. There was a lot of kind of health-ish stuff. There was some funny stuff. And YouTube too.

0:10:29.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m bummed that I wasn’t recommended that guy because when you sent me his page, I was like, “This looks great. I would love if that showed up on my feed.”

0:10:37.4 Mike Vacanti: It didn’t show on my feed. It was a recommendation from another podcast.

0:10:40.1 Jordan Syatt: Oh, interesting. Okay.

0:10:42.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. We are reviewing the 20 best things that you can do for your health and longevity.

0:10:59.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh, nice.

0:11:01.3 Mike Vacanti: From S to F.

0:11:01.4 Jordan Syatt: I love it.

0:11:03.3 Mike Vacanti: So get your pen ready, get your markers ready, get your paper ready…

0:11:05.0 Jordan Syatt: And apply to join the mentorship. All right.

0:11:08.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s right. That’s absolutely right. So we’re probably gonna get through 10 today. We’ll do 10 next week. It’s gonna be very fun. Are you ready?

0:11:15.8 Jordan Syatt: I’m ready.

0:11:23.3 Mike Vacanti: You got your marker?

0:11:24.2 Jordan Syatt: Oh, shit, I forgot we were doing that. Let’s go. I thought you were talking to the listeners.

[laughter]

0:11:31.9 Mike Vacanti: I expect him to take notes with the marker on the podcast.

0:11:35.9 Jordan Syatt: I was like, why is he telling him to take notes? That’s funny. Oops. Okay, here we go. Wow. I really thought you were talking to everyone else, not me.

0:11:42.6 Mike Vacanti: I’m talking to you, Jordan. I’m always talking to you.

0:11:44.4 Jordan Syatt: All right, ready?

0:11:46.2 Mike Vacanti: Number one, best things you can do. I’m actually gonna read it how it spit it out because I said the 20 best things you can do for your health. Here are the 20 best evidence-based things you can do for your health. These focus on habits that improve longevity, reduce chronic disease like heart disease, diabetes, cancer, boost mental well-being, enhance quality of life. 20 best things you can do for your health. Number one. Don’t…

0:12:07.5 Jordan Syatt: Can I guess what it’s gonna be? I was… Yeah, don’t smoke. That’s what I was gonna guess.

0:12:11.6 Mike Vacanti: Don’t smoke or quit if you do.

0:12:13.9 Jordan Syatt: Ready?

0:12:16.1 Mike Vacanti: One, two, three.

0:12:18.3 Jordan Syatt: S-tier. Yeah. S-tier. We don’t even need to explain it. Yeah.

0:12:21.5 Mike Vacanti: This is some truth.

0:12:23.2 Jordan Syatt: If you’re still smoking…

0:12:23.5 Mike Vacanti: Some truth are self evident.

0:12:24.4 Jordan Syatt: What are you doing?

0:12:25.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah. Quite a bit of research that the nicotine alone isn’t nearly as bad for you or carcinogenic, but the tobacco and cigarette… Do not need us to explain to you.

0:12:38.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, inhaling the smoke into your fucking lungs.

0:12:40.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:12:41.9 Jordan Syatt: Let’s not do that.

0:12:43.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. You don’t need a couple of personal trainers to tell you why that’s unhealthy.

0:12:46.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:12:49.1 Mike Vacanti: Two, move your body regularly. I’m gonna read you a little more because there’s a little explanation here. Aim for at least 150 minutes of moderate aerobic activity like brisk walking per week plus muscle strength training, muscle strengthening exercises two plus days a week, even 7000 to 10,000 steps daily helps. Include variety. They get a little more interesting, by the way. I know we’re starting with…

0:13:15.4 Jordan Syatt: This is just picking up.

0:13:16.1 Mike Vacanti: It’s a little vanilla. It’s a little vanilla. One, two, three. Yeah.

0:13:18.4 Jordan Syatt: S-tier.

0:13:20.7 Mike Vacanti: S-tier.

0:13:23.0 Jordan Syatt: S-tier. Yeah. Good job, Grok. Starting off with the two biggest ones. Yeah.

0:13:28.7 Mike Vacanti: A lot of evidence. Moving your body daily, getting aerobic activity, good for the heart, good for longevity. Good for mental well-being, good for brain health.

0:13:37.8 Jordan Syatt: Good for everything. Everything. Yeah, move.

0:13:40.4 Mike Vacanti: Good for pain management, good for body comp management. Yeah.

0:13:48.3 Jordan Syatt: That’s it. I’m not adding anything to that.

0:13:50.4 Mike Vacanti: Here’s the first one we might get a little bit of difference on. Number three, eat a mostly plant-based whole food diet.

0:14:02.4 Jordan Syatt: Has to be mostly plant-based? Do they give a percentage or anything?

0:14:06.0 Mike Vacanti: I’ll read you the whole thing. Emphasize vegetables, fruits, beans, nuts, whole grains, and healthy fats like olive oil. Limit ultra-processed foods, added sugars, and excessive red/processed meats. Mediterranean or similar patterns are strongly linked to better heart health, lower inflammation, and a longer life. A daily serving of beans or nuts can add meaningful years. I don’t know about that last sentence.

[overlapping conversation]

0:14:38.9 Jordan Syatt: I fully agree with that last sentence. I’m on board with that one.

0:14:43.0 Mike Vacanti: What’s meaningful years? Five plus?

0:14:44.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:14:45.9 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think if you run those two groups, and all else equal, and one group gets a handful of pinto beans from Chipotle and the other one doesn’t, I don’t think we’re going to 87 versus 92. I just don’t. Especially with the mental stress that comes from, “Got to eat my pinto beans even though I’ve been eating them for 900 days in a row and I don’t like them. I got to eat them again. It’s 11:00 PM. I got to go to bed, but I haven’t eaten my pinto beans yet. I need one serving per day to add five years to my life.” I’m not buying it. I need to see the research.

0:14:58.9 Jordan Syatt: Ready?

0:14:59.6 Mike Vacanti: One, two, three.

0:15:24.9 Jordan Syatt: You gave it an A.

0:15:25.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, A-tier.

0:15:26.9 Jordan Syatt: I gave it S. I knew you were gonna give it an A.

0:15:27.6 Mike Vacanti: I knew you were gonna give it an S. You love plants. Jordan loves kale.

0:15:29.6 Jordan Syatt: I’m not a fan of kale. I mean, I like kale in some salads, but not the biggest fan of it. I’d rather have arugula, to be honest.

0:15:39.1 Mike Vacanti: Let’s hear it. Why’d you give it an S?

0:15:40.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s just the truth.

0:15:41.5 Mike Vacanti: Hmm.

0:15:42.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s just the truth, bro.

0:15:44.2 Mike Vacanti: Lead magnets were the truth also, but you gave those an A-minus.

[laughter]

0:15:48.7 Jordan Syatt: We’re not going back to another episode that I don’t remember the context of.

0:15:54.3 Mike Vacanti: I saw a great tweet, and then I’ll let you talk. Sorry.

0:15:59.3 Jordan Syatt: I’m amped up. I’m back on social.

0:16:03.4 Mike Vacanti: Two hours per day of being in complete silence has a massive increase in memory. And guess who the first person I thought of was when I read that.

0:16:15.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, when the fuck am I gonna get two hours of complete silence?

0:16:18.2 Mike Vacanti: Dude, you drive for at least two hours a day.

0:16:20.3 Jordan Syatt: False. False.

0:16:22.4 Mike Vacanti: Okay. Feels that way from here. It feels that way.

[laughter]

0:16:28.2 Jordan Syatt: No, I drive for maybe three hours a week.

0:16:31.8 Mike Vacanti: No, that’s not true. I know that’s not true.

0:16:33.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it is. It’s 30 minutes each way Monday and Friday, so that’s two hours on Monday and Friday. And then the rest of the week, it’s probably about an hour, maybe an hour and a half on average, whether it’s going to the range, maybe going to do some errands.

0:16:42.9 Mike Vacanti: Grocery pickup.

0:16:51.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, but it’s seven minutes away.

0:16:53.5 Mike Vacanti: Oh, it’s that close?

0:16:54.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, Walmart’s super close.

0:16:56.5 Mike Vacanti: I didn’t know that. I didn’t know that. Hmm. I’d still take the over three hours for a meaningful percentage of net worth.

0:17:04.8 Jordan Syatt: But then when the Monday/Friday drives, it’s an hour total, that’s with my daughter in the car.

0:17:11.3 Mike Vacanti: All right. Well, hey, Buddha once said, “He who doesn’t have an hour to meditate needs to meditate for two,” or someone said that.

0:17:18.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, well, Buddha wasn’t fucking working out, too.

0:17:21.7 Mike Vacanti: I don’t think it was Buddha. Someone said that. Look, yeah, two hours a day is a long time. However…

[overlapping conversation]

0:17:29.9 Jordan Syatt: Whoever said that didn’t have kids. That’s for sure.

0:17:33.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but it also, even if it’s impractical, I think it’s probably on a sliding scale, beneficial, meaning non-binary. Less than two hours still has benefit, and I would argue you don’t get two minutes.

0:17:43.1 Jordan Syatt: That’s fair.

0:17:52.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, there’s little pockets here where the time can add up. Anyway, I took us off track. Tell us why eating spinach is S-tier.

0:18:03.0 Jordan Syatt: It’s not just the greens or the vegetables. The phrase was, I believe, and tell me if I’m wrong, it said mostly plant-based whole food diet. So beans and lentils are plant-based. I love those. Nuts and seeds, plant-based. I do think that it’s super beneficial. The thing that made me make this S-tier, I was gonna put A-tier. The thing that made me S-tier was the mention of the Mediterranean diet, which does include a lot of fish, salmon. And we’ve put that on other lists as the S-tier protein source. So that’s what… Because inherently by mentioning the Mediterranean diet, it’s not saying only go completely plant-based. It does recognize that some animal-based protein sources are great for you. But data-wise, it is pretty clear that a mostly plant-based. It doesn’t mean you can’t be healthy while also having red meat. It doesn’t mean you can’t live a really long life while also having other sources. But I think the data’s pretty clear that overall, a mostly plant-based diet while limiting ultra-processed foods, limiting added sugars, that was a big one. I was actually expecting number one to be stop smoking. I thought it was gonna be this order: number one, stop smoking; number two, limit or stop drinking; number three, movement; and number four, I thought was gonna be reduce or eliminate sugar-filled beverages. I thought that was gonna be. And so the reduction of sugar, I think is overall good when it’s coming from these ultra-processed sources. But yeah, I think it’s pretty clear mostly plant-based is the ideal way to go.

0:20:01.9 Mike Vacanti: I don’t see anything wrong with your answer through the lens that you’re viewing this. I do think that of the diets with a name, the Mediterranean diet is the best option.

0:20:13.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:20:18.2 Mike Vacanti: I think we have to… I think you versus me versus everyone has our own definition of health. And I think that if we are only trying to maximize the number of years that we are alive, there might be merit to this being higher than I have it, which I already have it pretty high. So there’s two points I want to make. One is I think that the enjoyment and lack of stress, psychological stress, that comes from having things you enjoy, even if they don’t fit in the context of this diet is why I bumped it down a tier. I actually think that being able to enjoy some ice cream or having a New York strip… And I get that it says mostly, but I’m going 90% title, 10% description here. Eat a mostly plant-based whole food diet. I’m also slightly biased by this cardiologist I saw a few years ago who was incredible, really sweet woman, really helpful, and it went amazing. And at the very end of the appointment, she gave this hard vegan pitch on me. And then she was poking at my salmon/fish oil supplementation.

0:21:40.3 Jordan Syatt: No way.

0:21:43.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, and asking why I think that’s necessary. And I was talking about EPA and DHA, and she was talking about, “Well, you can just get your polyunsaturateds from nuts.” And in my… I didn’t have it on the tip of my tongue, but it was in the back of my mind. I was like, “Is ALA really just as beneficial as EPA and DHA?” And after doing more digging, no, it’s not. So mostly plant-based, I wanna fit a random New York strip in there. I like eating fish on a regular basis. And then there’s the… If being neurotically on a specific diet that you don’t love for an entire lifetime adds 6 to 12 months to the back end versus having more enjoyment over the course of your life that ends things 6 to 12 months earlier, what would you rather do? And there’s some cliche about the life in your years or years in your life. Like if you’re having a more fulfilling 97 years versus a worse 97.75 years, which would you prefer?

0:22:47.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, yeah, that’s a no-brainer. I mean, listen, we wrote a book, and the cover has a donut on it, and it’s saying eat it. Like I completely agree with that 100%. Yeah, I completely agree.

0:22:59.8 Mike Vacanti: And I agree that of diets with names, the Mediterranean is the best. I would probably just from a physiological and psychological/enjoyment perspective, want to go a little bit more ultra-processed, a little bit more added sugar, a little bit more whatever your thing is on top of the base being the Mediterranean diet.

0:23:20.8 Jordan Syatt: I just right now want to overlay the clip of you on YouTube from like 2015 or 2016 where you’re like, “I eat a lot of foods I don’t like because they’re good for me. I eat a lot of things I don’t like. I’ll eat this paper.” And you fucking ripped off…

0:23:32.7 Mike Vacanti: Cardboard.

0:23:36.9 Jordan Syatt: Ripped off a piece of cardboard and ate it. It was like, yeah. I think the majority of… To the point of that video, I think a lot of people place too much emphasis on always enjoying everything they eat. And it’s like, listen, doesn’t have to be super enjoyable all the time.

0:23:56.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s a rant. That’s a rant against someone who’s an adult who needs to lose 100 pounds for their health, but they say, “I don’t like vegetables.” Like that person. My whole spiel about adding more ice cream and New York strip, more calories, that’s not for that individual, obviously. So that’s the cardboard rant. I’ll eat things that I don’t like because they’re good for me. On the other side of the coin, you take the neurotic person who hasn’t eaten a donut in 15 years even though it’s their absolute favorite food in the world because they’re afraid that’s gonna make them die early. Eat a donut once in a while.

0:24:16.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, agreed. Agreed.

0:24:36.2 Mike Vacanti: Four. By the way, I love the writing it down. It’s just superior. Maintain a healthy weight.

0:24:43.5 Jordan Syatt: Ready?

0:24:44.1 Mike Vacanti: One, two, three.

0:24:52.0 Jordan Syatt: S-tier. Both have S-tier.

0:24:54.0 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. And I think we can kind of group body fat percentage in here with…

0:25:00.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s crazy to me that this would be controversial, but unfortunately, it has been. I think it’s less now than it was in like 2019.

0:25:12.1 Mike Vacanti: If this is still controversial on anyone’s algorithm.

0:25:14.5 Jordan Syatt: It is.

0:25:18.4 Mike Vacanti: You need a 40 days…Well, then they need to get off social media for consuming…

[overlapping conversation]

0:25:20.3 Jordan Syatt: 40 days and 40 nights.

0:25:23.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. If that’s what you’re… If you’re using social media to build your business, keep creating, don’t consume. You need a real reset. If saying that maintaining a healthy weight is good for longevity, if that’s controversial, you’re in a bad place with your algo and you need some soul-searching.

0:25:45.0 Jordan Syatt: You know what I think is the under-discussed aspect of this, never mind the current health risks of having excess body fat, but I think…

0:25:51.4 Mike Vacanti: Over-muscled?

0:25:57.7 Jordan Syatt: No, no, no, no. I was gonna say that a lot of people who have excess body fat now and fall into the idea that… Or they fall into the trap of thinking that they’re healthy now, so it’s fine. They don’t think about how it will impact them as they get older. And what I mean is not like, never mind the cholesterol, never mind the inflammation. I mean just like moving, which was the number two on this list. It makes moving way, way harder. And as you get older, bro, I mean, listen, I’m, thank God, very fit. But to say that I haven’t noticed a difference in energy and all of that from 22 to 34, that would be a lie. I notice a difference. And I would imagine from 34 to 45, 45 to 55, 55 to… It gets harder every decade. And it’s hard enough even if you’re already fit, never mind having all that extra weight and all that extra stress and all those extra potential issues. It makes movement more difficult just by virtue of you being heavier, which is a massive, massive problem.

0:27:12.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, that’s absolutely right. If it reduces your ability or likelihood of doing that thing in the future, that’s really good for you, then it’s not good for you.

0:27:20.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, correct.

0:27:27.8 Mike Vacanti: And another… If we look at, I don’t know, coronary calcium scans over time, whether you are a healthy weight or not, when you’re 15, you’re way less likely to have issues with plaque in your arteries, for example, versus being 45, versus being 75. Your likelihood of health issues increases as you get older. And so just because you might be 25 and have good blood work and be overweight, that doesn’t necessarily mean… And it doesn’t mean that being in a healthy weight range isn’t gonna help you over the 10, 20, 30, 40 years to come at maintaining that good health that you currently have.

0:27:51.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, correct.

0:28:14.7 Mike Vacanti: And again, I think this is… You clearly see a subset of humans out there that I don’t anymore, but this feels obvious to me, and it feels obvious to anyone listening. My expectation is that it’s obvious to anyone listening, unless we have some lurkers who are on a very different page than anyone I’ve ever communicated with who listens to the podcast.

0:28:26.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:28:39.2 Mike Vacanti: Get seven to nine… Do you like this format? How are you liking this format, Jordan?

0:28:42.8 Jordan Syatt: I love this format. I love this.

0:28:44.5 Mike Vacanti: Get seven to nine hours of quality sleep nightly. You gotta write what you truly think. I don’t want your thought process to be, “I know what Mike’s gonna write. Do I want… What kind of conversation do I want to have?”

0:28:57.3 Jordan Syatt: I’m not playing that game, dude. I’m playing the game based on what I think is right.

0:29:01.2 Mike Vacanti: Great. I’m just making sure. All right, buddy.

[laughter]

0:29:03.4 Mike Vacanti: One, two, three.

0:29:07.6 Jordan Syatt: S-tier.

0:29:13.9 Mike Vacanti: S-tier.

0:29:15.8 Jordan Syatt: S-tier.

0:29:17.8 Mike Vacanti: My S and my five look similar. I gotta figure that out. Lead us off.

0:29:21.0 Jordan Syatt: I’ll start with I am not good at it, or I haven’t put as much effort into it because I have prioritized fitness in terms of working out, exercise, strength training, all of that, and I’ve also prioritized business. I’ve prioritized those two things over sleep. That doesn’t mean that I think it’s better for my health. That just means those are the things I prioritized. And then also, not to mention being awake for my kids, making sure… Structuring how my wife and I, who’s gonna take care of the kids when, especially in the immediate postpartum era. So… And also, I think any new parent can understand your sleep is not gonna be as good as it was beforehand. So I don’t think it’s a debate that getting consistent seven to nine hours sleep is S-tier. I don’t think any logical person would argue against that. But objectively, I just haven’t been prioritizing it over the last four years. I will say I’ve been doing a pretty good job over the last few months, relatively, but I’ve been trying to get my workouts in a little bit earlier in the day. The issue with that though is sometimes I sacrifice family time for that, which really sucks. So it’s a give and take.

0:30:46.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. There’s… Neither you nor I are perfect, and so just because either of us… We can both recognize something that’s objectively good for us even if we’re not doing it ourselves perfectly. I mean, there’s plenty of research around sleep and longevity, even shift work and cancer rates. Having your wake-sleep schedule aligned with day and night is really good for us physically and mentally. There’s also an element of… I’m thinking of that book you read recently.

0:31:30.4 Jordan Syatt: On Combat?

0:31:37.9 Mike Vacanti: Where there’s probably… Because we’re talking about health and longevity, the risk of something like an automobile accident or dying suddenly, not dying of chronic disease, which sleep is also related to, but just more prone to an accident, more prone to something dangerous happening by being sleep deprived. Does that mean there can’t be periods of your life where you’re sleep deprived because you’re making a sacrifice and you’re unbalanced in the moment? No, that probably makes sense for a lot of people during a lot of periods of time. But yeah, getting enough high-quality sleep, dark room, proper temperature, comfortable bedding, it’s really good for our health.

0:32:15.6 Jordan Syatt: Better, more energy, so your workouts are better, build more muscle, get more cardio in, have more energy expenditure. It all plays into each other.

0:32:26.0 Mike Vacanti: Less likely to be overeating when you’re getting proper sleep versus not. Man, I’m thinking back to those first couple months of my daughter and just getting a couple hours of sleep at a time, and the impact that had on my snacking and desire to eat just crap. Yeah, it’s real. It’s real, real. All right, here we’re gonna have a nice difference. Six: stay hydrated.

0:32:58.1 Jordan Syatt: Just because I don’t do it as well doesn’t mean that we’re gonna have a real difference.

[laughter]

0:33:03.5 Mike Vacanti: Wow, you’re misinterpreting me because that wasn’t a personal attack.

0:33:08.1 Jordan Syatt: It was a personal…

[laughter]

0:33:09.1 Mike Vacanti: No, it wasn’t. It was my understanding of your belief on the weight of the evidence.

0:33:19.0 Jordan Syatt: All right, ready?

0:33:21.8 Mike Vacanti: One, two, three.

0:33:22.6 Jordan Syatt: A.

0:33:22.8 Mike Vacanti: There we go. There we go. S-tier.

0:33:25.3 Jordan Syatt: I wrote A-tier, micro S-tier.

0:33:27.8 Mike Vacanti: I’ll start because I didn’t even really think about this one. I’m going pure intuition, do the opposite, channel 2016 energy of: most people don’t drink enough water. When I don’t drink enough water, my digestion’s worse, I have less energy, my brain doesn’t work as well. When I drink more water, everything in life is better. Drink more water. Don’t overthink it. Is it on the same level of other things that I’ve put in S-tier? No, I don’t think that… Smoking a pack a day consistently over time is worse for you than being dehydrated. Getting 10,000 steps a day versus getting 11 steps per day has a bigger delta in terms of health outcomes than being a little dehydrated versus being properly hydrated. So does it actually compare with the other things on S-tier on a logical level? Maybe not. But we work a lot of nostalgia, a lot of intuition, a lot of feeling, a lot of fun into these and, yeah, just stay hydrated. Just got this new water bottle because I accidentally put my other one in the…

0:34:02.4 Jordan Syatt: In the trash?

0:34:36.9 Mike Vacanti: No, in the dishwasher.

0:34:37.3 Jordan Syatt: It melted.

0:34:38.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:34:40.5 Jordan Syatt: Oh man, that sucks.

0:34:41.9 Mike Vacanti: Every metal water bottle I’ve ever bought, I hate.

0:34:45.0 Jordan Syatt: So, yeah, it tastes like… I don’t like how metal tastes.

0:34:48.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, and they’re inconvenient. None of them have a good handle. None of them… They’re very bulky. They’re poorly made. If anyone has a good metal half-gallon water bottle to recommend, please do shoot us an email. But yeah. Why did you put hydration at A-tier?

0:35:07.1 Jordan Syatt: For the exact same reasons that you just said. It’s like it doesn’t compare to those other things. Obviously, hydration is super important. Like, obviously. I think people look at hydration as binary. It’s either you’re hydrated or you’re dehydrated. It’s not as simple as that. There are levels to it. And you could be overhydrated, and then you could be severely dehydrated, and then there’s a lot in between. I think that one of the most overlooked aspects of the importance of hydration is the effect of hydration on your blood. And when you are, for example, one of the reasons they’ll tell you to stay high… Get really hydrated before you get blood work taken is because it can actually impact the readings based on your volume, based on how much you have in a certain sample size of blood. So if you’re dehydrated, then the concentration is significantly more within that vial. So it might say that your cholesterol is actually higher than it really is because you’re dehydrated. And if you’re overhydrated, it might say that it’s lower than it really is.

0:36:18.8 Jordan Syatt: So your blood’s thickness is impacted by hydration. Obviously, your athletic and sports performance is impacted by your hydration status. And then of course, you could go a lot longer without food than you can without water. But I think for most people, if you have access for something to drink, you’re never gonna let your… You’re never gonna deliberately get to the point where you’re so dehydrated that you’re gonna die. Like, the only time that happens is if you are physically unable to get access to water. So, as an aside, one of the first things I got for my little prepper kit is these filtration straws. So, God forbid something happens, maybe there’s an attack on the water supply, whatever, I got these filtration straws that literally filter out toxins from the water, poisons from the water, or whatever. So you don’t need to have pills or anything. And I forget how many sips you get for every straw, but it’s like thousands of sips per straw before you need to change to a new one. So I got a pack of 10 or something. But yeah, obviously it’s really important. It’s A-tier, but relative to the others, it’s just not… It’s not as high.

0:37:40.9 Mike Vacanti: It’s a good answer. It’s a good answer. I can’t even… I don’t even have a real retort.

0:37:45.5 Jordan Syatt: Well, fun. Fun. We’re bringing fun into it.

0:37:50.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but I already said that. It’s a good answer. Where’s your fear level, speaking of prepper kit?

0:37:56.8 Jordan Syatt: It fluctuates throughout the day.

0:38:00.0 Mike Vacanti: Just a number in this moment.

0:38:01.1 Jordan Syatt: Out of 100?

0:38:02.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:38:03.4 Jordan Syatt: In this moment?

0:38:04.5 Mike Vacanti: In this exact moment.

0:38:05.7 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know, 50.

0:38:06.6 Mike Vacanti: Good. That’s a good number for you.

0:38:08.8 Jordan Syatt: For you.

[laughter]

0:38:11.0 Mike Vacanti: Dude, there was like two years where I don’t think you came under 80.

0:38:13.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, it’s true.

0:38:15.7 Mike Vacanti: Number seven: limit or avoid alcohol.

0:38:22.7 Jordan Syatt: I really think I’m gonna go against the grain on this one.

0:38:24.1 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:38:25.4 Jordan Syatt: And people are gonna be mad about it.

0:38:26.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, that’s cool.

0:38:27.3 Jordan Syatt: But I’m sticking with it.

0:38:28.3 Mike Vacanti: I know, I know you’re putting B. One, ready? Ready? Wanna see how… One, two, three. Yep, I know you.

0:38:36.3 Jordan Syatt: You’re good.

0:38:37.8 Mike Vacanti: I know you better than you know yourself, Mr. Syatt Fitness.

0:38:40.9 Jordan Syatt: You’re good. You wrote S/A, which has never been given before. It’s not even a real ranking. You can’t do S/A. You could’ve done an A-plus.

0:38:52.7 Mike Vacanti: Here’s why. Here’s why this is an S/A. In high school, we had A-minus, B-plus.

0:39:01.3 Jordan Syatt: If I give an S/A, you’re getting pissed.

0:39:03.6 Mike Vacanti: No. When I got to college, we didn’t have A-minuses and B-pluses.

0:39:06.9 Jordan Syatt: Really?

0:39:10.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, there was A and then there was AB and then there was B.

0:39:16.4 Jordan Syatt: Oh, interesting.

0:39:19.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. So there was one tier between an A and a B. So on a GPA, instead of 3.0 is a B, 3.33 is a B-plus, 3.67 is an A-minus, 4 is an A, we didn’t have that. We had 4, 3.5, 3. AB was a 3.5.

0:39:22.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, interesting.

0:39:33.9 Mike Vacanti: It’s still not a great justification for why I gave this. I actually gave this because the logic that I used up on eat a mostly plant-based whole food diet, which was technically there are foods that are less healthy for you, but if you include them and they make your life more enjoyable and you eat them responsibly and you can work them in and it makes your life better and stress is down and you’re having fun, it adds to the fullness of life. Great. Awesome. And for that reason, I can see limiting or avoiding alcohol as being… I can see drinking alcohol as having some merit, some benefit on a social, and following your intuition, not doing everything perfect. You don’t need the hold the tennis ball and do the cable cuffs. You can just go lift some weight. That type of mindset. Because I put an A there, I had to hedge here. I wanted to say S, because for me personally, I’m not into alcohol. I think that on top of the downside physiologically, the physical health downside of drinking, for me personally, there was a spiritual/mental downside to drinking as well, where maybe I’m just more extreme in any vice or any pleasurable activity or behavior or endeavor in life.

0:41:09.0 Mike Vacanti: And I have jealousy, no, admiration for people who can have one drink and really enjoy it and enjoy the taste and the experience and kind of that’s it. That’s just not me. For them, great. Have a glass of wine in the evening, unwind, have a couple drinks with friends. Enjoy. I think that’s definitely a positive thing. But the S part of my answer is just for me personally, alcohol’s a net negative in every way. I binge drank way too much in college, and yeah, just sometimes was throwing up the next day, dehydrated, just not feeling good. Wasted time.

0:41:57.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, makes sense. I gave a B. I’d say first, not based on the evidence, but more just based on I think I get really annoyed at the people who are making content on this all the fucking time.

0:42:07.3 Mike Vacanti: That’s still happening?

0:42:16.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh, yeah, dude. And here’s the line that they say. They say the same line over and over and over again, regardless of who’s saying it. Everyone uses the same line. They say, “There is no safe level of alcohol consumption.” It’s the one that there is no safe level of alcohol consumption at any level. At any level, it is unsafe. Now, here’s what I think about alcohol in terms of the research. For the majority of our lives, the vast majority, the scientific research has been interpreted as moderate alcohol consumption, low to moderate, is okay. For the vast majority of our lives. In very recent years, it has been said, “Oh, no, there is no safe level of consumption whatsoever.” I’m going based off of my gut, not based off of the evidence. My gut tells me that within the next seven to 12 years, more research will come out that will say, “Oh, that was a mistake. There is a safe level.” It’s not very high, but there is a safe level that is not causative for cancer, that is not causative for X, Y, and Z.

0:43:41.7 Jordan Syatt: First, we had said it’s safe, it’s fine. Then we had said it’s not safe in any amount. And now we’re saying, shockingly, you can have a little bit, and it’s totally fine. That’s what my intuition tells me is going to happen in the next seven to 12 years. I think that many, many, many people, and I know this is anecdote, not based on trials. Many people all across the world enjoy alcohol in low to moderate amounts on a regular basis, and live very long, very healthy lives. Now, I know the immediate argument against this is many, many, many people don’t wear a seatbelt, and they don’t die. I know that. And it’s a fair and valid way to argue that point. I’m not going based off of just the last couple of years of research. I’m giving this a B based on what I think is going to happen over the next seven to 12 years. And I could be wrong. I could absolutely be wrong. It might end up being there is no safe level whatsoever in any amount, you’re poisoning yourself. That might happen. I don’t think that’s what’s going to happen.

0:44:52.7 Mike Vacanti: What would you say if the counterargument wasn’t about the seatbelts, but if the counterargument was the benefit those people are getting is the socialization, and so if they had that same level of socialization without alcohol, it would actually be even better for them?

0:45:07.7 Jordan Syatt: I honestly don’t like the socialization argument because I don’t like it from the side of when people say, “Well, it’s good because it makes you be social,” or “It can help you be social.” I’m like, I just don’t think that’s a good argument. I think it’s a really shit argument for alcohol.

0:45:26.5 Mike Vacanti: Because you should… Because that’s a problem for the individual. If you need it as a crutch to socialize, go work on that. Don’t just drink your whole life to socialize.

0:45:34.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, correct. You’re numbing yourself. I don’t think that’s a good idea at all. And I would rather… I would rather if your anxiety is so bad, I’d rather you discuss taking anxiety medication with your doctor rather than trying to fucking self-prescribe yourself alcohol. I think that’s a really dumb argument that a lot of the alcohol people use.

0:45:56.0 Mike Vacanti: Or cognitive behavioral therapy.

0:46:01.0 Jordan Syatt: Exactly.

0:46:03.0 Mike Vacanti: Exposure therapy on talking to someone.

0:46:05.0 Jordan Syatt: 100%.

0:46:06.0 Mike Vacanti: Ask someone the time, you go to a gas station and buy a Muscle Milk, and you ask the clerk how their day’s going. There are steps where you can learn how to interact with humans without any…

0:46:10.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Or when you’re in this situation with people, just be honest and be like, “Hey, I have a lot of anxiety right now. I just want you to know.” Just say that. It immediately helps improve. But a lot of people say… The reason I said for the anxiety medication is because you’re essentially self-prescribing medication. Like what you’re saying is medication. “This is my medication.” It’s like, no, if you need medication, go get real fucking medication.

0:46:21.9 Mike Vacanti: Go get actual. Yeah, yeah.

0:46:33.6 Jordan Syatt: So I’ve never really enjoyed that argument. I’m more just thinking of…

0:46:37.7 Mike Vacanti: I’m not even… I’m just saying, do you think that the socialization is the benefit? That people who are drinking alcohol might be socializing more, and it’s actually the socialization, not the alcohol, that is leading to the positive health outcomes?

0:46:55.1 Jordan Syatt: I struggle with this one because I know a lot of people use that argument. But then I start thinking, okay, in what situations are people only going out if they’re going to be able to drink? I know so many people who, if they’re going out to socialize and drink, then oftentimes when they go out and drink, they have a terrible time. It’s a horrible experience.

0:47:15.0 Mike Vacanti: Yes, in the US.

0:47:20.7 Jordan Syatt: They hate the people they’re with. They don’t even like it.

0:47:22.3 Mike Vacanti: In the US, for sure.

0:47:24.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:47:27.8 Mike Vacanti: I’m thinking like Italy, I’m thinking like…

0:47:31.0 Jordan Syatt: I know many people here in the United States who they’re not going out, but they’ll enjoy a glass of wine almost every night just with themselves or their family, and they live very healthy lives. And I think telling them that this is causing cancer is… I think that it’s doing it a disservice. I don’t think that’s an accurate portrayal of it. And so again, I just don’t like the socialization argument because practically, I don’t know that many people who are using alcohol as their reason to go out and socialize, especially as you get older. When you’re younger, oftentimes it will help them be less nervous, but they were gonna go out anyway. They were gonna be out with their friends or their group anyway and they just say, “Well, everyone else is drinking, and I’m feeling a little bit nervous, so now I’ll drink, and I’m gonna be here anyway, so I might as well have more fun.” I typically don’t see people like, “The only way I’m gonna go out with you is if I’m drinking.” I don’t see that as much. You know what I mean?

0:48:22.2 Mike Vacanti: I like when I’m out with a group of people and everyone’s drinking. Do you know what I like to get that makes it more fun?

0:48:25.6 Jordan Syatt: Water.

0:48:29.0 Mike Vacanti: Buffalo wings.

0:48:32.4 Jordan Syatt: Why does that make it more fun?

0:48:34.2 Mike Vacanti: Why does that make it more fun? They’re delicious.

0:48:36.9 Jordan Syatt: No, are people asking you for some? Is it just for your own? What makes it more fun?

0:48:41.8 Mike Vacanti: Everyone’s there, and they’re having something that they enjoy. An IPA, a whatever, a whatever. I enjoy buffalo wings because they’re delicious. Get some protein in. That’s the bro reason why you could knock alcohol down is you substitute those calories for calories that can actually help you build muscle, and your body is using more productively than alcohol. That’s where the 2012 version of me would have led with this. I wrote a four-part series on my blog back in the day about drinking, and that was when I was in the mindset of you can drink a lot of alcohol and still get in shape, fit into your macros. Here are strategies you can use, like training versus rest day. Should you be training on a day you’re going to be going out? Should you be training the day after you go out? How to structure your programming around the weekends, thinking in a party mindset. So I’ve been there. But yeah, it’ll be interesting to see your seven-to-12-year prediction. Again, if you have a glass of wine here and there or a drink and you enjoy that, I’m not judging, and I’m not telling you not to. In the same way that if someone told me not to eat cookies and cream ice cream before bed because it’s gonna kill me early, I’d be like, “Screw you, don’t tell me what to do.”

0:49:18.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:49:54.2 Mike Vacanti: Some people can’t eat cookies and cream ice cream because they’ll eat all of the cookies and cream ice cream, and that’ll have negative health outcomes. Some people can’t have one drink because that’ll lead to very bad places. And so a lot of nuance here, a lot of individualization.

0:50:01.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:50:08.9 Mike Vacanti: I think we covered that pretty well. We got three more. We got 10 more minutes, I’d say. Number eight: manage stress effectively.

0:50:18.8 Jordan Syatt: I hate this one.

0:50:19.9 Mike Vacanti: I know you do, buddy. I know you do.

0:50:22.6 Jordan Syatt: You know why I hate it is just because it doesn’t actually help anyone just to say manage stress effectively.

0:50:28.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, but it doesn’t help anyone to say maintain a healthy weight. Okay.

0:50:33.3 Jordan Syatt: Sort of does.

[laughter]

0:50:37.1 Mike Vacanti: No, no. That’s the whole… There was 10 years of everyone being on their high horse about telling people that eat less, and move more doesn’t help. It’s like, okay, it doesn’t help. It can be true and not help. Sure. And we need to give real strategies. But maintain a healthy weight isn’t that helpful. We need to actually help. Similar to maybe this. But we gave maintain a healthy weight an S. And so even if this doesn’t give you the exact techniques on how to manage stress effectively, look. Do you have your answer written down?

0:50:48.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:50:56.3 Mike Vacanti: One, two, three. B.

0:51:12.9 Jordan Syatt: You gave it an S. I gave it a B.

0:51:14.1 Mike Vacanti: Absolutely.

0:51:15.3 Jordan Syatt: All right, you go first.

0:51:16.8 Mike Vacanti: It’s self-evident. This is as obvious to me as smoking. This is just pure intuition. I’ll read it to you too. Practice daily techniques like mindfulness meditation, deep breathing, or time in nature. Chronic stress harms nearly every system. Reducing it improves heart health, sleep, and immunity.

0:51:34.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I agree with all that.

0:51:36.5 Mike Vacanti: You did a wonderful, wonderful job on number five of separating something that you struggle with, sleep, from your understanding of…

0:51:47.7 Jordan Syatt: For Dale.

0:51:47.9 Mike Vacanti: Sleep’s negative role. I learned everything I know from you about Dale. The day we did our MBTIs, and you took the test, and immediately after you took the test, it said, Jordan is an ESTP. Here are similar famous figures who are ESTPs. Number one, Dale Carnegie. And it was so spot on. I don’t even… Some truths are self-evident and don’t need arguing. And with the amount of time we have left, if we want to do a whole episode on this, I’m happy to do that. But chronic stress, I can tell, makes me less healthy physically, mentally, spiritually. Now, are there positive forms of stress? Like if you’re taking on responsibility, acute stress, training is an acute stressor, obviously. We can throw too big of a blanket of stress where this would be incorrect. We’re not saying go sit on a mountain all the time and just don’t ever feel any level of stress.

[laughter]

0:53:01.4 Mike Vacanti: If you want to, go for it, but that’s not what we’re saying. But I can tell you, this is the new do the opposite. I don’t even need to justify or explain. I know this to be true, that chronic high stress levels kill. Heart attacks, premature aging, leading to overeating, desire to eat… I know this to be true in my soul.

0:53:28.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, listen, I completely agree. I think you hit on where I was going to go with it, which is I have two ways that I can go with it. Number one is the way that it’s like, listen, we need stress. We need some stress in order to, number one, we need some level of cortisol in order to survive. We need stress in order to often push us to do certain things. I think there’s a lot to be said for feeling like there’s a little flame under your ass to get you going. I think it’s important to have some level of stress. I think, like with hydration, there’s levels to it. There’s a continuum that we have to be on, and either end of the continuum, either extreme end, is really, really, really bad for us.

0:54:18.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:54:23.8 Jordan Syatt: I get frustrated when I see these 22-year-old influencers who have zero responsibilities and who are like, “Here’s my morning routine to de-stress, dah dah dah.” And I’m like, “Fuck your shit. Fuck you.” And then it’s just obnoxious. And then I think the way that it’s framed across social media is unrealistic. And then I think people who are already stressed get more stressed about being stressed because they have trouble not being stressed because they’re comparing their stress to other people’s fucking stress.

0:54:59.9 Mike Vacanti: They need to take 40 days off. If they’re consuming that.

0:55:00.5 Jordan Syatt: They definitely need 40 days off social media.

0:55:01.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:55:05.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, completely agree. I think that yes, stress management is important. I gave it a B. It’s important. I also think that one of the best ways to deal with stress is to move, to exercise. I think one of the best ways to deal with stress is to get enough sleep. I think one of the best ways to deal with stress is to eat high-quality foods, to make sure you’re maintaining a healthy weight. So for me, I think most of the ways that we improve stress are with the S-tier things that we already discussed, rather than just focusing on stress. That for me is where it’s like those other things will likely get your stress down to a much more healthier, and manageable level rather than just always being like, “Oh, I’m stressed. I need to manage it.” Yeah, fucking exercise. Get some fucking sleep. You know what I mean?

0:56:00.1 Mike Vacanti: So your definition of manage stress is consume content about stress and get stressed about stress, whereas…

0:56:05.8 Jordan Syatt: And I think that’s bad. That’s bad.

0:56:11.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, I know. I know because you’re knocking it down. But manage stress, if manage stress means do all these S-tier things, like if this said avoid stress, F, because that’s not a way to live. But it says manage, which means yeah, you’re gonna do things that are good for your stress. And I think the only thing, maybe you could do 10% better on sleep, but you’re doing so many good things for your stress. The only thing that we talk about here would be a reduction in inputs for stress. And there’s a sacrifice there because then you’re giving something else up that might be more valuable. Like maybe you want to carry the stress because it’s worth it for other good things that you’re doing. Personal decision. Yeah, I think managing stress is an S.

0:56:21.5 Jordan Syatt: That’s right.

0:56:23.0 Mike Vacanti: And managing like you said, can mean doing all these other good things. Managing can also mean doing more of the things that offset the acute stressors. It can also mean reducing the number of acute stressors that you’re doing, or it can mean do the acute stressors for a slightly shorter period of time. But I got that in S. All right, rapid fire, last two. Nine, build and maintain strong social connections. One, two, three.

0:56:34.4 Jordan Syatt: S.

0:56:57.2 Mike Vacanti: S-tier, baby.

0:57:20.0 Jordan Syatt: S-tier. Yeah.

0:57:42.9 Mike Vacanti: And from your introverted co-host, I got this in the S bucket.

0:57:48.4 Jordan Syatt: Self-evident.

0:57:51.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Okay, good. I’m with you. Yeah. Isolation is poison. Isolation plus for you pages is poison on steroids. The worst kind of poison. Like alcohol.

0:58:05.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. There’s zero safe consumption.

0:58:08.8 Mike Vacanti: And 10, find and live with purpose. One, two, three.

0:58:14.8 Jordan Syatt: S.

0:58:15.9 Mike Vacanti: S.

0:58:16.7 Jordan Syatt: S-tier.

0:58:20.8 Mike Vacanti: S. That one’s the ultimate easier said than done. Yeah, that’s a whole life mission. The Mind Pump guys do a good job talking about this. I’ve heard Sal definitely quote research around this, which I think is a smart way when making any kind of religious pitch to a potentially non-religious audience. He appeals to the science of what religion/more meaningful life does on physiological health outcomes and points to various studies. He does a great job of that. It’s self-evident but also not necessarily easy, or similar to maintain a healthy weight or manage stress effectively. This isn’t telling you how to do it, but it definitely improves your physical but also spiritual, mental, emotional health outcomes.

0:59:21.6 Jordan Syatt: I think that is interesting as well. It’s similar to fitness but also wildly different because in fitness, I think it’s easier to get closer to the end goal. Whether you want to lift a certain amount of weight or get to a certain body fat, or you could achieve those goals. I don’t know if there’s ever a true endpoint with this one in terms of whatever’s fulfilling and purposeful. If you’re religious, what does God want from me? How can I best serve God? If you don’t believe in God, then what fulfills you and are you most passionate about and gives you the most sense of purpose in life? These are lifelong endeavors that for me at least, I don’t feel like I’m ever getting closer to an endpoint. I always feel like it’s the same distance away that I’m just always chasing. And I feel like it’s almost like when you’re facing away from the sun or if you’re outside and it’s cloudy, and the sun is behind the clouds, you don’t really feel the heat of the sun. But then the cloud moves and the sun is directly on your face, and you can feel that warmth of the sun. You know you’re facing the right direction or you know it’s there. That, for me is it’s still just as far away, but I can feel that I’m on the right path. I feel that I’m going in the right direction now. That for me is how I feel with this pursuit of I never feel like I’m getting any closer to living with purpose. I just feel like this is the path I should be on, and I can tell because I feel the warmth of the sun because I’m facing that direction, whereas if I’m not facing the right direction, I don’t feel that warmth.

1:01:19.9 Mike Vacanti: I wonder if feeling like you’re getting closer has any correlation to whether or not you’re actually getting closer. And what I mean by that is I wonder if you can be getting closer without feeling like you’re getting closer.

1:01:32.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

1:01:45.3 Mike Vacanti: I made a little graph here of time and fitness progress. We got…

1:01:49.4 Jordan Syatt: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

1:01:53.6 Mike Vacanti: Time axis. So you make more, there’s more gains initially with fitness progress.

1:01:56.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

1:01:59.8 Mike Vacanti: And then over time, the gains are slower. Newbie gains early on, and then by the time you’re a very advanced lifter, it’s harder to make gains. Whereas I would view the… If we were to chart meaning out over the course of time, it would be linear, I suppose. But would it be linear? Would it be exponential? I suppose it would be linear, but not like an actual straight line. It’d be like that what success looks like graph, where the line is all squiggly and all over the place, but it trends upward. So some days you feel like you’re doing great.

1:02:38.8 Jordan Syatt: I was thinking that you should have two different lines. One line would be your perceived progress, and the other one would be your actual progress. And I would imagine that perceived progress early on would be like, “I’m killing it. I’m crushing it.”

1:02:55.9 Mike Vacanti: Dunning-Kruger.

1:02:57.7 Jordan Syatt: But then, yeah, you feel like, “Oh, I’m getting so much closer to God. I’m definitely living the way that I’m supposed to.” But then years go by, and you look back on how you were living earlier on, and you’re like, “Man, I had the completely wrong perception of what God was or what God wanted from me.” And then you start to understand that it’s far more complex than you realized. And in some ways, maybe it’s far simpler in other ways. But the perceived line versus the actual line would be an interesting graph.

1:03:05.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah, definitely.

1:03:13.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

1:03:30.3 Mike Vacanti: Great episode. If you haven’t applied to join the mentorship, in the show notes, click the button, click the link, apply now. Fitnessbusinessmentorship.com. Jordan and I will help you grow your business, get more clients, help the clients that you have see better progress, which is a big part of what we do, and which some people might think is like a hippie-dippy, like, “Oh, help your clients,” but it’s actually a business strategy. Because if you help the people you’re working with do better, they’re gonna want to continue to work with you, compared to you just being focused on making the next high-ticket sale while neglecting your current clients. Bad idea. Bad for business. You’re gonna be pivoting to being an AI engineer or a fricking crypto trader or something two years from now. So don’t do that.

1:04:15.3 Jordan Syatt: And you don’t need to set up a fucking referral system. You’ll just get referrals because you’re a great coach helping your clients. You don’t need to have these special strategies to get more referrals. You’ll just get them because you’re a great coach and your clients love you.

1:04:29.8 Mike Vacanti: That’s right. It’s absolutely right. Thank you for listening. Have a wonderful day and week. We’ll see you next week.

1:04:44.0 Jordan Syatt: See ya.