Episode 196: How to Start a Fat Loss Phase When You Are Obese, Overcoming Debilitating Back Pain, Tips for Starting Your Online Fitness Business, & More…

0:00:11.4 Mike Vacanti: Hello, Jordan.

0:00:12.6 Jordan Syatt: Bro. Does my camera look better than usual?

0:00:16.0 Mike Vacanti: I actually just thought you looked more attractive than usual.

0:00:18.2 Jordan Syatt: No, I think it’s just the camera.

0:00:20.0 Mike Vacanti: I was like, Jordan’s having a real glow up in his 30s.

0:00:21.0 Jordan Syatt: No, dude. Finally, I got a new computer ’cause the camera was like all grainy, so hopefully those watching on YouTube are like, oh wow. They’ve got an upgraded video quality now. So, when I’m posting these clips in 2027, they’ll be like, wow, that’s where they upgraded in 2024.

[laughter]

0:00:42.5 Mike Vacanti: We’re not that far behind.

0:00:43.6 Jordan Syatt: No, not that far, but close.

0:00:47.4 Mike Vacanti: It lags. It’s good, ’cause you can hear it on the podcast. Forget that you heard it, and then nine months later, you get a little reminder @personaltrainerpodcast on Instagram, and it just re-ingrains that concept. It’s actually far superior than uploading clips immediately after.

0:01:04.6 Jordan Syatt: I agree.

0:01:05.2 Mike Vacanti: In my estimation, Jordan. One, yes, you do look great. Two…

0:01:10.3 Jordan Syatt: I didn’t ask you if I look great. I said does my camera quality look better?

0:01:13.8 Mike Vacanti: I know that’s what you asked, but what I said was, you look great.

0:01:15.1 Jordan Syatt: Well, you look super good too.

0:01:17.2 Mike Vacanti: Two, we got a YouTube comment from Becky. Becky said, great pod guys. No, Becky’s awesome. Becky said, great pod guys. I live in Minnesota, and I concur with Mike’s comments. People are weird now! Referring to people not saying hi in suburban life, in the great state of Minnesota, Jordan thought that it was a Mike problem. He thought that people didn’t wanna say hi to Mike ’cause he had too much lean mass and was too intimidating with his lean tissue quantity. However, I have some notes here. I’ve done a little experiment since our last, since whatever that was, maybe a month ago, saying that walking around my neighborhood, people intentionally try not to say hello, try not to communicate, look at their feet. We had some theories about why antisocial behavior. What I’ve been doing is I’ve been forcing hellos with all of my neighbors. I’ve been forcing socialization upon them. So, what I do is, I just look at them with a smile and from like, I don’t know, 30 feet. I don’t even know what the right distance is, 15 yards maybe until they look at me, and then I say hello or something to that effect. And they say, I’m batting a thousand, Jordan. I’m batting 1000.

0:02:36.9 Jordan Syatt: Dude, I love that.

0:02:38.3 Mike Vacanti: Yep.

0:02:39.2 Jordan Syatt: That makes all the sense in the world to me and I absolutely love that.

0:02:43.4 Mike Vacanti: And we have further substantive supportive evidence from Ms. Becky. Ms. Becky, who also lives in Minnesota and says that yeah, people are trying to get out of socializing with their neighbors, but not around here. They’re not.

0:02:58.3 Jordan Syatt: Not when you’re forcing them to. Not when you’re forcing them to socialize. Hey, hey, hey. Good morning. [laughter] Look me in the eyes as I say good morning. Have a great day.

0:03:11.0 Mike Vacanti: No, I do it with a smile though, yours was a little intimidating. You’re quite intimidating, but I do it with a smile.

0:03:17.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I am pretty intimidating when I’m walking around with a big smile on my face. I’m like, Hey, how are ya?

0:03:23.5 Mike Vacanti: No, you got Curtis. You got…

0:03:26.1 Jordan Syatt: Bro. Did I ever tell you what happened at like 2:00 in the morning in New York city it must have been like 2018 or something. I was walking around at like 2:00 in the morning. I went to CVS across, 6th Ave, and I was getting cold medicine ’cause I wasn’t feeling good. So I go over, get the cold medicine, come back, and as I’m walking, crossing over 6th Ave, I cross over 6th Ave. Now I’m like crossing on towards West 4th, and there’s a huge dude walking. 2:00 in the morning, huge dude, and he’s like walking closer and closer and he’s like, just walking straight at me. We’re the only two on the street, and I don’t really think much of it. It’s New York City. There are always people out. It’s not like I’m in a dark alley. This is a relatively main street off of a main avenue.

0:04:25.6 Jordan Syatt: And I just look it up at him, I look up at him as he’s like walking straight at me, and I’m just like, “Hey, how are ya?” And I can see on his face that he’s like taken aback by it. I can see he’s like a little bit surprised. So, I just keep walking. And then as I turn onto my street onto Jones Street and like my door is one of the first ones on the street, and I take my key out to go get in, and I see him running at me. He is full on sprinting at me. And I’m like, “Oh shit.” And fortunately, key slides right in, open it, boom. Slam the door shut. And then he starts like banging on the door trying to get in. And I realized I think he was gonna try and mug me or something, but the only reason he didn’t is because I disarmed him with, “Hey, how are you?” [laughter] And he was so taken aback that he’s like, oh, I don’t know how to reply to that. And then it took a few seconds before he was like, wait a second, I’m supposed to mug that guy. It was one of the most wild experiences in New York.

0:05:31.3 Mike Vacanti: That’s terrifying. That’s very frightening.

0:05:33.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. That was wild. Yeah.

0:05:36.5 Mike Vacanti: Little did that guy know that you would’ve…

0:05:39.0 Jordan Syatt: I would’ve slammed him.

0:05:40.8 Mike Vacanti: Double leg take down, like head to the concrete. That guy was in trouble. That guy…

0:05:44.6 Jordan Syatt: He would’ve been in big trouble. Yeah.

0:05:46.2 Mike Vacanti: You saved his life.

0:05:48.5 Jordan Syatt: I wouldn’t have tried to kill him, but who knows? Maybe he had a knife, I don’t know. Yeah. I’d rather not have to get in that situation, but yeah, I think I did save his life.

0:05:56.6 Mike Vacanti: I do remember that story now that you told it.

0:05:58.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah.

0:06:00.8 Mike Vacanti: Super scary. Hey, how are ya?

0:06:01.5 Jordan Syatt: Hey, how are ya? That’s a good way to fend off potential attackers.

[laughter]

0:06:06.5 Mike Vacanti: Well, especially in the middle of the night in New York City, which is very different than 1:00 PM lunch break walk around the suburbs of good old America.

0:06:14.8 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Now, we’ve just got this big dude walking around Minnesota just being like, Hey, good to see you. Happy Tuesday.

[laughter]

0:06:23.5 Mike Vacanti: It works. Happy Tuesday.

0:06:27.2 Jordan Syatt: What do you got planned for the day? Is that it, is it just a hello, or do you say like, is there like a let’s try and communicate?

0:06:32.8 Mike Vacanti: Jord, I’m an ISTJ. I’m not stopping strangers on the street just to make small talk. I only have so many socialization coins.

0:06:41.2 Jordan Syatt: Got it.

0:06:42.3 Mike Vacanti: It’s just acknowledging each other’s presence and being polite, respectful citizens. It’s not like…

0:06:46.9 Jordan Syatt: Good neighbors.

0:06:48.2 Mike Vacanti: Having a 10 minute chat and taking each other out of zone one and a half. That’s not what we’re trying to do there.

0:06:53.6 Jordan Syatt: Got it. I understand.

0:06:55.4 Mike Vacanti: Bro. The president of the United States, Joe Biden, maybe not him, maybe his team, but hid your comment on…

0:07:04.1 Jordan Syatt: Bro, how wild is that?

0:07:05.7 Mike Vacanti: His Instagram post. How crazy is that?

0:07:08.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. That was really, really wild. I forgot about that until you just brought that up. Yeah. So, backstory, on the anniversary of October 7th, Joe Biden, or not, he… I guarantee Joe Biden isn’t posting on his Instagram, but his team makes it October 7th post. And I know before even looking at the comments, I’m like, it’s gonna be anti-Semitic vitriol, not good. So, I just go in there and I see some, and my comment, I make a comment to the effect of our children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren will have school projects in which they’re instructed to come back to posts like this, so they can see what people have said during times like this. And our kids grandkids, great-grandkids, will see real time, the awful, horrible things that their relatives said on a post like this. And it will make a big mark in history. Like this is the first time in history, like during the Holocaust, people or at any point in prior history, people didn’t necessarily have direct quotes from their relatives about what they thought during that time. And I made that comment and it initially got a lot of steam, got a lot of likes, and like within the first couple of minutes, had a couple of 100 likes, and people were… Obviously people were upset with me as well. People were leaving bad comments and reply to it. And all of a sudden, there’s no more likes on it. There’s no more comments on it, and I told you about it.

0:08:51.5 Mike Vacanti: Well, you told me. You’re like, “Dude, look at my post.” And I fired up. I was like, “Which one is it on?” And I couldn’t find it and I was scrolling around. I’m like, “Dude, I think they hid your comment.” Yeah. And the number, everything froze, all the stats. No more replies. No more likes. And your comment on the post was gone.

0:09:10.1 Jordan Syatt: And I know that game ’cause you could still see it.

0:09:11.8 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, yeah.

0:09:12.0 Jordan Syatt: I hide comments. Like if I have someone in my comment section that is just essentially putting… If I make a post about low carb for example, or keto or whatever, and someone comes in and they just make all of these baseless claims about how it’s inaccurate, and I know people seeing that might get confused, and at the same time, I don’t have the energy or wherewithal to explain why what that person’s saying is wrong, I’m not leaving that comment there for people to be confused by it. I’m hiding it. Which is nice because then people, the person who posted it still sees the comment. They don’t realize that it’s hidden, but no one else sees that comment. And yeah, Joe Biden going in his comments, and it’s crazy is my comment was in support of his post, but they left up all the comments that were against that sentiment, which makes it even me even think it’s more like, obviously I know Joe Biden isn’t posting on his social media, but it’s just very clear that his team is the one that’s managing this. And people that might have anti-Israel sentiment, anti-Semitic sentiment where it’s like, all right, we’re gonna leave up all of the anti-Israel stuff, but take down all the stuff that might be in support of it. It’s very interesting.

0:10:28.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. The political strategy behind making the pro-Israel Post, but then leaving pretty negative comments going against the post, but then hiding a comment in support of the post was very odd at the very least. But just the headline of the president of the United States hid my massively successful Instagram comment is pretty wild.

0:10:57.0 Jordan Syatt: I’m also, and this brings up a different topic, man. I’m consistently surprised at how much value people place on what political leaders say publicly. Like, it seems to me that people look at what the political leader is saying on their social media or on sound bite, and they value that more than what their actual policy is. It’s almost like they’re just hearing what they’re saying and they’re like, oh, that’s a good person, or that’s a bad person based on what they’re saying publicly, but they’re not paying any attention to what policies that government official is actually supporting, or not supporting what they’re voting for, what they’re voting against. And it’s just so interesting to me. I don’t care if he puts up an October 7th post. It doesn’t matter to me. I care about what are you actually doing to find a peaceful resolution to this conflict?

0:12:06.5 Jordan Syatt: What is a government official actually doing to help improve the health of the United States? What is the government official actually doing to help with these horrific hurricanes that are going on? What is actually happening to help improve our country and the world? And I see so many people, why haven’t you said this? Why haven’t you said that? Why didn’t you say this? Why didn’t you say that? And like, I get it, like what they say it does matter, but what matters even more is what they’re actually doing. Like what laws and what actions they’re taking. I value what they post on their social media so little nowadays, relative to what are you signing into law or what are you not signing into law? And I feel like people aren’t paying attention to that.

0:12:49.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. And that goes for everything in life, right? Like show me, don’t tell me. Okay. You can apologize 15 times, but is your behavior changing? That’s what I care about. Or to pull the relationship analogy that is usually your move, you’ll have, a common relationship archetype is a smooth talking like kind of bad narcissistic type dude, with more of an innocent like gullible-ish woman. And his behavior might like for 10 events in a row, say one thing, something bad. But then just having a way with words and ability to like… It’s like, no, don’t tell me what you’re going to do or tell me who you are. I’m gonna decipher who you are. I’m gonna deduce who you are based on what you’re doing and what your actions are showing me over time.

0:13:47.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. It’s sort of why, like the debates at this point seem to me, and maybe I’m wrong, but they seem almost pointless to me, because to me, it seems like by the time the debates come around, people know who they’re voting for.

0:14:03.6 Mike Vacanti: Have you been consuming a lot of politics?

0:14:05.6 Jordan Syatt: No, but we’re on the topic. So like…

0:14:07.1 Mike Vacanti: Oh, okay.

0:14:08.2 Jordan Syatt: It’s like by the time the debates come around, people know who they’re voting for and they’re usually only watching the debate in the same way they would watch a sports event. They’re looking for their team. Like, all right, how does my team do? Did my team win or did my team lose? If their team loses, they’re really upset. Like, fuck, why’d you do that? You idiot, all you had to say was this. But if their team does well, they’re like, yeah, the other side sucked. Like my team won. It doesn’t matter, like you’re voting… You know who you’re voting for anyway. And maybe I’m not fully understanding if people who are undecided are using these debates to really push them to who they’re gonna vote for, which quite frankly would be… It would be scary to me if people are using these debates to decide who they’re gonna vote for but it almost just seems pointless at this point.

0:15:00.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I’m mostly with you. And I think partly pointless, because of the style and rhetoric of both Trump and Harris in the debate. I heard, I didn’t watch the VP debate, but I heard that it was more…

0:15:17.3 Jordan Syatt: It was actually really good.

0:15:18.5 Mike Vacanti: More productive and more like policy and more like traditional, courteous.

0:15:24.9 Jordan Syatt: Yes, they shook hands and they were like, it was great.

0:15:27.4 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. And, and I don’t know if something like that, because again, I didn’t listen to it, but I don’t know if the policy discussion in there was enough where it’s not just purely us against them, but like you could I don’t know, learn something about the candidate’s policy that would sway you one way or the other, versus just zingers in one liners and like, she owned him, he owned her type of stuff. But…

0:15:49.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, I will say the VP debate, it was almost wholesome in how well, how professional they were, how they did… They legitimately answered the questions that were asked. But that was, I haven’t seen that in my whole adult life.

0:16:09.0 Mike Vacanti: Well, you didn’t watch a debate before 2016 probably.

0:16:12.3 Jordan Syatt: But that’s what I mean, like that was my adult life. It’s like 2016, I was…

0:16:18.3 Mike Vacanti: Oh yeah. I guess 2012, you were only 19.

0:16:20.2 Jordan Syatt: Correct. Yeah. So yeah man, it was like my entire adult life, that was the first time I’ve actually seen them answering questions. And I was like, man, both of these guys are doing a standup classy job during that debate. I actually really enjoyed it for the VP. So yeah.

0:16:41.1 Mike Vacanti: Brother, we have a Black Friday sale on the horizon for the fitness business mentorship. Do you have any thoughts on that subject?

0:16:51.9 Jordan Syatt: Bro, do I have any thoughts? Are you kidding me? I have so many thoughts. So… [laughter]

0:16:57.2 Mike Vacanti: Let’s hear them. Let’s hear them, Donald.

0:17:00.2 Jordan Syatt: Listen, here’s the deal. If you want to build your online fitness business, and you want to help people all over the world, whether they’re in your town or in another country, and you want to help them improve their relationship with food, if you want to get them strength training, if you want to get them healthier, improve their blood work, if you wanna actually educate them and have an impact on them while also being able to build your own business that supports your family, that supports your community, and if we’re really talking about having an impact on the world, and taking control over what you have control over, this is it, right? It’s like your clients can take control of their health and you, I’m assuming you’re a coach, like you’ve already taken control of your health, but you now you can take control of your business, and you can help more people improve their health and reach more people all over the world, if you want help with improving your social media, if you want help with getting more clients, if you want help understanding client psychology, if you want help understanding program design, if you wanna be a part of an amazing community of other coaches who also have this same goal.

0:18:09.2 Jordan Syatt: And by the way, many of them go about it in different ways. We have some coaches who are literally just starting coaching in the mentorship, and we have other coaches who’ve been doing this for 10, 15 years. We have some coaches who only do nutrition coaching. We have some coaches who only do strength training.

0:18:25.0 Jordan Syatt: We have some coaches who are more cardio focused. We have some coaches who do it all. We have some coaches who are more plant-based. We have some coaches… I don’t think we have any that are carnivore based, but like we have coaches from all walks… From every corner of the fitness industry or almost every corner of the fitness industry. And the thing that brings them all together is we all want to actually in a positive way, help people, help the world, help the community, and build a business that you can be proud of and have great work life balance with. And so, if you want to be a part of that, this is your best opportunity. This is your best chance. The price will never be better than it is right now. It will only go up.

0:19:06.3 Jordan Syatt: And so we would love to have you in there. And every time we do it, every time we do one of these launches, people will wait and they’ll wait and they’ll wait. And then the launch will be over. And they’ll be like, oh, wait, can I get in? And we’re like, no. ’cause we gave you a lot of notice. So, if you want to join the online fitness business mentorship now is your chance. Keep it locked in. We’ll let you know, but make sure you’re listening. If you’re, I’m not on our email list. Get on our email list. The link is in the show notes. We have a free guide that you’ll get as soon as you sign up. But get on the email list so we can email you and let you know when the sale goes live. Do not hesitate. Do not miss out on this. You’re welcome to join at a later date, but the price will be higher. That’s just how it works. So we would love to have you in there. Huge thank you to everyone who’s been a member of the mentorship for, we have people who’ve been in there for four or five years now, and we have people who’ve only recently joined. And so we appreciate all of you. And so anyone who will be new this time around, we’re excited to have you in there. Yeah.

0:20:00.4 Mike Vacanti: And that very well said, Jordan. The dates are to be determined, but around the week of Thanksgiving. So, late November, Black Friday, Cyber Monday. And it’s not gonna be a long sale. This won’t be open for three weeks. It’ll probably be about a week, maybe 10 days max. So, when you see that first email come through, be ready. Should we fire up some questions?

0:20:23.3 Jordan Syatt: “How do I know when to eat the donut work at work and when to pass on the donut at work?”

0:20:28.4 Mike Vacanti: You wanna start with this one?

0:20:29.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Here’s an important consideration and keep in mind, we wrote the book called, ‘Eat It!’ So we’re very pro being able to eat it. The distinction here is you are always allowed to eat it, but you don’t always have to choose to eat it. It’s never not allowed. It’s never something that you should shame yourself or guilt yourself for. But there is a time and a place in which you can make the decision that it is not conducive to your goals to eat that donut or whatever food it is. And so, if you are, let’s just use the example of someone who’s very overweight and their blood work is not healthy, their blood pressure is not healthy. You’re on a lot of medications, you’re pre-diabetic, and you are not being consistent with your calories. Well, there’s a really… You could still eat the donut if you want to, like you’re allowed to have it. But is that conducive in this moment to getting you to what I imagine is your priority of healthier?

0:21:49.1 Jordan Syatt: And that doesn’t mean you can’t eat it ever, but it means in this moment right now, and I can even use a different example, right? Like let’s, let’s use a different, like exercise example. I can max effort deadlift right now. I could absolutely do that. It’s not off limits. It’s not like I’m not allowed to. But if I’m trying to go for… My priority right now, which is the splits, does it make the most sense to prioritize max effort deadlifts in my programming? No. Can I do it? Sure, absolutely. But would it make the most sense to do it at this point? No, it doesn’t. So, I’m not, and if I want to, sure. If I wanna have a random day, I did it a couple weeks ago just to show people that I can still deadlift like three times my body weight.

0:22:37.7 Jordan Syatt: I did… 9:00 PM I just went in deadlifted 315, like whatever. No big deal. But it’s not a huge part of my program. So, same thing with this. You are allowed to have it whenever you want because you’re an adult and you’re free and you can do it guilt free if you’d like to. But let’s look at your goals. Is it conducive to your goals right now? The only person who can decide that is you? But you can, you have to be objective with it. And if you are objectively trying to improve your health and you’re objectively trying to lose body fat and you’re objectively trying to get out of pre-diabetes or type 2 diabetes, well then you’re going to have to make changes. And some of those changes might be not eating the donut right now. That’s it. And that’s okay.

0:23:27.7 Mike Vacanti: That’s a great answer. For any of my math nerds, Jordan meant two times his… Jordan doesn’t weigh a hundred pounds.

0:23:32.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah, sorry.

0:23:33.4 Mike Vacanti: 315 is two to…

0:23:34.9 Jordan Syatt: Sorry.

0:23:35.5 Mike Vacanti: But no, that’s alright. I think that was all…

0:23:36.8 Jordan Syatt: But I can still deadlift triple body weight, just so you know.

0:23:39.6 Mike Vacanti: Correct.

0:23:39.9 Jordan Syatt: I can still… 315 came up fast, but that wasn’t, that wasn’t triple.

0:23:42.2 Mike Vacanti: That wasn’t your max. Yeah, we, I think we talked about that. That the level of like impressed by your audience at 315 verse 405 wouldn’t justify the level of effort for you between 315 and 405.

0:23:52.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:23:55.9 Mike Vacanti: It’s a great answer. It’s a really important concept that food doesn’t have a moral value and that you always can eat something. It doesn’t mean you’re a bad person and it doesn’t mean it’s gonna completely derail your progress or your goals because you ate 300 calories worth of donut versus 300 calories worth of sweet potato and grilled chicken or whatever. Especially for people who have some serious hangups when it comes to obsession around clean eating and there being categories of good and bad foods. Breaking that mindset by having some frequency of “unclean foods”, donuts, cookies, ultra processed, delicious foods is a good thing in moderation. A shorter way or another way to answer the question for someone who maybe currently has a fitness goal is, does it fit your day?

0:24:56.8 Mike Vacanti: Okay, donuts, probably 250 cals. Can I make that work today or can’t I make that work? Maybe it’s 4:30 PM and there’s a surprise birthday party for Sally down in human resources and there’s donuts. But you’ve already, you already did Mexican for lunch because it’s Friday and you and the team went out and you know, it’s Friday. So, you also took a couple extra pieces of candy from the snack drawer and you’re pretty close to your limit for the day. You have dinner plans and you only have 500 calories for dinner and you wanna be consistent because you have been for a while. You’re trying to lose body fat. You wanna hit that calorie range or your macros or whatever you’re tracking. And so, you have a plan for the day and then the donuts pop up and you’re like, Ugh, I’m not even that hungry.

0:25:40.8 Mike Vacanti: I really want to continue to be on plan. Everyone else is eating them and it would be delicious and it looks really good, so I want to, but today I’m going to pass. Versus maybe it’s a Wednesday morning. All you’ve had for the day is a cup of coffee and a protein shake. And so you’re at 40 protein, 200 cals, got some caffeine in you, you were gonna have a banana and maybe some fruit, but oh, there’s donuts available? Maybe I’ll skip the fruit for breakfast today. I’ll have the donut for my carbs instead. Some extra fats…

0:26:13.4 Jordan Syatt: Grab a French Cruller.

0:26:16.2 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Hey, maybe a croissant with some chocolate in there. Maybe. I mean, personally I would go with like a chocolate frosted donut with custard on the inside. That would be my go-to option in that situation.

0:26:28.3 Jordan Syatt: Interesting.

0:26:30.7 Mike Vacanti: Correct. Is what you meant to say. Not interesting. Correct. [laughter] We’re all allowed. Hey, if you like Maple Long Johns and I like custard Bismarks, like that’s great. We can all get along.

0:26:45.7 Jordan Syatt: Have you had a French Cruller.

0:26:47.5 Mike Vacanti: Bro. I didn’t even know that was a real word when you said it. I thought you were just making things up.

0:26:53.6 Jordan Syatt: Bro. The French Cruller is an amazing donut. It’s also, not only is it amazing and delicious, it’s also like one of the most like calorie friendly donuts you can have, which is crazy because it’s one of the most delicious ones available.

0:27:07.4 Mike Vacanti: This looks like a European delicacy. I don’t know if Jordan knows what kinda donuts show up at the corp. You… I’ve put in my time in corporate America. I know what the options are. I’ve never seen this French Cruller. It does look great. It looks like a glazed donut…

0:27:22.0 Jordan Syatt: It’s incredible. Yeah.

0:27:23.9 Mike Vacanti: With… But it’s very flaky and it actually looks…

0:27:26.8 Jordan Syatt: It’s got…

0:27:27.3 Mike Vacanti: It looks like the opposite of those dense cake.

0:27:31.4 Jordan Syatt: Yes.

0:27:32.3 Mike Vacanti: Those like old fashioned cake donuts.

0:27:33.0 Jordan Syatt: Yes.

0:27:34.6 Mike Vacanti: It looks like the opposite of that.

0:27:34.7 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And I actually do love a good old fashion as well, but good old fashioned with some hot black coffee, but the French Cruller is wildly good. I think you’d love the French Cruller.

0:27:45.3 Mike Vacanti: I bet I would. Five fat 17 carb. Is that real?

0:27:49.1 Jordan Syatt: That’s what I’m saying, dude. That’s what I am saying. That’s what I’m saying. Correct.

0:27:56.4 Mike Vacanti: Jordan’s so dialed that even when he’s eating donuts, he’s eating 115 calorie donuts and just…

0:28:02.8 Jordan Syatt: Dialed. Yeah.

0:28:04.1 Mike Vacanti: Good question.

0:28:05.1 Jordan Syatt: “This is so trivial. But if you fry a tortilla, which might be good ’cause you were just talking about Mexican food, this is so trivial, but if you fry a tortilla, how do you track how much oil you’re eating?”

0:28:17.4 Mike Vacanti: That’s a really good question. So when you’re using oils to cook things, you’re gonna have to estimate how much of the oil you’re actually consuming. And I would err on the side of you’re consuming more than you think you are. Think about the absorption of the food that you are cooking. So a tortilla is going to absorb the majority of the oil that you’re cooking. I mean…

0:28:49.3 Jordan Syatt: Correct.

0:28:49.9 Mike Vacanti: Unless you’re putting cups of oil in there, but a tortilla can absorb oil. Whereas if you’re cooking… If you’re frying chicken in a pan with oil, what you can do is, let’s say you put two tablespoons of oil in the pan and then you cook your couple of chicken breasts, and then when you’re done cooking them, you take it out off the pan and you see that there’s still maybe a tablespoon of oil still in the pan. You can estimate. Okay, one tablespoon of oil is what I’m actually consuming with these chicken breasts. With a tortilla, I would imagine the majority of the oil is getting absorbed into the tortilla. Not to mention, how often do we overestimate the amount of oil we’re consuming compared to how often we underestimate the amount of oil we consume? Like air on the side of tracking more oil than what you’re actually eating is going to be better for your progress.

0:29:45.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. It… I completely agree. If it’s the tortilla I’m tracking like all the oil, like it’s just a hundred percent of the calories from the oil. If it’s chicken, I usually do like 50%, like chicken, salmon, like I’ll do 50% of the oil that’s used. But something that’s essentially a sponge like a tortilla. However much oil I’m using, that’s the… That’s how many calories I’m having.

0:30:10.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah.

0:30:11.1 Jordan Syatt: “Recently threw my back out. Do you have any tips to stay positive and moving?”

0:30:16.2 Mike Vacanti: Not fun. Not fun at all. Tips to stay positive and moving.

0:30:25.7 Jordan Syatt: We both have experience with this, so…

0:30:26.6 Mike Vacanti: Yep. The tips around staying positive are…

0:30:33.7 Jordan Syatt: Wait, can you tell the story of when you threw your back out before we went to Mind Pump?

0:30:39.1 Mike Vacanti: Dude I don’t think I’ve told that story.

0:30:39.9 Jordan Syatt: Alright. We got… [laughter] You gotta tell this story. This is incredible.

0:30:45.2 Mike Vacanti: Dude. I don’t even remember that Well, what happened.

0:30:48.3 Jordan Syatt: I remember it. You wanna…

0:30:49.5 Mike Vacanti: No you don’t… But there was… Oh, oh, okay. Yeah, let’s tell it. But now I remember why we didn’t tell it.

0:30:56.7 Jordan Syatt: Why?

0:30:57.2 Mike Vacanti: Here’s what I’ll say. I was doing for the first time ever, a lot of loaded lumbar flexion and extension. And I was doing that for a few weeks consecutively, and I’d never done that in my entire life. I was always a big core stability.

[overlapping conversation]

0:31:17.8 Mike Vacanti: Valsalva, like, fill up this cylinder with air and squeeze my abs as hard as I can. And that had prevented me from low back pain or injury for a really long time. And I was experimenting with this new school of thought that some are big fans of and some aren’t of loading your lumbar spine through a range of motion. And so, I had been doing that for a couple of weeks and it was feeling interesting. It was feeling interesting. And basically I was warming up at the gym. Literally warming up. Okay, Like I did my full body warmup and then my A one was Bulgarian split squat and I did 10 body weight reps. And on a day like this, and on most days I’m going to do like four or five warmup sets of that first move. So I had 15, I was probably working up to, I don’t know, seventies or 60 fives or something. I had 15 pounds in each hand. And on my fourth rep of Bulgarian split squat with 15 pounds in each hand, I felt an electric shock across the bottom of my, [laughter] across like my, where my hips are at, basically both to the left and right side. I dropped the weights, I fell to the ground mid rep, Jordan’s laughing. It’s been enough time, but I’m pretty sure you laughed at this in conversation and I got pissed.

0:32:48.4 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. You are not happy with me.

0:32:50.6 Mike Vacanti: I laid there on the… I thought I was paralyzed, dude. I didn’t know if I could move. I like… I was laying on my side and then I… For prob…

0:33:00.1 Jordan Syatt: In the gym.

0:33:02.6 Mike Vacanti: Probably five minutes before I even attempted to move.

0:33:06.9 Jordan Syatt: And no one even said anything.

0:33:07.7 Mike Vacanti: No one said a thing. This was, I’m telling you, Minnesota people are… People are…

0:33:10.5 Jordan Syatt: People are like right next to you. And no one said a word.

0:33:13.0 Mike Vacanti: Stepping over me, like. Yeah.

[laughter]

0:33:19.9 Mike Vacanti: And in fairness, I do weird stuff in the gym. So I always superset abs with legs. So who knows if maybe, [laughter] like I’m laying on…

0:33:27.9 Jordan Syatt: Like these guys do. [laughter]

0:33:28.9 Mike Vacanti: I had a guy at the gym one time an employee come up to me because I was doing an ab move on the ground and he was like, “Hey man, we have mats you know.” And, but I told… I was like, I actually hate mats for ab work because similar to the force transfer concept and why you don’t wear like cushiony sneakers when you’re doing lower body training, if I’m doing specific abdominal moves, I don’t want a half or a three-quarter inch soft mat under me. It feels better to do it on harder floor. Anyway, I’m laying on the ground, [chuckle] I’m like, I don’t know if I can walk. And this was the day before we’re flying to California for the Mind Pump podcast. And…

0:34:14.7 Jordan Syatt: And the day before your birthday.

0:34:15.9 Mike Vacanti: Yeah, it was April 7th, 2024. And so, I stand up, [laughter] by the grace of God, like I use my hands to get myself to a seated position. I grab onto the bench to my, get myself to a kneeling position and I get one foot up and then I get the other foot up and then I slowly like, hands on the bench stand up and my body is like those very sad 95 year olds whose spines are completely S-shaped essentially. This is not funny, Jordan, this is not funny. My upper body is probably a solid foot to the right of where my hips and my legs are, and I’m leaning completely to the side. And I turn to this guy who’s at the bench next to me. I was like, “Hey bro, this is ridiculous, but could you please put away my 15 pound weights ’cause I just threw my back out and I can’t.” And he’s like, “Oh man, that sucks. Feel better!” And he like grabs them and puts them away.

[laughter]

0:35:22.5 Mike Vacanti: And I take these three inch steps and shuffle my way out of the gym to the car. I’ll never forget hitting like any bump in the road on the way home, felt like my spine was about to explode. I got home when I got in the door, I dropped to my knees, I crawled up the stairs, crawled across the floor, crawled into my bed where I didn’t move for man, was it really the next day? It was the next day that we flew to Cal… Or was it two days after?

0:36:00.0 Jordan Syatt: It was either one day. Oh no I think it was…

0:36:02.4 Mike Vacanti: I think it was two days before, because I…

0:36:04.0 Jordan Syatt: It was two days.

0:36:04.2 Mike Vacanti: Because I didn’t move for 24 hours. My wife was like…

0:36:06.3 Jordan Syatt: You got a walker… Or a cane.

0:36:08.3 Mike Vacanti: Waiting on me hand and foot. I didn’t use it though.

[laughter]

0:36:14.1 Jordan Syatt: You used your luggage bag.

0:36:15.3 Mike Vacanti: This is… I forgot how good of a story this was. So, I lay in bed for 24 hours before I even try to move. And then was doing these strategies of like you know, I’m watching these different physical therapists on YouTube trying to get any kind of movement in there, trying to self-diagnose. ‘Cause I told you and you were basically like, “all right, well we’re flying to California tomorrow, so figure it out because this ain’t getting rescheduled.” [laughter] And so, I’m doing these baby like laying on my stomach and then trying to get up to my hands, getting like five degrees of extension in my low back and then trying to work that range up. I got heat, I got ice. My sister who has a history with back issues had some like leftover muscle relaxers and a couple of pain pills and I’d never taken a muscle relaxer before, so I was like, I don’t wanna mess with that. But there were three doses of pain pills. So, I took one hot shower, Biofreeze, just throwing everything at my back to get it functioning to a place where I could get on an airplane, you know.

0:37:30.0 Mike Vacanti: My dad was like, “I can fly with you and like help you with your luggage.” I was like, dad I love you…

0:37:35.1 Jordan Syatt: You didn’t tell me that.

0:37:36.7 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. I was like, you’re the best. But that would be the softest thing ever to have you carrying my bag through the… ” I just couldn’t picture myself doing. My ego wouldn’t let it happen. But he went to my grandmas and got this cane and brought it over for me. I was like, thank you so much. And yeah, the day of the flight, I took a 40 minute hot shower. I took the pain pill, I took Advil. I was trying to stay really hydrated, which I think helped some. I had those Biofreeze patches all over my back and made it work, and was carrying… So yeah, I was walking through the airport, holding the cane in one hand, but not using it, and just like limping and just grinding through pain. And I got very competitive with the other people in the airport. I was like, I bet I can walk faster than that guy. And I’m not gonna use my cane. And so got there, repeated the same thing. It felt a little… So day by day it felt slightly better, slightly more range. But I was like, I’m not telling these Sal and Justin and Adam, like, Doug, I’m not gonna go in there and be like, Hey guys, I just threw my back out. We’re here talking about how to be a great personal trainer. I’m like, bent inwards.

0:38:46.3 Jordan Syatt: Just walking with your cane.

0:38:47.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. So we didn’t say anything and no one…

0:38:52.4 Jordan Syatt: No one noticed.

0:38:53.2 Mike Vacanti: I got away with it. I got away with it, and it started to feel gradually better. But that’s the story. And…

0:39:00.4 Jordan Syatt: It’s a great story, dude.

0:39:02.4 Mike Vacanti: And yeah, my loaded spinal work doesn’t work for me.

0:39:10.5 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Yeah. We learned that.

[laughter]

0:39:14.7 Mike Vacanti: Did we ever. [laughter]

0:39:15.4 Jordan Syatt: We learned that. [laughter]

0:39:17.6 Mike Vacanti: However…

0:39:18.6 Jordan Syatt: Mike’s spine likes to stay exactly where it is. [laughter]

0:39:21.0 Mike Vacanti: No, well, not my thoracic spine and not my cervical spine.

0:39:25.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. No, I just mean your lumbar.

0:39:27.4 Mike Vacanti: But yeah. And even body weight, I love a nice, taking it through a range of body weight, but loading it, my vertebrae are like, no, we’re not about this life. On the mental side of coming back from back pain.

0:39:47.6 Jordan Syatt: Brutal.

0:39:48.3 Mike Vacanti: Knowing that there’s light at the end of the tunnel and knowing that this too shall pass, and that it’s temporary is really important and really beneficial. For most back pain, you’re limited in exercise selection, but there are still things you can do. You can do a seated dumbbell lateral raise with your back supported. You can do… Not the day after you heard it, but maybe 10 days after. You can do a seated bicep curl. You can do various lower body machines, potentially like a leg extension. There are exercises you can do, where you will start with a lower weight, where you will be relatively pain-free, and you can train around the injury. You’ve been seeing a physical therapist for your back injury. I saw a physical therapist for eight weeks after this. Did I go for that long? Six weeks or eight weeks. And…

0:40:53.1 Jordan Syatt: You’ve been doing all the exercises daily, regardless though.

0:40:55.0 Mike Vacanti: I’ve continued to do them every day and my low back has never felt better, which is almost just stupid. I should have been, yeah, doing that consistently all along. Yeah, knowing that there is light at the end of the tunnel, training around it is good. Especially for someone who likes working out, that’s part of why it’s so demotivating to have any kind of injury, but especially back pain, is because it limits you from doing what makes you feel good. So, getting yourself in the mindset of doing what you can, and focusing on that and focusing on making progress on the things that you can do while simultaneously treating, getting out of pain like your workout. If your goal was to lose 20 pounds of fat, your new top goal is to get out of back pain. And that might mean doing various exercises, three times a day, various stretches, that might mean going to physical therapy multiple times a week, whatever that is, treat that as your primary goal, because then once you’ve reduced the amount of pain that you’re in, then you can get back to doing what you want to be doing.

0:42:01.3 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Completely agree.

0:42:03.0 Mike Vacanti: It would be funny at some point to get the footage from the gym.

0:42:07.8 Jordan Syatt: Oh my gosh.

0:42:08.3 Mike Vacanti: ‘Cause when I tell you that I thought I was paralyzed, and the weight, I didn’t drop the weight, the weight just dropped, and my body fell to the ground, and just thud. And I laid there wondering if I was ever gonna be able to walk again. It was unlike any pain I had ever experienced.

0:42:29.9 Jordan Syatt: And there were people near you.

0:42:30.0 Mike Vacanti: There were people all over. Yeah.

0:42:32.0 Jordan Syatt: That would be, and like from a comedic perspective, watch and knowing that you’re fine now and better than you’ve ever been back wise, that makes it even more funny. If you were actually paralyzed, it would not be funny. But watching you just fall, hit the ground and seeing all these other people, probably some who looked and then just decided not to do anything, this would be incredible footage. Like this would be remarkable footage.

0:43:04.9 Mike Vacanti: You know what? I don’t even fault them. In hindsight, the fact that I was basically not holding any weight and threw my back out, basically not doing anything, I might have let me lay there too.

0:43:16.4 Jordan Syatt: No, no, no, no, ’cause they don’t know that it’s your back. You could have had a stroke. You could have had a heart attack, you could have had a… There could have been so many other things going on. If someone’s in a gym and they hit the floor, you go over immediately.

0:43:29.6 Mike Vacanti: Correct.

0:43:30.2 Jordan Syatt: I don’t care where you are. In gym or not, someone hits the floor, you fucking go over. That footage would be priceless to have.

0:43:39.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. All right. Next question.

0:43:43.3 Jordan Syatt: “I’ve just started my online coaching business, and I am scared and excited. Any tips for a newbie?”

0:43:51.3 Mike Vacanti: I’ll say one quick thing, and I’ll let Jordan start with this one. The combination of fear and excitement is like jet fuel. That’s exactly what you want to be feeling when starting a business. That’s the nerves that a pro athlete feels before an important game or a big fight. Or like, those nerves are going to propel you to be able to work long hours, and work very hard and do what it takes to grow this business. And so what you’re feeling right now is normal, and gonna be beneficial for you.

0:44:28.8 Jordan Syatt: Love that. Only thing I’ll add to that is if we can get you a little bit angry, I think that’s the cocktail right there. We need a little bit of anger or a lot of anger, but get a chip on your shoulder. Make people, even if you have to make it up in your head, maybe people don’t believe that you can do it, prove them wrong. Maybe you’re angry that people are struggling so much, and you’ve gotta come in here and you gotta fix it for them, because all the other coaches online suck, and you’ve gotta make a difference. You’ve gotta get a little bit of anger, I think. That can really… That’ll really keep you up at night. That’ll really like, help you burn the midnight oil. Get pissed, get really angry and excited and nervous. Now you’ve got that chest that’s like the…

0:45:17.9 Mike Vacanti: Jet fuel.

0:45:18.0 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Jet fuel right there.

0:45:20.3 Mike Vacanti: That is the combination that worked for us. And that is the combination…

0:45:24.3 Jordan Syatt: It’s the combination.

0:45:25.5 Mike Vacanti: It’s the combination, I see that works for others.

0:45:28.1 Jordan Syatt: We need to bring anger back.

0:45:30.6 Mike Vacanti: I’m trying to think of people who have done it very successfully without that anger.

0:45:35.7 Jordan Syatt: I don’t know anyone. I don’t know a single person who’s done it without anger.

0:45:39.9 Mike Vacanti: There are definitely people who have done it with more love of the game than anger.

0:45:44.2 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. But anger’s still a part of it. You don’t need… There’s not like a definitive amount of anger. It doesn’t have to be like 70%. Like you could have 10% anger, but there’s gotta be some anger that really drives you. And the anger could be, I’m tired of all the horse shit that I see out there, and how all the terrible advice and I need to be a fire hose to put that shit out. Like, that might be where your anger comes from. It doesn’t have to necessarily be a chip on the shoulder. It doesn’t have to be to shoot to prove anyone wrong. It might just be to help people. But there’s gotta be a little bit of anger to really drive, ’cause I think that anger is what’s gonna help when you’re like, Ugh, I just don’t wanna make content today. Ugh, I just don’t wanna do… It’s like, no, I’m, I’m angry enough to where it’s like, I’ve gotta do it. I’ve just gotta do it, you know?

0:46:30.6 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. Yeah. You make a great point. And in this day and age, you’ll see people making fun. Like haters were a big thing in 2010 through 2017.

0:46:42.6 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Big thing.

0:46:43.3 Mike Vacanti: And now people clown on people who think they have haters, but even if you don’t, pretending that you had haters was amazing.

0:46:52.0 Jordan Syatt: Ugh, dude.

0:46:55.3 Mike Vacanti: When you don’t wanna do something and know you need to do it to push yourself over the edge, yeah. Jet fuel, dude.

0:47:02.5 Jordan Syatt: Dude, 2010 to 2014 was like hater central. You’re like, “fuck the haters.” [laughter] And meanwhile, no one’s hating.

[laughter]

0:47:14.7 Mike Vacanti: No one’s hating on you ’cause you don’t really have an audience when you’re just getting started, so that’s kinda why, but I fully disagree. Like all these people who are like, you don’t have any haters. There are way more haters in 2024 than there were in 2010. I’ll give you an example. I googled something the other day, because I was… There was someone in the industry who I won’t name ’cause I’m learning from Jordan.

0:47:40.5 Jordan Syatt: Let’s go.

0:47:41.8 Mike Vacanti: Who was going through something that I heard on a podcast, and I was like, oh man. And I was curious about it. And so I googled this person’s name and it auto completed for this person’s name, Reddit.

0:47:52.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, please.

0:47:53.2 Mike Vacanti: And I clicked it. I already told you the story.

0:47:55.1 Jordan Syatt: I know. I know where you’re going.

0:47:56.4 Mike Vacanti: And I told you, I was like, yeah, dude on the Gymshark thread on Reddit, there was a thing about this guy, and this person is… Are you getting robbed? Is there someone outside your house?

0:48:09.2 Jordan Syatt: There’s someone outside my door, there’s like a car that just pulled up.

0:48:11.3 Mike Vacanti: Okay. We’ll pause. Hold up.

0:48:12.8 Jordan Syatt: No, no. It’s okay, it’s okay. It looks like an Amazon person.

0:48:14.4 Mike Vacanti: No, I wanna make sure you’re not getting invaded. Yeah, that happens.

[laughter]

0:48:18.0 Jordan Syatt: You get so mad when I’m looking out the window. [laughter] All right, keep going.

0:48:21.1 Mike Vacanti: I don’t get mad at all. I’m just, you talk to the audience. I talk to you. ESTP versus…

0:48:26.4 Jordan Syatt: I’m listening. I’m listening.

0:48:27.2 Mike Vacanti: I’m just, I was being respectful. What if you were getting robbed? I’d be just as bad as the guy in the gym who was… All right. I click on the what I think is the Gymshark Reddit for this guy to… ‘Cause it was like, is so and so. Okay. And there’s all this gossip in there. And I was like, oh, this is kind of weird. But I didn’t get my answer and I clicked out of it. And I told you about it. I was like, yeah, the Gymshark thread had all this like information and you’re like, gymsnark? And I was like, what? You’re like, yeah. Was it gymsnark? ‘Cause that’s where there’s a lot of gossip and people talking. I was like, oh, like that makes sense. I thought they were… It was just ’cause Gymshark. So my point being, in 2024, like if you look at comment sections, if you look at the amount of cynicism and negativity and like punching up, of course.

0:49:20.5 Jordan Syatt: There are more.

0:49:21.1 Mike Vacanti: There are hater… There is so much hate out there.

0:49:22.0 Jordan Syatt: Especially with like the, this people can stitch videos of your stuff. There’s way more haters now for sure.

0:49:28.3 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. When people are like, oh, you don’t have any haters. It’s like people absolutely do have lots of haters. There’s a lot of people sitting at home who don’t do anything, and all they do is hate. And so, is it beneficial to think about those people?

0:49:43.2 Jordan Syatt: Yes.

0:49:44.5 Mike Vacanti: Maybe, maybe not. But what I will say is, in 2013 when I was thinking about people who worked at my previous accounting job, who were talking crap about On The Regimen… that printed money, that printed content, that printed like… I don’t know what else to say. It’s not a good look to say that now, but…

0:50:06.5 Jordan Syatt: It’s true.

0:50:07.1 Mike Vacanti: It was like, okay, watch this. Like, oh, you think my blog sucks? Watch this. Oh, you think this is just some nobody thing? And it’s petty, and it’s a little small minded and like, might show where your head is at, but it works.

0:50:20.4 Jordan Syatt: It works.

0:50:20.9 Mike Vacanti: Which is why Jordan said, even if you have to make it up and go with the Michael Jordan route, like, “Oh, he said, good game Mike. I’m gonna get him in the next game.” And then they interviewed him later. He is like, yeah, he didn’t say that. “I just made it up to piss myself off to make me work harder.”

0:50:34.1 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. Dude, some of my like real motivations early on were, when I started making content and all these established coaches were like, “What are you doing? You’re too young, dah dah, dah, dah.” And I was like, “Oh, I’m too young? I’m a better coach than you are, motherfucker. Watch this. Oh, you wrote this article? I’m gonna write a better article. I’m gonna make a better video.” And all these… All the other coaches were like, you’re too young. You’re too young. And that was like my big motivation when I was getting in the industry. So, get angry and prove them wrong. Even if they don’t exist, prove them wrong.

0:51:10.5 Mike Vacanti: Yeah. [laughter] Wanna do one more quick one.

0:51:14.9 Jordan Syatt: “What do you think is the first and easiest step in weight loss journey for someone obese?” What is the first and easiest step for someone like who’s just starting their weight loss journey, who has a lot of weight to lose? What do you think the first thing they should do is?

0:51:30.9 Mike Vacanti: The first thing that I would have them do is not the easiest thing.

0:51:34.3 Jordan Syatt: Oh, interesting.

0:51:35.5 Mike Vacanti: And we talked about this on a mentorship Q&A recently about the difference in coaching philosophy between having someone focus on one very small habit, spend a lot of time mastering that habit before moving on to the next habit, versus changing multiple things at the same time, because someone who starts coaching is usually highly motivated, ready to get after it can handle that level of change. The first thing that I’m gonna have, most people who come to me who are obese and wanna lose weight do, is track their calories and try to be in a calorie deficit, because that is the most important needle to move. That’s gonna be the most important factor in helping them lose body fat as 99% of us listening know. That is not the easiest thing. I could say eat one piece of vegetables per day. I could say, make sure you drink at least 16 ounces of water before noon each day. I could give the per… I could say, make sure you get at least 2000 steps per day. I could say something that would be beneficial that is significantly less beneficial than eating in a calorie deficit, but that would be easier for that person to do, but I’m not focused on what’s easiest. I’m focused on what is easy enough that you will do and actually makes a big difference in helping you achieve the goals that you’ve come to me saying that you wanna achieve.

0:53:09.9 Jordan Syatt: Yeah. I like that. I would say the differentiation is, you don’t always wanna give them what’s easiest. You do wanna give them one of the most simple things. Like you wanna give them something that’s very simple and straightforward, which isn’t necessarily easy. Like it’s very simple. We’re gonna count your calories. Now that there’s a lot to learn within that, and it’s not easy, and you might not enjoy it. In fact, I can almost guarantee you’re not gonna enjoy it, but you’re gonna count your calories. Or I would… I have two options. I would either count calories or the first thing I would say is you’re gonna start walking, but it’s like you’re gonna walk and like, you’re gonna be sore. And I think it’s not like, I’m not saying you’re walking 17 miles a day, but you’re gonna go from walking 400 steps a day to like 2,500 steps per day.

0:54:06.1 Jordan Syatt: And like, especially if you have a lot of weight to lose, that’s tough. That’s really tough and you’re gonna have to put a lot of effort into that. And I would probably give them the choice. It’s like, you can choose. You’re either gonna count your calories, or you’re gonna walk, and you get to choose. It gives them a little bit of agency, and they could say like, all right, cool. I’m making this decision for myself. What I like about the walking is often, like, I don’t think I’ve ever had someone who chose walking that didn’t also improve their nutrition. I’ve never had someone start exercising and not also improve their… Sometimes just starting with exercise is enough to where they’re like, all right, well it’s now worth it for me to improve my nutrition. This was a big unlock with Gary, where it’s like he… There was a point where he was starting to miss some workouts and then his nutrition went to shit now.

0:54:53.1 Mike Vacanti: And we realized like, hey, if you just come in and do like one set, your nutrition is better the rest of the day, ’cause now all of a sudden it’s worth it to you. So I like, I wouldn’t give them so little walking that is easy, but it is very simple. And I also feel like if it’s easy, if it’s so easy that they don’t even feel challenged by it, then it doesn’t feel like an accomplishment. So, it has to be difficult enough to where they feel accomplished for doing it, but simple enough to where they know they can do it. It’s like there there’s this level of simplicity and difficulty that have to be meshed together to feel accomplished and also able to do it. So, that’s where I would do that.

0:55:41.4 Mike Vacanti: Amazing. Thank you very much for listening. Great episode. We’ll be back next Tuesday. Jump on our email list. We’re not gonna spam you. We will send you an awesome free guide, and then give updates about when we have sales for the mentorship.

0:55:56.7 Jordan Syatt: We’re literally only gonna send you emails when we have sales for that. That’s literally it. So, if you wanna know when the sale is coming, and you wanna join the mentorship, so you can build an incredible business that supports you and your family and your loved ones and charities that you wanna support, and also allows you to help people all over the world, sign up. This is it. Don’t wait. Get on the email list and we’ll let you know when you can join.